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Thread: Trinity Railway Express thread

  1. #151
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    This just in:
    COMMUNITY MEETING/PUBLIC HEARING NOTICES
    TRE Fare Zone Move Will be Central Topic at Fare Policy Public Hearing
    http://www.dart.org/meetings/publicm...rss.asp?ID=436

    The public hearing will be held:
    Tuesday, August 24, 2010 - 6:30 p.m.
    DART Board Room - 1401 Pacific Ave.
    Dallas, Texas 75202

    The proposed relocation of the TRE fare zone boundary from the Dallas/Tarrant County line to CentrePort/DFW Airport Station is one of several topics at a public hearing called by the DART Board of Directors to discuss regional fare policies.

    The fare boundary move is proposed to equalize fare options for both Dallas and Tarrant county customers. Currently, customers traveling to CentrePort from Dallas County stations pay a Regional fare, and customers from Tarrant County pay a system fare. Under the proposal, the trip from either county to CentrePort/DFW Station would be a system fare (see map).
    That's kind of confusing, but substitute "cheaper fare" for "system fare" and you'll get the idea.

    Tarrant County folks already pay the cheap fare to get to DFW. The proposal is that Dallas County folks will *also* get to pay the cheap fare to get to DFW.

    Now, I love a free lunch as much as the next guy, but isn't that kinda backward, when both agencies are scrambling to meet their long-term budgets? Doesn't it make more sense to do just the opposite: make Tarrant County riders pay the same, *higher* fare to get to DFW as their Dallas County compatriots?
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  2. #152
    Administrator dfwcre8tive's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobertB
    This just in:
    COMMUNITY MEETING/PUBLIC HEARING NOTICES
    TRE Fare Zone Move Will be Central Topic at Fare Policy Public Hearing
    http://www.dart.org/meetings/publicm...rss.asp?ID=436

    The public hearing will be held:
    Tuesday, August 24, 2010 - 6:30 p.m.
    DART Board Room - 1401 Pacific Ave.
    Dallas, Texas 75202

    The proposed relocation of the TRE fare zone boundary from the Dallas/Tarrant County line to CentrePort/DFW Airport Station is one of several topics at a public hearing called by the DART Board of Directors to discuss regional fare policies.

    The fare boundary move is proposed to equalize fare options for both Dallas and Tarrant county customers. Currently, customers traveling to CentrePort from Dallas County stations pay a Regional fare, and customers from Tarrant County pay a system fare. Under the proposal, the trip from either county to CentrePort/DFW Station would be a system fare (see map).
    That's kind of confusing, but substitute "cheaper fare" for "system fare" and you'll get the idea.

    Tarrant County folks already pay the cheap fare to get to DFW. The proposal is that Dallas County folks will *also* get to pay the cheap fare to get to DFW.

    Now, I love a free lunch as much as the next guy, but isn't that kinda backward, when both agencies are scrambling to meet their long-term budgets? Doesn't it make more sense to do just the opposite: make Tarrant County riders pay the same, *higher* fare to get to DFW as their Dallas County compatriots?
    I think it's a good idea to make it equal from Dallas and Fort Worth.

  3. #153
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by RobertB
    http://www.dart.org/meetings/publicm...rss.asp?ID=436

    customers traveling to CentrePort from Dallas County stations pay a Regional fare, and customers from Tarrant County pay a system fare.
    Fare boundaries gotta go.... This kinda reminds me of the time before cell phones, when the phone company sold "Metrolines" so people who called Fort Worth from Dallas and vice versa would not incur long distance charges.

    1+ (area code) = Long Distance Rates

    How long before state law makes it possible for North Texas to have single entity transit authority governing the region?

  4. #154
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Fare boundaries gotta go.... This kinda reminds me of the time before cell phones, when the phone company sold "Metrolines" so people who called Fort Worth from Dallas and vice versa would not incur long distance charges.

