TRP: Trinity River Tollway | V2.0

[Mballar]

^ Not only did the politicians lie, the Dallas Morning News was a willing participant in the coverup. I think this article is an attempt to wash their hands of their involvement. I believe there were a series of editorials that were directed at bashing the vocal opponents of the toll road.

Who are the idiots who voted for this thing in 2007? Where are they now?

The tollway was never going to be built. The handwriting was on the wall in 2007. . .even the proponents knew that. I'm not so concerned that the '07 referendum was defeated, because we knew the tollway was dead in the water, either way. What concerns me now, is what appears to be a total disregard for the lakes and other amenities promised through the 1998 bond package. I'd like to know:

1. What is Rebecca Dugger (Director of the Trinity River Corridor Project) doing over there at City Hall? . . and under who's direction?

2. Where's the bond money?

3. How much bond money is left over?

4. How much has been spent on the Tollway?

5. When is construction on the lakes going to begin?

These are the questions I think need to be asked.

I encourage everyone here to ask Ms. Dugger these questions here: http://www.trinityrivercorridor.com/forms/trinity.htm

Obviously, the timelines established for completion of the Trinity River Project elements are all shot to hell. (See http://www.trinityrivercorridor.com/...rtunities.html)

[cowboyeagle05]

Just as a refresher here is a comparison of the rendering NTTA put out a long time ago showing the freeway with lots of pretty landscaping which was later described that the root systems would make the levees unstable so it wouldn't look anything like the rendering.

Knowing that back then I took the rendering into Photoshop and corrected the rendering to be more honest based on the debate.

Remember I did this back when Tollways still required Tollbooths on tollways so I photoshopped tollbooths into the drawing. Now they would have to just have some sort of overhead thing with the cameras and toll-tag readers but it would still be visual clutter that the original NTTA rendering did not include at all.

[mjblazin]

No comments about Angela Hunt's Op-Ed in the DMN on Trinity Park next steps?
I don't know if we can do what she wants without formally scrubbing the toll road. She essentially wants some quick action by adding some bike paths and exercise paths on dirt vs. concrete. She also recommends improving access by using parking outside the levees and setting up more signs to tell people how to get there.

I don't know if we are allowed to do any digging inside the levees or it's ok if we stay away from the levees and don't build anything really permanent. Her effort seems more to get people to start using the place vs. everybody doing nothing awaiting bulldozers.

[gshelton91]

Yes, other then Crow park we don't much of a way to get into the river bottom... and i agree it could be more useful even as it is now.

Though with the bridge now up it would be nice to have that lake under it.

[cowboyeagle05]

No comments about Angela Hunt's Op-Ed in the DMN on Trinity Park next steps?
I don't know if we can do what she wants without formally scrubbing the toll road. She essentially wants some quick action by adding some bike paths and exercise paths on dirt vs. concrete. She also recommends improving access by using parking outside the levees and setting up more signs to tell people how to get there.

I don't know if we are allowed to do any digging inside the levees or it's ok if we stay away from the levees and don't build anything really permanent. Her effort seems more to get people to start using the place vs. everybody doing nothing awaiting bulldozers.

Its behind the paywal so no one posted it. I hadn't even heard about it till you posted about it on here. I personally don't read DMN stories unless they are linked to on here because I can never find articles for the things I like to read about even now on their new DMN website. Now that they have the paywall I read them less cause I'm not going to overpay just for a digital subscription or pay for the paper version subscription I wont read just to get the digital version.

Based on the comments I think she has the right idea though trails and overall maintenance of the area between the levees is the things we need the most. The fancy stuff like lakes, promenades, and the like are all extras that I would love to pursue as we go but lets not just sit here and wait when with some basic trails we could have a nice nature area for the public to walk and "mountain" bike around in.

[AeroD]

Its behind the paywal so no one posted it.

I noticed it. Let's just face it a newspaper is much better suited for the 3 "Ss" than a tablet.

