Irving: Las Colinas Entertainment Complex

[AeroD]

Las Colinas and Victory Park have so many similarities and failures common with these big development projects.

Las Colinas is far from being a failure. I suppose the Las Colinas Urban Center could use some "more" life. But Las Colinas is a success.

Here is a map of what is "Las Colinas": http://www.lascolinas.com/map.htm

[cowboyeagle05]

Las Colinas is far from being a failure. I suppose the Las Colinas Urban Center could use some "more" life. But Las Colinas is a success.

Here is a map of what is "Las Colinas": http://www.lascolinas.com/map.htm

Thanks for the map I mis-spoke I meant to compare Victory Park to Las Colinas Urban Center.

Some would say the same about Victory Park I mean the retail space is empty but Victory Park does have office tenants and residents same as Las Colinas. The differences include Las Colinas is bigger but ultametly it's a major planned neighborhood development that ran out of steam a long time ago before finishing its planned buildout and still has potential for filing in over the years and has seen recent interest in the last decade for such.

Victory Park is a success in it's own right I mean they have high occupancy in the avalible office space and if more office space had been built before Hillwood collapsed many believe it would be full too. There are residential units with residents who live there even though the retail space is less than optimal. The W Hotel is really successful as far as the hotel concerns itself.

They seem like successes and failures in many of the same ways.

[tamtagon]

Irving entertainment center moves a step closer to reality

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...r.366feb4.html

Monday, December 13, 2010

By BRANDON FORMBY / The Dallas Morning News

...A North Texas appeals court ruled Monday afternoon that former Mayor Joe Putnam's legal challenge to the project financing was correctly dismissed because he and a group he leads did not put up a $10 million bond to continue their challenge.

...The city is still awaiting a lower court's ruling in the bond validation suit that will decide whether its financing plan is legal.

Putnam and his Irving Taxpayers Opposed to Illegal and Wasteful Use of Tax Money intervened in the bond validation suit. Anschutz Entertainment Group, which operates Grand Prairie's Verizon Theatre, funded their legal challenge. One of Irving's partners in the project is music promoter Live Nation, an AEG rival.

This project continues to progress, in spite of the damaging politicking fad to gain approval from duped citizens by pasting the mantra that responsible government spending means no municipal investments.

I cannot wait to see what groups surface to fund a campaign against renovating and upgrading Dallas Memorial Auditorium. Sorry to say, but Grand Prairie's Verizon Theatre has an expiration date....

Without a doubt, I believe Politicking has become one of the most economic damaging realities in America. Far too many critical economic directives, policy mandates and politico-economic decisions are based entirely on the ephemeral public relations needs of an elected official. It's ridiculous, yet sadly predictable, how rampant it's become for politicians to sacrifice public welfare for influence....

Hopefully more politicians will end up in jail, just like Tom DeLay. I would be very interested to see a thorough compare/contrast analysis of the tactics, processes and maneuvering within the "system" needed by law enforcement to find clear path of conviction that put early 20th Century Mob Bosses like Al Capone in jail. Anecdotal evidence was as plentiful as snow & ice in Antarctica showing both Capone and DeLay were guilty of serious, reprehensible crimes against society, but the only way to punish them had to be found in ancillary details.

ANYWAY......

I like the efforts of Irving to build up destinations in Las Colinas. The emerging linear business district in Dallas County from DFW to Downtown must become as densely occupied as possible, and coupling the new Irving Conv Ctr with a cluster of performance & entertainment venues makes sense to me. While the Irving initiative is considerably smaller than complex downtown Dallas, they are definitely symbiotic and will help the region continue to attract more private investment.

[Kelley USA]

Slam the breaks on this thing...The Texas Attorney General puts damper on the project. Not looking good for this thing to get going anytime soon, if at all...

http://www.wfaa.com/news/local/Irvin...112033219.html

[tamtagon]

It's back on:

http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/ne...50m-venue.html

-----------------------
The title of the thread has been updated....

[OC Dweller]

very pleased to see it go forward

the more entertainment choices near the city core, the better for all of us

[JohnMcKee]

I feel like I am reading about Victory again, warning after warning that the project is way too ambitious but still it moves forward without any substantial modification of the plan.

[tamtagon]

It's back on:

http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/ne...50m-venue.html

It's back off, probably:

http://www.wfaa.com/news/investigate...125928358.html

New numbers don't add up for Irving entertainment center

by BRETT SHIPP
WFAA
July 20, 2011

IRVING — The dream of a massive entertainment center complex in Irving has been all but dashed.
Irving City Council members learned Wednesday the city is more than $100 million short of being able to afford the Las Colinas Entertainment Center as originally proposed.