    1+ (area code) = Long Distance Rates

    How long before state law makes it possible for North Texas to have single entity transit authority governing the region?
    The State Transportation Code already allows it. There's no legal reason why Fort Worth can't join DART if it wish, because Fort Worth borders Irving. But, the sales tax limit (8.25% maximum) gets in the way, because FWTA only collects 0.5% while DART collects a full 1%. Fort Worth is using 0.5% for other reasons, and FWTA can't charge the full 1% so it can join DART. And that's assuming it wants to.
    Last edited by electricron; 04 August 2010 at 09:42 PM.

  5. #155
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Fare boundaries gotta go.... This kinda reminds me of the time before cell phones, when the phone company sold "Metrolines" so people who called Fort Worth from Dallas and vice versa would not incur long distance charges.

    1+ (area code) = Long Distance Rates

    How long before state law makes it possible for North Texas to have single entity transit authority governing the region?
    There's a big difference, though. At some point, it became just as cheap to push electrons from Dallas to Fort Worth as it was to push them from Oak Cliff to Oak Lawn. But at the moment, it takes a lot more diesel fuel and operator hours to get from Union Station to the ITC than it does to get to Westmoreland Station. The *actual* costs are higher, so it's still fair to charge more for the trip.

    Don't take that the wrong way -- I haven't taken leave of my senses and jumped on the "profit or die" bandwagon. It's just that those costs have to be recouped somehow, and unlike with the Metro Numbers, technology can't go very far in equalizing a short hop and a long haul.
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  6. #156
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    Does that the ticket machines at Union Station would be cheaper? How dow that change impact using a day pass to use Fort Worth's T, a necessity for most tourists? Maybe FTW people pay a cheaper rate for a regional pass than Dallas? I'd expect most TRE users have regional passes.

  7. #157
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by mjblazin
    Does that the ticket machines at Union Station would be cheaper? How dow that change impact using a day pass to use Fort Worth's T, a necessity for most tourists? Maybe FTW people pay a cheaper rate for a regional pass than Dallas? I'd expect most TRE users have regional passes.
    DART and The T have synchronized their fare structures. The "Regional Pass", which gets you everywhere, is the same price, no matter where you buy it. None of the prices would change; just the fare boundary. Under the proposed plan, you would pay the same to go from Union to Centreport as you currently do to go from Union to West Irving.
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  8. #158
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    Fare boundries should absolutely not be removed. Zones are a crucial part of increasing the fiscal viability of regional transportation systems. New York's lack of zone pricing with the MTA is among the most important factors crippling the agency (second, perhaps, to a history of miserably inept and corrupt leadership) -- and because the system is now so massive under only one fare, it's impossible to move to a zone-based fare system without inciting riots. They should have been implemented long ago.

    DFW is simply too sprawled to live under a single fare zone. It works in Paris (unlike New York), because the Subway is compact enough -- but the RER is as integral a part of daily commuting patterns as the subway, and is more equivalent (IMO) than Paris' Metro to DART's light rail system, much less the commuter rail system! In fact, I think DART should begin seriously looking at expanding the zone pricing to the light-rail system as it continues to expand so dramatically.
    Times weighs down on you like an old, ambiguous dream. You keep on moving, trying to slip through it. But even if you go to the ends of the earth, you won't be able to escape it.
    Haruki Murakami

  9. #159
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by msutton
    Fare boundries should absolutely not be removed. Zones are a crucial part of increasing the fiscal viability of regional transportation systems. New York's lack of zone pricing with the MTA is among the most important factors crippling the agency (second, perhaps, to a history of miserably inept and corrupt leadership) -- and because the system is now so massive under only one fare, it's impossible to move to a zone-based fare system without inciting riots. They should have been implemented long ago.

    DFW is simply too sprawled to live under a single fare zone. It works in Paris (unlike New York), because the Subway is compact enough -- but the RER is as integral a part of daily commuting patterns as the subway, and is more equivalent (IMO) than Paris' Metro to DART's light rail system, much less the commuter rail system! In fact, I think DART should begin seriously looking at expanding the zone pricing to the light-rail system as it continues to expand so dramatically.
    Zone pricing on the LRT would be difficult to implement, as the system currently exists. Plus, it would likely be perceived as unfair -- the DART members paid for the promise of rail, etc etc.