With that said, Angela's idea actually seems like a no-brainer: http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/sh...&postcount=521

[CasperITL]

Weird so many of you don't take the paper. Anyway, from the 6/9/11 DMN

In 1998, Dallas voters embraced a bold, visionary plan to transform the Trinity River floodway into a vibrant urban park. But 13 years later, a torturous federal approval process combined with a significant funding gap have conspired to stop the project in its tracks. Add to that the recent revelations that local and federal officials were less than forthcoming about the Trinity toll road’s viability during the 2007 referendum, and it’s not an overstatement to say the public has lost faith in the Trinity River project.

We can reclaim this project and win back the public’s trust, but only if we’re willing to change the way we do things at Dallas City Hall. The grander, long-term vision for the Trinity park is incredible, but it’s still years away. We must give the public a Trinity park they can enjoy today, and we must do it as quickly and as inexpensively as possible. That means no high-paid consultants; no elaborate, full-scale models and enticing watercolor pictures; and — most importantly — no multiyear timelines.

Don’t get me wrong — I like expensive, fancy things as much as the next gal. But expensive, fancy things are only great when they actually exist. A diamond ring is great. My husband promising me a diamond ring and handing me a brochure from the jeweler, not so great. Our expedited version of the Trinity park won’t boast lakes or sailboats or solar-powered water taxis. But what it lacks in extravagance it will make up for by simply existing.

Transforming the Trinity River basin won’t require a herculean effort. The greenbelt between our levees is already lush and beautiful — there’s just no way to get to it and nothing to do once you get there. We can change that.

We can start with a simple amenity that has proved incredibly popular in Dallas: a hike-and-bike trail that will draw runners, cyclists and nature-lovers to the river basin. We can build a multi-use recreational trail stretching from the Sylvan Avenue bridge to Moore Park, forgoing expensive concrete trails for low-cost, graded dirt paths.

Next, we make the park accessible. Right now, there are few public entry points into the floodway. There are, however, numerous restricted-access maintenance roads that cross the levees. Let’s unlock the gates and turn these roads into park entrances for pedestrians and cyclists.

Since it’s Dallas, we’re going to need to create some parking. But instead of wasting time and money building expensive paved parking lots, let’s use some of the existing, unused private parking lots adjacent to the park. We can also designate the public right-of-way along the outside of the levees as parking areas.

Lastly, we must connect our new Trinity park to the surrounding neighborhoods and major destinations: downtown, West Dallas, Oak Cliff, the Katy Trail and Fair Park, for starters. New wayfinding signs and dedicated on-street bike lanes can link these areas to the Trinity.

To bring this project to life, we’re going to have to draw on resources outside of City Hall — people and organizations more accustomed to getting stuff done quickly and doing it on a shoestring. Fortunately, we already have several community partners willing to help.

Among them is Oak Cliff’s Jason Roberts, who will help us construct a great park on a budget. His nationally recognized Better Block Project has proven that neglected urban spaces can be transformed quickly and cheaply into vibrant, walkable neighborhoods.

We’re talking with Groundwork Dallas, a local nonprofit, about helping us design and construct our trail system. This group is part of a national organization that converts derelict land into parks and public spaces, and their volunteers are already hard at work building trails a little farther south, in the Great Trinity Forest.

By moving forward on the Trinity park now, we do not abandon the larger vision, nor do we concede our respective positions on some of the more controversial aspects of the project. Instead, we fulfill the most fundamental promise of the Trinity River project: transforming our most under-utilized, under-appreciated natural asset into a vibrant urban park.

Angela Hunt represents District 14 on the Dallas City Council. Her email address is angela@angelahunt.com.

[BigD5349]

I think she's right on. The opportunity to do something more elaborate has been squandered and now there simply isn't sufficient money to continue to move forward with the existing plan. Once we find out where all the money went that has been spent to date, there will be more backlash. The remaining money will have to be used mostly to fix the levees.