...An outside audit then discovered $4 million in questionable expenses.

... Beth Van Duyne was elected as the city's new mayor. ... calling for a fraud audit of past project expenses, she wants to know if the city even afford the project. The answer, according to financial advisors: Of the $200 million the city was to borrow to build the project, only about $65 million is actually available.

...The final nail in the project's coffin could come Thursday night when Council members are expected to vote on whether to appeal a ruling that blocks their access to the state mixed beverage tax. If the city votes to drop that appeal, then they effectively abandon all hope that the $250 million Entertainment Center project will ever be built.

[AeroD]

So what happens to that big ass building they just built? Paint-ball? Whole Foods?

[Kelley USA]

As a resident of Las Colinas, this area just drives me nuts! There is an enermous amount of potential for big developments like this. I know the economy is bad, but I see development occuring in other cities around DFW. Currently there are 3 residential developments being built (prices starting at $350K and going up to $1 million), there is an AMLI apartment community being built and 2-3 more expected to start by the end of this year. If a developer would take a chance and build something like The Shops @ Legacy or Waters Creek or Village at Fairview it would be crazy successful! People in Las Colinas are craving something like that! I'm still amazed that we don't have a Whole Foods or Central Market. That seems like a no-brainer for this area!

[AeroD]

As a resident of Las Colinas, this area just drives me nuts! There is an enermous amount of potential for big developments like this. I know the economy is bad, but I see development occuring in other cities around DFW. Currently there are 3 residential developments being built (prices starting at $350K and going up to $1 million), there is an AMLI apartment community being built and 2-3 more expected to start by the end of this year. If a developer would take a chance and build something like The Shops @ Legacy or Waters Creek or Village at Fairview it would be crazy successful! People in Las Colinas are craving something like that! I'm still amazed that we don't have a Whole Foods or Central Market. That seems like a no-brainer for this area!

It has always seem odd that Las Colinas Town Center has not taken off. You guys have a relatively large body of water that people can hang out at unlike that sorry excuse of a creek that Watters place in Allen has, or the pond Legacy has. You have access to to both airports all that jazz.

Las Colinas should be Legacy Town Center on steriods.

[Kelley USA]

^ Agree 100%! There is no place in Las Colinas for people to go. Everyone I know that lives here goes to Addison, Plano or Uptown to hang out. There is NOTHING here! Lake Carolyn is just screaming for something bad ace to be built on it. Furthermore, we have the DART Orange Line that is being constructed (it's looking great)... The Water Street development by Gables showed promise but after several years they finally cancelled it. There was talk of North Shore which was being developed by FRAM, Hunt Real Estate and Trademark (some heavy players) but a year later there has been no movement. Not even a sign was placed on the property to drum up some interest. Here's an older article about the development:

http://www.trademarkproperty.com/new...t-las-colinas-

[Texan#1]

The City of Irving needs to market the area better. I'm always amazed that so many people in DFW have no idea that the area with the canal and gondolas even exists. The foundation to get something great going is there, but no one is willing to take a chance. Hopefully, one day there will be restaurants and shops all along the canal. Now that Herbert Gears is gone, we should expect to find out what happened to all the money the city spent on the redevelopment of old downtown Irving and this Las Colinas complex. Delbert McDougal and Billy Bob Barnett are laughing their way to the bank and Irving taxpayers are left clueless as to what happened.

[profbarium]

Don't forget the students at the U. of Dallas, almost all of which (approx. 1300-1500 undergrad) live either on or within half a mile of campus. Many don't have automobiles, and, at present, the only establishment that doesn't require a car to reach is the convenience store on Northgate. DART's new Orange Line ought to give them a lot more flexibility, but they'll still need places to go...

[homeworld1031tx]

A city funded entertainment district isn't my idea of a good bet, but I really don't understand why Waterstreet (read: Las Colinas Town Square) hasn't started construction (especially considering they reclaimed a bunch of land for it - which can't be cheap....)

[tamtagon]

... I'm always amazed that so many people in DFW have no idea that the area with the canal and gondolas even exists....

Too bad a canal hasn't been planned as part of the entertainment complex, Convention Center and hotel....

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...ent-center.ece

By BRANDON FORMBY
02 March 2012

The City Council agreed Friday night to spend up to $200,000 to get public ratings on its planned $210 million Las Colinas entertainment center bond package.
...But opponents questioned funding the process when the council has yet to finalize proposed changes to its contract with Las Colinas Group or receive proof from the company that it has secured its $80 million private contribution to the project.