    I could see new DART member cities (or whatever form future partnerships take) being in a different zone, though. I think it would require building stations with a barrier system, though, unless DART could justify a conductor in every outer-zone train (like we have on the TRE, mostly). The arguments I've made against barriers in the current single-fare LRT system break down when there are multiple fare zones.
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  10. #160
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    Quote Originally Posted by RobertB
    Zone pricing on the LRT would be difficult to implement, as the system currently exists. Plus, it would likely be perceived as unfair -- the DART members paid for the promise of rail, etc etc.

    I could see new DART member cities (or whatever form future partnerships take) being in a different zone, though. I think it would require building stations with a barrier system, though, unless DART could justify a conductor in every outer-zone train (like we have on the TRE, mostly). The arguments I've made against barriers in the current single-fare LRT system break down when there are multiple fare zones.
    I completely agree with you. Fare boundaries require conductors (or ticket inspectors) on every train to enforce the fare boundaries. And it probably costs more to hire the conductors than what the additional fare boundaries collect.

    But, I can see having fare boundaries if DART extends the light rail lines into non-member cities without having to hire conductors. Build fare barriers at the stations in non member cities only, and charge significantly more per fare to compensate for the lack of the local city subsidy. I would charge not only to get on, but to get off as well.

  11. #161
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    Since the chances of extending LR into non-member cities in the next 20 years is pretty close to zero, we can kill that idea.

  12. #162
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Lightbulb Finding an answer to a question at YouTube

    The question was: How many BiLevel passenger cars can the TRE locomotives pull?

    Here's an answer I found at YouTube
    http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=K8qnqp6FK4w

    10 was the answer.

    Which brought up this next question, which TRE stations have platform long enough for 10 passenger cars?

    Since the passenger cars are 85 feet long, the platforms need to be 850 feet long.
    Using Google Earth, Union Station's TRE west platform (shared with Amtrak) is ~1500 feet long. The TRE east platform is ~520 feet long.
    Victory Station's platforms are ~670 feet long.
    Medical Center platforms are ~380 feet long.
    South Irving platforms are ~ 385 feet long.
    West Irving platforms are ~ 365 feet long.
    I'm getting tired measuring platforms, so far the shortest platforms were 365 feet long. That allows......some math is needed......365/85= 4.29 passenger cars.

    Which is why you rarely see more than 4 passenger cars per train.

    The video I used to get my answer brings up a few pointers I wish to suggest when taking and publishing videos for trains.
    First suggestion, edit it before publishing. The entire first minute of this video is wasted. All you see of the train is its headlights. And those aren't the only seconds of video that need to be cut.
    Second suggestion, keep the camera steady. No one likes watching videos that shake unless we're shooting an earthquake scene. One should think that using the zoom feature automatically requires some sort of tripod or camera stand.
    Third suggestion, avoid panning, or edit most of the pans out. I've seen too many train videos where the camera pans centered on the locomotive unsuccessfully. It is far better for the viewer to watch the entire train go by a stationary camera. In this example, the cameraman tried to pan on the last car, but instead of seeing the entire car during the pan, we saw its number. I do not consider this pan successfully performed. Remember panning works best when the object of the video remains the same distance away from the camera.
    Last edited by electricron; 18 August 2010 at 01:19 PM.

  13. #163
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    Whats going on the the double tracking project on the TRE? They finished the flyover in Irving awhile ago, and I would have thought the track would be put down by now or at least in the process. Looks like its sat empty for a few months now. Any updates?

  14. #164
    Administrator dfwcre8tive's Avatar
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    After Fort Worth derailment, TRE won't get back on track until Wednesday
    10:02 AM CDT on Monday, August 30, 2010
    By KERRY SOLAN / The Dallas Morning News
    ksolan@dallasnews.com
    http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont....a3ed8d28.html

    Trinity Railway Express riders can expect their commuting headache to continue until Wednesday, after a freight train derailed near downtown Fort Worth.