There is a hidden benefit of just creating access and basic park services. It will get people down to the Trinity. Slowly, people will begin to recognize the potential, community stewardship will grow, just as it did with the Katy Trail. I think another Crow Park near the Continental and Hunt Hill bridges would be a success, given the dramatic views. It seems like a starter park could be expanded laterally as funding permits. When we can afford it and community trust is restored, we can dig the lakes, put the meander back in to the river, build the wetlands, etc.

[tamtagon]

^Word.

Let the Grand Vision continue to evolve until Dallas politicians finally realizes the community needs the Army Corps of Engineers to actually put the river to work. Just exactly how stupid is our culture to have forgotten all the benefits a properly and thoroughly managed river contributes to a society and local economy.

[citizen]

^

This is what the plan should have started with years ago - the only thing that I would add is some cleanup and maintenance of the trash and possibly if funds permit a boardwalk along the levees and outside of the floodplain.

[Random Traffic Guy]

Good letter from Ms. Hunt!

Knowing that back then I took the rendering into Photoshop and corrected the rendering to be more honest based on the debate.

And this was the northern part where the park adjacent to Downtown was actually of a usable width. The 100' thread park as it goes through downtown (including the slope of the tollway levee) is just ridiculous.

I noticed it. Let's just face it a newspaper is much better suited for the 3 "Ss" than a tablet.

Shoot, Shovel, and Shut up? I guess you are thinking of some different Ss

[DallasMan]

^^Agreed. I think the lakes are important though. Was talking with a friend this wknd about how the Trinity tollway has prevented the City from moving forward with the Project, even just some lakes and hike/bike trail. Amazing that such an important project is being held hostage by a road.

[BigD5349]

I haven't read this opinion piece due to it being behind the paywall, but even without reading it, what kind of dope is Leppert smoking? Can it be built? Sure. If we have boat loads of money to ensure saftey and context sensitive design for the park, which we do not, nor ever will have.

Tom Leppert, David McAtee and Michael Lunceford: Trinity tollway plan is safe and achievable
Published Jun 14, 2011 5:28 PM

We have been vocal supporters of the Trinity River project, including the tollway inside the levees as a critical part of the Balanced Vision Plan. This plan had been developed by two previous administrations, worked on for years and approved by an earlier Dallas City Council.

http://www.dallasnews.com/opinion/la...achievable.ece

[CasperITL]

Leppert's rebuttal OpEd in the DMN 6/14:


We have been vocal supporters of the Trinity River project, including the tollway inside the levees as a critical part of the Balanced Vision Plan. This plan had been developed by two previous administrations, worked on for years and approved by an earlier Dallas City Council.

When we faced a referendum on the tollway in November 2007, we carefully examined the project, making numerous inquiries of city staff and project partners, especially the Army Corps of Engineers . And we can assure you, no one in the corps or the Federal Highway Administration or the North Texas Tollway Authority has ever told us the project was not safe or we could not get this done. And that remains true to this day.

We became the project’s champions. We never said anything to the public that we did not believe to be true. To suggest that the city, the corps, our representatives in the U.S. House and Senate misled the public or deliberately withheld consequential information that the levees were not achievable or the tollway was unsafe is irresponsible, sloppy and outrageous. By using certain emails and ignoring key conversations, analytical work and other public comments, some have painted a picture that is not accurate.

Clearly, some bureaucrats within our project partners voiced concerns in emails. But ultimately, none of those partners have concluded that the tollway is unsafe or unachievable. And time after time, senior federal officials have not only said it is possible, they have assured us and others at the city that they are committed to seeing this project implemented. We have always been clear that there were significant, but not insurmountable, hurdles to clear. In a variety of forums, we painstakingly described the process and steps remaining. These included years of federal approval processes and funding (that apply to not only the tollway but every component of the project).