[txdore]

Don't forget the students at the U. of Dallas, almost all of which (approx. 1300-1500 undergrad) live either on or within half a mile of campus. Many don't have automobiles, and, at present, the only establishment that doesn't require a car to reach is the convenience store on Northgate. DART's new Orange Line ought to give them a lot more flexibility, but they'll still need places to go...

Interesting. Sounds like pent-up retail demand ready to get off campus. The only stuff I knew about UD was from friends that were commuting there to get a masters, doctorate, or to teach. What's odd is the school and community would be so much better if it was in an neighborhood and not sandwiched by a couple of freeways, RR and creeks.

[profbarium]

Interesting. Sounds like pent-up retail demand ready to get off campus. The only stuff I knew about UD was from friends that were commuting there to get a masters, doctorate, or to teach. What's odd is the school and community would be so much better if it was in an neighborhood and not sandwiched by a couple of freeways, RR and creeks.

You may be right about the location, and are almost certainly right about pent-up demand. The University owns a great deal of the land (several hundred, if not thousand acres) out that way, while the "campus" only sits on a small portion.. When the it was founded (in the mid '50s), one might even have called that land rural. But then came Texas Stadium, the airport, Las Colinas, and the corresponding freeway expansion (among other things). Hopefully the extension and expansion of DART will allow the students better access to the community--and vice versa.

[gchrisbailey]

Drove through the urban area today...there is dirt moving in the lot north of the Alta lofts on Lake Carolyn Pkwy near California Crossing. Also got dirt moving to the east of Lincoln Lakeside. Hadn't been there in a while...driving around the lake, it just seems like we're going to see major building construction getting underway soon. The Orange Line is going to really transform Las Colinas. Would really like to see a new "tallest" for Las Colinas, like 30 or 40 stories. That vacant lot just to the south of Urban Towers seems like a perfect fit.

...also nice to have Las Colinas Blvd. now complete from the Urban Center to North MacArthur.

[Kelley USA]

There are 3 apartment complexes underway right now... The 2 you mentioned- one is Maple Multi Family, the other is Phase 2 for Lincoln- and there is another just across Las Colinas Blvd from Lincoln. I believe a 4th is slated to start soon between Lake Carolyn Pkwy and NW HWY, I've seen them out doing soil samples a few times. I feel like momentum is starting to build in this area. I'm actually getting ready to post something in Las Colinas Development thread about Water Street.

[tamtagon]

It's not looking good.... Frankly, I think Irving is trying too soon to wed an entertainment complex the convention center.

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...nt-project.ece

By BRANDON FORMBY
03 June 2012

Irving officials spent more than $37 million developing the planned Las Colinas entertainment center long before they sought verification of what they could afford to spend on construction. How City Council members view those expenditures may factor into the fate of the project now that a bond rating agency has effectively blocked the plan for Irving’s $170 million contribution to the complex.

...Standard & Poor’s last week gave the city’s proposed financing a B rating, below the investment-grade rating that state law requires the city to achieve before selling bonds.

“We need to get the city to agree this is the direction it wants to go and give us enough time to get everything lined up,” said David Margulies, a spokesman for Las Colinas Group ... If someone else breaks ground first or Irving turns it down, the city will be stuck with a large empty lot and Irving residents will continue to spend their money outside of the city for dining and entertainment,” Margulies said. Those assertions didn’t seem to faze Van Duyne, who said the developers have long claimed Irving is the only place a project such as this one would work. Van Duyne said she wouldn’t likely support a fundraising extension.

There's no doubt in my mind a concentration of restaurants, bars, music venues, and, well, just a general focal point for Las Colinas night life scene is needed, but there's a curious disconnection in trying to motivate municipal decision makers that Irving residents will lose out on a good thing yet the scope and scale of the complex seems to targets out of towners, conventioneers. The complex proposes a redundancy of amenities already widespread throughout the region....

[Random Traffic Guy]

It's not looking good.... Frankly, I think Irving is trying too soon to wed an entertainment complex the convention center.

The Jawas are a solitary people. Their sandcrawler provides all the entertainment they need.