    Train derailment closes Fort Worth stations of Trinity Railway Express.
    Rail service has been suspended at both Fort Worth stations: the Intermodal Transportation Center and T&P Station. They will be closed again Tuesday while crews repair the damaged tracks, said Joan Hunter, a spokeswoman for The T.

    Repairs and cleanup should be done by Tuesday afternoon, and officials expect the line to reopen no later than Wednesday morning.

    Riders traveling east to Dallas are encouraged to drive to the Richland Hills station to catch trains there, and westbound riders will be shuttled from that station into Fort Worth.

    Delays are expected all morning throughout the system, which stretches from downtown Fort Worth to Dallas’ Union Station.

    The derailment occurred about 8:30 p.m. Sunday when a Burlington Northern Santa Fe train carrying coal derailed as it passed under Interstate 35W. Seven cars derailed and three overturned, spilling coal and damaging the tracks.

    ...

  15. #165
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    It is much better that a coal train derailed versus a passenger train; thankfully no one got hurt Sunday night. Derailments aren't always the fault of the tracks, wheels on the cars may also cause derailments. Thankfully the cars that derailed were relatively harmless coal hoppers, imagine the what ifs if they were chemical tank cars?

    Getting on my soapbox......
    Derailments are much too common today, they're treated as minor incidents by the railroad companies. It''s far cheaper to deal with the individual incidents than it is to maintain the tracks and equipment to higher standards that prevent derailments. Tracks with 10 mph maximum speed limits aren't being maintained. There's no acceptable reason for a train going 8 mph to derail. I'm willing to accept less maintenance in rural areas, but I believe it is unacceptable to accept derailments in dense urban areas. This derailment occurred basically in downtown Fort Worth, the densest part of Tarrant County.

  16. #166
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    TRE is for sure, my favorite ride. I live in downtown Fort Worth. But because of the train, I live in Downtown Fort Worth and Downtown Dallas, in my book. (And PLano and Fair Park and Oak Cliff)

    Here is a recent shot from my balcony with 400mm lens at Dawn. They tunneled through a 110 year old building rather than tear the building down.

    [IMG][/IMG]

  17. #167
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    Very cool shot... One of my favorite parts of the ride.
    Times weighs down on you like an old, ambiguous dream. You keep on moving, trying to slip through it. But even if you go to the ends of the earth, you won't be able to escape it.
    Haruki Murakami

  18. #168
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    Not sure where this should go, but looks like the Richland Hills station will continue to operate and it will continue to be a member of the T.

  19. #169
    Skyscraper Member Double Wide's Avatar
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    where was that photo take? I heve never ridden the TRE before.
    RAIN! To....much.....rain.....

  20. #170
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    Quote Originally Posted by Double Wide
    where was that photo take? I heve never ridden the TRE before.
    Downtown Fort Worth

  21. #171
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    The November 2010 elections included a passionate battle in Richland Hills on whether to remain in The T -- and retain TRE service. The result was an overwhelming affirmation that the TRE is seen as an integral part of the suburb's future development.
    Voters decide propositions in 10 cities in Fort Worth area
    Posted Tuesday, Nov. 02, 2010
    BY GORDON DICKSON
    Read more: http://www.star-telegram.com/2010/11...itions-in.html

    Voters in Richland Hills appeared ready Tuesday to stay in the Fort Worth Transportation Authority and continue an 18-year tradition of bus and commuter rail service in their city.

    With early voting and six of seven precincts reporting, the proposition asking voters whether they wanted to stay in the T was passing with 62 percent of the vote. The high-profile debate over the value of mass transit attracted 2,125 residents, or nearly 45 percent of 4,802 registered voters, with one precinct remaining.

    The early totals included 1,035 people who cast ballots in early voting, according to incomplete and unofficial results.

    "I have faith in the citizens that they can see what's logically right and wrong, bad and good, and when it's right they'll stay in," said T President Dick Ruddell, who added that the vote clears the way for road improvements and development around Richland Hills Station.