Most important is the issue of safety. From day one, flood control has been the primary objective. If, at any point, the corps determined that the tollway would compromise the integrity of the levees that would be the end of the story. This has not been the case. Clearly, we faced new challenges when the corps changed from decades of rating the levees “very good” or “excellent” to suddenly rating them “unacceptable” post-Katrina, but the city demonstrated its commitment to flood safety as we addressed those challenges and are on a path to corps approval.

There are always doubters, and their concerns frequently challenge us to make the project better. But none of those concerns have reached the point of telling us this can’t be done. Every significant project faces obstacles. The choice is simple: Quit and never take a bold step to move forward, or work and creatively find solutions. Keep in mind that the need for a reliever road for downtown traffic is real and doesn’t go away with critics who offer no alternative.

The naysayers have tried twice to stop the project at the polls and failed. They tied it up in the courts and failed. They have caused delay after delay, adding years to the project and trying to wear Dallas down. But the citizens of Dallas continue to hold the vision and are working to get it done. Dallas has always known the project, with the tollway, was an enormous undertaking that would require determination, innovation and stamina. That is how the world’s great projects got done. That is what it will take to get this project done as well.

Former Dallas Mayor Tom Leppert may be contacted through tomleppert.com. David McAtee, president of the Trinity Commons Foundation board, and Michael Lunceford, immediate past president of the board, may be contacted through trinitycommonsfoundation.org.

[mjblazin]

"World's greatest projects?" I guess the Trinity Tollway is up there with Great Pyramid, Three Gorges Dam and the Panama Canal. He still does not realize that expending extraordinary effort is what adults do to reach extraordinary heights. Building a reliever road in a riverbed does not qualify and is why the toll road won't happen. The Pharoah tried it in the 13th century BC and it did not work.

[tamtagon]

This is fun:

http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfa..._maga.php#more

I kinda like the way the Observer guys media-fight with the DMag guys. Score for Shutze. He says:

Every single thing we do down along the river exercises an effect on the water, and from the very beginning those effects should have been our first and overwhelmingly central concern.

The approach to flood control designed by the Army and managed by the city/county simply must find a way to take the burden off the levees.

[profbarium]

"World's greatest projects?" I guess the Trinity Tollway is up there with Great Pyramid, Three Gorges Dam and the Panama Canal. He still does not realize that expending extraordinary effort is what adults do to reach extraordinary heights. Building a reliever road in a riverbed does not qualify and is why the toll road won't happen. The Pharoah tried it in the 13th century BC and it did not work.

It may be lawerly ledgermain, but Leppert never said the Trinity Tollway was one of the "world's greatest projects", only that Dallasites need to employ similar tactics to those that saw them through.

Too, the projects you mention all used tremendous amounts of manpower (and tremendous risk of human life), not always at the laborers' consent. Two were even the product of dictatorships. True enough their accomplishments were remarkable, but that doesn't make the process "pain free". If we quit bickering over these issues and ceded control (and money) to a few key figures, our grandchildren might appreciate the results--but would we?

[citizen]

[QUOTE=profbarium;463850]It may be lawerly ledgermain, but Leppert never said the Trinity Tollway was one of the "world's greatest projects", only that Dallasites need to employ similar tactics to those that saw them through.

QUOTE]

It's apparent that you did not go to all of the public forums and hear Liepert speak again and again and again - and this is just the tip of iceberg relative to his deception.

[mjblazin]

It may be lawerly ledgermain, but Leppert never said the Trinity Tollway was one of the "world's greatest projects", only that Dallasites need to employ similar tactics to those that saw them through.

Too, the projects you mention all used tremendous amounts of manpower (and tremendous risk of human life), not always at the laborers' consent. Two were even the product of dictatorships. True enough their accomplishments were remarkable, but that doesn't make the process "pain free". If we quit bickering over these issues and ceded control (and money) to a few key figures, our grandchildren might appreciate the results--but would we?

Current theory on the Great Pyramid is that work required only needed a few thousand, highly skilled and relatively highly paid workers. No whips a la "Ten Commandments." The pain was the high taxes that Khufu put on to pay for it. Sounds familiar. No matter how much we think today is different with Ipads and Twitter, it really isn't.

[boozo]

Can anyone see/post the article?

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...s-to-clear.ece

[Julien]

Can anyone see/post the article?

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...s-to-clear.ece

By MICHAEL A. LINDENBERGER

Staff Writer

mlindenberger@dallasnews.com

Published: 05 March 2012 11:09 PM



Federal highway officials will call a public hearing as soon as next month to discuss a soon-to-be-released study of the Trinity River levees, officials in Washington confirmed late last week.

The study could help determine whether the Federal Highway Administration will approve the city of Dallas’ plan to build a high-speed toll road between the aging earthen dikes.

That toll road project has been on hold for nearly three years as Dallas has scrambled to address major problems with the dikes built 82 years ago by the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers to protect downtown Dallas from massive flooding.

But now that the final levee fixes are under way, the toll road project may be pulled free of the regulatory mud it’s been stuck in since 2009.

How far it gets, and whether it is ever built, remain unclear. The toll road remains short of funds — perhaps by $1 billion or more — and a decision from the federal government about whether the road can be built between the levees, as the city wants, is still at least a year away.
...

[downtownguy25]

Forum Etiquette & Rules

2. Copywritten material posted to the forum must credit the owner(s). When posting newspaper articles, internet articles, journals, papers, etc., please remember to cite source, author, and hyperlink as available. Best practice is to paraphrase key parts of an article and link to the remainder;

http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/fa...aq_forum_rules

[BigD5349]

Oh good, I feel like grinding this old, worn-out ax today... This continues to be the most blatant display of civic mismanagement in the history of Dallas. The stories continue to make it sound like the culprit is an out-of-control federal bureaucracy... In reality, it's just a stupid, stupid, stupid idea. Did I mention it is stupid? I also wish they would stop talking about congestion relief because there is are far less expensive alternatives than this. This is really about flipping land and doing real estate deals in the old industrial district.

I'm still waiting for Mayor Mike to demonstrate some leadership and move this long suffering issue off the dime. I don't care what else he will claim to accomplish, if he does nothing but tow the citizen council line on this deal, he will be a failure in my book. You want to be the leader? Then be the leader, make the tough calls and let's move on!

[mjblazin]

When does the supposed congestion relief arrive too late? I thought Pegasus was motoring along not waiting for the toll road. If the Feds will not provide an initial answer for another year, final answer in another 2 years, and then financing taking another year and construction at least 2 years on a not to interfere with levees, does not its arrival, probably 20 years after the vote in '98 mean the need will be gone before the solution arrives?

[tamtagon]

In reality, it's just a stupid, stupid, stupid idea. Did I mention it is stupid?

I know that's right.

Oh, and this is the first time in a long time the DMN mentioned the other route options of the proposed tollway.

Here's a time in this city when ten of millions are being spent to repair the damage a highway can do to a city by building a park over it, while there's a contingency still pushing the construction of another highway inside a park. Stupid++.

[Julien]

Forum Etiquette & Rules

2. Copywritten material posted to the forum must credit the owner(s). When posting newspaper articles, internet articles, journals, papers, etc., please remember to cite source, author, and hyperlink as available. Best practice is to paraphrase key parts of an article and link to the remainder;

http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/fa...aq_forum_rules

OOPS, I forgot about that one, thanks for reminding me.

The best way to get access to the full article is to type the title of the article in Google search:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Paywall..._Click_Free.22

[BigD5349]

When does the supposed congestion relief arrive too late? I thought Pegasus was motoring along not waiting for the toll road. If the Feds will not provide an initial answer for another year, final answer in another 2 years, and then financing taking another year and construction at least 2 years on a not to interfere with levees, does not its arrival, probably 20 years after the vote in '98 mean the need will be gone before the solution arrives?