    Richland Hills was among 10 cities in the greater Fort Worth area where voters decided a plethora of propositions Tuesday, including: legalizing alcohol sales in areas that were dry, reauthorizing sales taxes for street repairs, approving bonds to pay for new municipal buildings and giving elected municipal leaders longer terms.

    The decision by Richland Hills residents to stay in the T was being hailed by transit proponents, who say it proves that despite calls for government belt-tightening, North Texans consider transportation improvements a crucial step toward improving their quality of life. This is especially true, they said, of improvements that reduce the number of people on freeways in single-occupant vehicles.

    The T collects a half-cent sales tax in Richland Hills, and provides on-request bus service, transit for mobility-impaired people and a Trinity Railway Express station.

    "For our side, it doesn't look that good, but the encouraging thing is a whole bunch of people turned out. It's amazing," said Councilman Larry Marrs, who has led the city's effort to explore alternatives to the T's service. Marrs and others argued that the city doesn't get enough value for its $600,000 to $800,000 annual sales tax contribution, and they have pushed to hire an outside contractor to provide shuttle service for a limited number of residents.

    The debate bitterly divided elected leaders during the past year. In Richland Hills, all five council members favored alternatives to the T, while Mayor David Ragan pushed to keep T service.

    But on Tuesday night, Ragan said, "Let's have a healing period and move on."
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  22. #172
    Skyscraper junkie gchrisbailey's Avatar
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    http://www.nbcdfw.com/traffic/transi...120115874.html

    The T may beat TEX to the punch in Southeast Fort Worth...
    "...Give me your tired, your poor,
    Your huddled masses yearning to breathe free..."

  23. #173
    Eulogize the FW Streetcar Haretip's Avatar
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    Hrmmm... Just got an interesting proposal in my inbox for a minor route modification involving a certain commuter route. I should be able to talk about it since I am not under contract.... Hold on a sec... Oh dangit, I just committed to the project. Oh well, I will comment when I can. Very interesting.
    Andy Haretip
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  24. #174
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Can't you even give us a hint?

    Latest TRE ridership data.
    http://www.dart.org/about/board/boar...32212TREAC.pdf
    Weekdays (Average) for Jan 2012
    T & P Station > On=613 > Off=485
    Ft. Worth ITC > On=775 > Off=964
    Richland Hills > On=671 > Off=642
    Hurst/Bell > On=540 > Off=499
    Centreport/ DFW > On=1,073 > Off=961
    West Irving > On=341 > Off=331
    South Irving Station > On=545 > Off=555
    Medical Market Center > On=758 > Off=770
    Victory > On=703 > Off=1020
    Dallas Union > On=1870 > Off=1662
    Totals > On=7,892 >Off=7,892
    Saturdays Totals > On=3,896.0 > Off=3,896.0
    There's just as much Saturday data too, I just didn't wish to list them. Just want to show that Saturday ridership is about half the weekday ridership.

    Also in the link some might find interesting.....
    8. *Cost and Ridership Impact of Increasing TRE Midday Service
    Mr. Farquhar briefed the Committee as follows (presentation on file in the Office of Board Support):
     TRE 60 minute midday service
     Conceptual Plan
     Daily Expense
     FY08-FY11 Midday Service Ridership
     Estimated Ridership and Costs
    Mr. Danish asked what the cost per train is. Ms. Navarro stated that the cost of one train going across the corridor in one direction is $100, if it is a one car train. A locomotive, coach and cab would be $300 in car miles to go one direction. The train hours are $136 in one direction. Ms. Navarro added that these are only the direct costs. Mr. Farquhar stated that staff has not really dug deep into the operating plan to see where money could be saved.
    Mr. Cumbie verified that this is new ridership, not cannibalization of other routes. Mr. Farquhar replied that this is new ridership based on the average ridership this year on TRE midday service. One thing he did not factor in, because he has never seen any calculation to predict this, is when service is added to the midday there is a spillover effect to the peak period.
    Mr. Brennan added that if the trains run midday longer than an hour, and travelers are tied to the airport shuttle, they won’t take the TRE. Mr. Danish stated that the connections to DFW Airport should be explored. If we build it, more people will ride. Ms. Navarro stated that another option could be to run the RDCs, which are cheaper to run. Mr. Farquhar added that they are slightly cheaper to run, but are more expensive to maintain. Mr. Danish stated that that is not a fair argument, since the equipment has to be maintained and depreciated whether or not it is used. Ms. Navarro stated that a two-car RDC could be used for midday service, instead of a three-car bi-level train, which would be cheaper. On Saturdays, there is also an opportunity to change out the bi-level for RDCs for a potential savings as well. Mr. Farquhar stated that a two-car RDC could handle the capacity now. He added that staff will run through those numbers. There are a lot of issues and factors that need to be looked at. Mr. Cumbie requested to see this again next time.