Yes, here is another way of saying it... Attracting money to close the huge funding gap is predicated not only on the availability of capital, but also on it being a good return on investment for NTTA. The traffic projections were all ready too low to make this project a priority for NTTA. As the horse shoe project comes to fruition, does anyone really believe the traffic projections for a reliever road are going to increase to a level to make it a slam dunk for NTTA? Nothing about this makes sense.

[Lakewooder]

I say go with Project Pegasus and rebuild Stemmons to the north ala LBJ and Central. Dump the tollroad and get on with a lake or two.

[lakewoodhobo]

There should be a Change.org petition demanding that the mayor come out against the toll road. If anyone wants help putting it together, PM me.

[Bhops]

I say go with Project Pegasus and rebuild Stemmons to the north ala LBJ and Central. Dump the tollroad and get on with a lake or two.

co-sign

[cowboyeagle05]

I say go with Project Pegasus and rebuild Stemmons to the north ala LBJ and Central. Dump the tollroad and get on with a lake or two.

We will have the lake EIS in 2014 so at that time we will be able to proceed with the lakes as they are currently designed if we have the needed funds to build them. What I will be curious about is when, not if, the Trinity tollway is canceled how will they redesign the lake frontage plaza to use the additional land area.

[ChampionDallas]

I say go with Project Pegasus and rebuild Stemmons to the north ala LBJ and Central. Dump the tollroad and get on with a lake or two.

I second that.

The Tollroad is a bad design all over. Stemmons just needs to be widened and improved along with Project Pegasus.

[Alex Rodriguez]

Shocked that there isn't a flashing siren light on the top of the forum, like Drudge would have. Trinity Toll road appears to be moving forward.

http://transportationblog.dallasnews...04/post-2.html

The long-slumbering Trinity River toll road is awake once again.

No final decision about where the road will be located, or even if it can be built, is expected until January -- but already the odds of a big win for the Dallas City hall champions looks more likely than ever. (Note: The illustration above shows what the toll road and ramps would look like near Houston Street, with the McDermott bridge shown as well.)

That's the conclusion from reading a just-released report by the Federal Highway Administration detailing the four remaining options for where the controversial high-speed toll road will go.

That report, ordered up after the U.S. Army Corps of Engineers put the city back on its heels by flunking the aging Trinity River levees on an important inspection in 2009, looks at how each of the alternatives would impact the ability of the levees to protect downtown
Dallas and surrounding areas from catastrophic flooding.

The report weighs the pros and cons of each of the four alternatives -- and, technically, a fifth option to not build it at all -- and leaves little doubt that in the view of the authors the quickest, cheapest and easier solution is to give the city what it wants, and allow the road to be built between the levees.

If final FHWA approval is received by January 1, as the report estimates, construction would begin by 2016, and the North Texas Tollway Authority could be collecting tolls on a six-lane toll road by mid-2019.

Two hurdles remain -- and they are big ones. How to pay for it? Both levee options would cost about $1.8 billion by the time construction began, and the two other choices could cost $1 billion more than that. Second problem: The FHWA okay doesn't guarantee that the Army Corps of Engineers will sign off on the two permits needed to build a toll road within the levees?

But Corps officials, while firmly stating they have not made any choices yet, have also said in recent months that they have been in close contact with the FHWA, the city and NTTA to provide as much input as possible into the process -- a signal that seems to be saying they are comfortable with the likelihood that the project will be approved.

[mjblazin]

Design no longer matters. The only people that can pay for this thing are the Feds and they will not. The supporters missed their window of easy money. By the time the design is supposedly ready, we will be cutting expenses everywhere. No room in an Erskine Bowles world for this asinine project. Every new project will be a zero sum game. TX power will spend more time fighting for suburban roads than than this urban road. If it even gets close to passage, we simply feed lots of info to politicians in Kansas and New York that will use it to flay alive any supporters. "money spent by those people in TX to put a road in a river means less money for fill in the blank."

The only chance was possibly a TX legislator could sneak it in, but current climate has eliminated that way. They might try to to do it in stages, but again we can crank up the waste mongers to sic the attack dogs. Bridge to Nowhere on steroids. People complain about polarized politics, but when your goal is to not do something, it comes in very handy. It does mean however that we have to forget about any road period.

[profbarium]

^ You're onto one of the great paradoxes of infrastructure spending: decisions to add "needed" roads/rails/utilities/etc. in the 'burbs mean less can be spent on repairing or replacing the dated and decayings in the urban core. But adding to the total infrastructure (via suburban expansion) only creates more decay and dating in the future--and leads to more fights over the same scare dollars.

[electricron]

^ You're onto one of the great paradoxes of infrastructure spending: decisions to add "needed" roads/rails/utilities/etc. in the 'burbs mean less can be spent on repairing or replacing the dated and decayings in the urban core. But adding to the total infrastructure (via suburban expansion) only creates more decay and dating in the future--and leads to more fights over the same scare dollars.

There is a difference between repairing, replacing, and adding.
Here's some recent examples in the Dallas area....
(1) Repairing - Houston Street Viaduct, including installing tracks for streetcars.
(2) Replacing - Northwest Highway bridge over White Rock Creek, out with the old, in with the new.
(3) Adding - Hunt Bridge over the Trinity. The old bridge isn't even being torn down, but is being redesigned as a pedestrian bridge.

Let's not confuse example (3) with (1) or (2). You don't fix decaying infrastructure using that method. That's a problem taxpayers see all too often, and people wonder why old worn out structures seem to remain standing for a long time. Be honest, either fix them or replace them, but don't try to hood winkle us by just adding.....

[profbarium]

There is a difference between repairing, replacing, and adding.
Here's some recent examples in the Dallas area....
(1) Repairing - Houston Street Viaduct, including installing tracks for streetcars.
(2) Replacing - Northwest Highway bridge over White Rock Creek, out with the old, in with the new.
(3) Adding - Hunt Bridge over the Trinity. The old bridge isn't even being torn down, but is being redesigned as a pedestrian bridge.

You're right, I was imprecise. But the Hunt bridge is still a "replacement" of sorts. Instead of tearing down the old one, it's being re-purposed (or "repaired") as a pedestrian bridge. That seems like a worthy solution. What's unworthy is either (a) neglecting the old and letting it continually blight the landscape, or (b) ignoring the problem(s) and only making improvements when the site becomes functionally unsafe.

[Tucy]

Why wouldn't a toll road be paid for with revenue bonds, backed by expected toll collections? Isn't that how most toll roads are paid for?

[mjblazin]

Why wouldn't a toll road be paid for with revenue bonds, backed by expected toll collections? Isn't that how most toll roads are paid for?

The Feds already said the estimated traffic was insufficient to meet their standards. That reason is why it has to be a toll road. I expect potential bond holders would also shy away unless the interest rate was well above market, almost treating the issue as junk. The underwriters would probably not touch it.

That is the sad thing about this road, desperately sought to fill a demand that is not visible to naked eye, like dark matter.

[tamtagon]

Hopefully the powers that be will begin to realize there is also demand for quiet green space as well as demand for another highway.

[TheDoubletap]

Two groups (with probably overlapping memberships) are trying to get something going to fight the tollway:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/337937486266247/

and

http://www.change.org/petitions/dall...ce-and-for-all

[Rangers100]

^ You're onto one of the great paradoxes of infrastructure spending: decisions to add "needed" roads/rails/utilities/etc. in the 'burbs mean less can be spent on repairing or replacing the dated and decayings in the urban core. But adding to the total infrastructure (via suburban expansion) only creates more decay and dating in the future--and leads to more fights over the same scare dollars.

Exactly. Which destroys the myth that the burbs are friends of the city.