    Thought some might be interested in the costs for running the trains.
    Last edited by electricron; 07 April 2012 at 03:56 AM.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Haretip View Post
    Hrmmm... Just got an interesting proposal in my inbox for a minor route modification involving a certain commuter route. I should be able to talk about it since I am not under contract.... Hold on a sec... Oh dangit, I just committed to the project. Oh well, I will comment when I can. Very interesting.
    My guess/hope is that the TRE is re-routed through Irving to sync up with the new Orange line. (And of course there's always the obvious DFW connection, but that's a well-known--and discussed--issue.)

  26. #176
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by profbarium View Post
    My guess/hope is that the TRE is re-routed through Irving to sync up with the new Orange line. (And of course there's always the obvious DFW connection, but that's a well-known--and discussed--issue.)
    During that meeting discussed with the latest link I provided, they were talking about getting better bus service to DFW Airport and starting bus services to Arlington from the Centerpoint station. Wish they were talking about future train expansions instead.......
    But, the major discussion of this meeting about future train services was having more midday trains, the reason about the discussion on the costs per one way train.
    Last edited by electricron; 07 April 2012 at 10:54 AM.

  27. #177
    Super Moderator cowboyeagle05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by profbarium

    My guess/hope is that the TRE is re-routed through Irving to sync up with the new Orange line. (And of course there's always the obvious DFW connection, but that's a well-known--and discussed--issue.)
    What would be the point of taking the slower TRE to Irving following the orange line when it already intersects with it at Union Station?

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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboyeagle05 View Post
    What would be the point of taking the slower TRE to Irving following the orange line when it already intersects with it at Union Station?
    I meant so that residents of Irving (Las Colinas), Carrollton, Lewisville, et al. could ride the DART and connect with the TRE without having to go all the way into Union/Victory.

  29. #179
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboyeagle05 View Post
    What would be the point of taking the slower TRE to Irving following the orange line when it already intersects with it at Union Station?
    I thought he was discussing a new service on the Madill subsection that would go all the way to Frisco, intersection not only with the Orange line in Irving, but the Green, Cotton Belt, and A-Train in Carrollton. If that were so, it would connect to far more lines.....

  30. #180
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Sorry, double post.

  31. #181
    Super Moderator cowboyeagle05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by profbarium

    I meant so that residents of Irving (Las Colinas), Carrollton, Lewisville, et al. could ride the DART and connect with the TRE without having to go all the way into Union/Victory.
    That's sounds overly duplicative considering the TRE is slower than light rail. I am guessing your idea is so that people could travel from Fort Worth to the Irving area or the other way around of course. I'm just trying to understand your logic with this idea cause I am missing the point. Why wouldn't you also want the TRE to go to Garland or Plano as well? I'm just curious to understand your idea better.

  32. #182
    Super Moderator cowboyeagle05's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by electricron
    I thought he was discussing a new service on the Madill subsection that would go all the way to Frisco, intersection not only with the Orange line in Irving, but the Green, Cotton Belt, and A-Train in Carrollton. If that were so, it would connect to far more lines.....
    See I would understand that idea. I assume the Madill section is the rail line that travels north from Irving Station towards Las Colinas and onto Frisco. I thought he meant travel alongside the orange line following some of the same route through Dallas to Irving which seemed like a odd slower route for a longer TRE. I could see the possibilities of a train like the new DCTA commuter trains traveling along the Madill route connecting more areas to the system.