[lakewoodhobo]

Two groups (with probably overlapping memberships) are trying to get something going to fight the tollway:

https://www.facebook.com/groups/337937486266247/

and

http://www.change.org/petitions/dall...ce-and-for-all

I was the one who started the Change.org petition and was shocked by how quickly it made it to the DMN Transportation Blog:
http://transportationblog.dallasnews...d-opponen.html

Please sign it here: http://www.change.org/petitions/dall...ce-and-for-all
Of course, join the FB group as well: https://www.facebook.com/groups/337937486266247/

My amazing Photoshop skills:

[Rangers100]

I was the one who started the Change.org petition

Nicely done.

Interesting note from Lindenberger:

All that got me thinking when someone brought to my attention the new online petition against the road. Piggybacking on the move.org's online infrastructure, a group of Dallas folks have launched a petition drive to get Rawlins to say he's against the road.

Its catchy title: "Dallas Mayor Mike Rawlings: Stop the Trinity Parkway once and for all."

Over on Facebook, a new page gets straight to the point: "Kill the Trinity Toll Road."

The Facebook page has 78 members. Fewer than 30 have signed the online petition.

Those numbers aren't nearly enough to trigger another election. The Dallas City charter says they'll need a number of signatures equal to 10 percent of the current number of registered voters in the city. Sonia Jones, the city's election manager, says that number would have been 54,228 as of last May.

Five folks are all it takes to register the petition drive with the City Secretary, and then they'd have 60 days to get the needed signatures turned. If they are verified, the question would go to the City Council in a form of an ordinance prohibiting the construction of the road.

If the Council did not pass it, then an election would be automatically triggered.

[Rangers100]

NTTA is holding a May 8th public hearing on the Trinity Tollroad plan:

A public hearing has been scheduled for Tuesday, May, 8, 2012, to inform and solicit comments from the public on schematics for the proposed project alternatives and the Limited Scope Supplemental (LSS) to the Supplemental Draft Environmental Impact Statement (SDEIS) for the proposed Trinity Parkway project.

The Trinity Parkway Public Hearing will be held in the arena of the Dallas Convention Center, located at 650 S. Griffin Street in Dallas, Texas, 75202. An open house will be held from 5 to 7 p.m. A formal presentation will begin at 7 p.m., followed by a public comment period.

[cowboyeagle05]

The DMN had a post on their transportation blog that said that Angela Hunt declined to lead a charge against the tollroad again which I am not surprised to hear. Although the blog post has disappeared now.

Angela Hunt has a new baby and that election against the tollroad was a big stress on her considering the DMN, D-Mag, and Leppert hounded her for her difference of opinion on the matter. Now both D-Mag and DMN admit the tollway is a mistake and that they misreported info during the election well sort of, the DMN says Leppert lied to them...yeah sure.

[tamtagon]

...Now both D-Mag and DMN admit the tollway is a mistake and that they misreported info during the election well sort of, the DMN says Leppert lied to them...yeah sure.

If this monstrosity somehow continues to get the thumbs-up from the city council, there's no way it would get approved by voters again. The exceptionally well-run, programmed and managed yet ridiculously misleading public relations campaign duping cannot be repeated.

[Rangers100]

If this monstrosity somehow continues to get the thumbs-up from the city council, there's no way it would get approved by voters again. The exceptionally well-run, programmed and managed yet ridiculously misleading public relations campaign duping cannot be repeated.

I wouldn't be so sure of that. There are a ton of people in Dallas (to say nothing of the sprawl beyond it) that still worship car culture and thus live and vote accordingly.

[rantanamo]

It will pass again. This is why I think you're better off making this I-35E and moving it to the other side of the levee. Like it or not, people think the answer is more freeway lanes, and getting past downtown is their goal most of the time. Will it take up park space? Absolutely. Put it on the larger side though and get those who want to pass through, the heck out of the way.

[Rangers100]

It will pass again. This is why I think you're better off making this I-35E and moving it to the other side of the levee.

That's not an option though.

Cities around the world have been tearing out urban highways, with amazing results.

Yet Dallas has leaders wanting to build another one. Simply unreal.