  33. #183
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    Quote Originally Posted by cowboyeagle05 View Post
    That's sounds overly duplicative considering the TRE is slower than light rail. I am guessing your idea is so that people could travel from Fort Worth to the Irving area or the other way around of course. I'm just trying to understand your logic with this idea cause I am missing the point. Why wouldn't you also want the TRE to go to Garland or Plano as well? I'm just curious to understand your idea better.
    Sure. I meant adding a "bend" to the current TRE line that added a stop at, say, the Bachman Station. From there it would continue along its normal route to South Irving and beyond. And yes, the idea would be to more easily allow Irving/Carrollton residents to travel to Ft. Worth (and vice versa). In truth, I don't even know if that's possible, let alone likely. It's just an idea I'd like to see explored.

    I have no problem with extending an east-west line even farther east (in fact, I'm favor of it!). I like the idea of the Cotton Betl, but I realize it (1) won't be online for a number of years, and (2) won't really cut through Irving/NW Dallas.

  34. #184
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by profbarium View Post
    Sure. I meant adding a "bend" to the current TRE line that added a stop at, say, the Bachman Station. From there it would continue along its normal route to South Irving and beyond. And yes, the idea would be to more easily allow Irving/Carrollton residents to travel to Ft. Worth (and vice versa). In truth, I don't even know if that's possible, let alone likely. It's just an idea I'd like to see explored.

    I have no problem with extending an east-west line even farther east (in fact, I'm favor of it!). I like the idea of the Cotton Betl, but I realize it (1) won't be online for a number of years, and (2) won't really cut through Irving/NW Dallas.
    Bachman Station is more than 2 miles away from the TRE rail corridor at its closest point, that's more than just a small bend.

  35. #185
    Mid-Rise Member homeworld1031tx's Avatar
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    There is no way that the cost of a trip is that low. If you factor in the depreciation of the train itself on a per mile of use basis over the trains lifetime mileage potential than i find it very hard to believe that a trip costs 100 bucks. did i read that wrong or something?

  36. #186
    Sea™ CTroyMathis's Avatar
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    The visioned BNSF Corridor South Irving (Downtown Irving/Heritage Crossing) to Frisco would cover meeting these lines:

    DART Green Line @Downtown Carrollton Station
    DCTA A-Train extension to Downtown Carrollton Station
    DART Orange Line @somewhere around that deferred S. Las Colinas Station
    The Cotton Belt @Downtown Carrollton Station
    TRE @South Irving Station(Downtown Irving/Heritage Crossing)

    ---

    I'm pretty sure Andy can fill us in eventually.
    Maybe it has something to do with Amtrak's shift to the TRE corridor. Maybe not yet. Maybe something to do with Centreport, related or unrelated to Amtrak stopping there. Or North Arlington Intermodal. ; ) Or, . . .

    By the way, the TRE will run on a Sunday this month! 22 April.

  37. #187
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    Quote Originally Posted by electricron View Post
    Bachman Station is more than 2 miles away from the TRE rail corridor at its closest point, that's more than just a small bend.
    Well, that's true. I suppose I glossed over the part about the route modification being "minor."

  38. #188
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    Quote Originally Posted by electricron View Post
    I thought he was discussing a new service on the Madill subsection that would go all the way to Frisco, intersection not only with the Orange line in Irving, but the Green, Cotton Belt, and A-Train in Carrollton. If that were so, it would connect to far more lines.....
    I really like that idea too.

  39. #189
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by homeworld1031tx View Post
    There is no way that the cost of a trip is that low. If you factor in the depreciation of the train itself on a per mile of use basis over the trains lifetime mileage potential than i find it very hard to believe that a trip costs 100 bucks. did i read that wrong or something?
    I thought I made it clear it was "Direct" costs. Indirect costs like depreciation weren't included in that $100 per car (with locomotive counting as a car) per one way trip.

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