[muncien]

Either way... The city needs to make a decision. There are far too many projects sitting on the sidelines waiting to see what happens with this (The Peninsula, Water Street, etc). The retail proposed by both of these projects will be depending on more traffic than is currently available in the Urban Center.
Personally, I believe it is in the city's best interest to get this going as soon as possible (Las Colinas isn't getting any younger). Although, I do agree that the $170 mil contribution was ridiculous for the city to shoulder. The new proposal of dropping LCG and providing $100mil and keeping the fee $ sounds like a far more realistic alternative.
Bottom line... Get it going, or back out. I'm confident that if the project drops, more residential based alternatives will replace those currently waiting to build... and eventually there will be enough residences to support a realistic retail project (with, or without entertainment venue). After all, the residential projects there now are performing extremely well... even at very high rates. There definitely is demand for that...

[txdore]

I do agree there are several projects waiting to see what the COI is going to do, but I think they are waiting so they'll know whether to have retail or not. Why build retail/restaurants when they city will build their own (and likely subsidize tenants somehow)?

Frankly, LC has all the retail/restaurant it needs - expect it was all built up MacArthur & LBJ. Again, most stuff built in LC are either catering to the walk ups from nearby residential (which isn't a big enough market) or they're competing against all the big box and and pads up north.

IMHO, the city needs to give it up. It's a hole and a redundant one at that.

[muncien]

Got this off the www.forirvingsfuture.com site (IEC developer). New proposal reduced city contribution to 40 million (considerably less than the 170mil shot down last week). The rest will be footed by developer partners. Says work on 1st phase (don't we all love phases) could begin in the next couple of weeks with city's buy in. I'm sure with VanDuyne at the helm, it won't happen... but this sounds like a huge leap forward from a fiscal standpoint.

New Proposal for Irving Entertainment Center Eliminates Risk for City
Private Investors will Invest $210 Million
Irving, Texas (June 12, 2012) – Private investors are offering to underwrite $210 million
of the $250 million cost of the Irving Entertainment Center (IEC) and guarantee the $40
million in special obligation bonds for the project. The offer is being made to keep
momentum moving ahead for the project, which will create thousands of jobs and turn
around the city’s eroding commercial tax base.
“We have made a good faith effort to address concerns some council members have
had with this project,” said Bobby Page, TDI Managing Partner. “The $40 million in
bonds can be issued at an investment grade rating based only on the 2 percent Hotel
Occupancy Tax (HOT).”
Work on the first phase of the IEC could begin in the next couple of weeks because the
investors are willing to begin construction on the site utilizing funds available from a
portion of the 2 percent HOT that has already been collected. The investors have
offered to share the costs of this work up to $2 million on a 50/50 basis.
“The investors have shown their good faith and commitment to the project,” said David
S. Margulies, spokesperson for the investors. “The investors are offering to take on the
risk of the project financing and take responsibility for any shortfall to cover the HOT
bonds or any cost overruns.”
“It would be difficult to imagine what else they can do to demonstrate their commitment
to investing in Irving for the good of the entire community,” said Page. “We expect the
IEC will reduce the homeowner taxes by 10-15 percent."
“This economic engine is shovel-ready,” added Page. “We want to work closely with
elected officials and city staff so that we can move forward on this project. We are
hopeful the City is willing to meet with us to get going."

[AeroD]

I guess what could be driving VanDuyne is the fact that after the Cowboys left, Irving did not see revenue shortfall. Let's face it the entertainment complex was a feel good project intended to take the sting off the fact Cowboys Stadium left. So why have the City shell out all this money for an entertainment center? If the private investors want to do it...great.

[muncien]

Saw this letter from LCG's lawyers to the city... (just posted today)
http://forirvingsfuture.com/forirvin...o%20Parker.pdf

In a nutshell... City won't meet with LCG > LCG claims this is in breach of existing contracts > LCG is not concerned with breach, but wants to discuss to get the project going.

It's hard to see this ending well. It's a shame as the last offer from LCG seems like a great deal for the city. Unfortunately, it seems the mayor has her heels dug in to deep on this and the new counsel members are apparently dead set against any deal.

[muncien]

From the Dallas Business Journal,

Friedman: Irving may be saying the 'L' word over development
Dallas Business Journal by Candace Carlisle, Staff Writer
Date: Friday, July 6, 2012, 2:47pm CDT - Last Modified: Friday, July 6, 2012, 2:48pm CDT

Tensions between the City of Irving and the development group behind the proposed $250 million Irving Entertainment Center has reached a new level.
"We are doing everything we can to avoid the L-word," said Larry Friedman, one of Dallas' high-powered attorneys and partner at the law offices of Friedman & Feiger LLP , who was hired by the development group, the Las Colinas Group LP.
The L-word: Litigation.
"We are bending over backwards because litigation like this could last for 10 or 15 years — which would tie up the property and be a blight to the city," he said.
Irving's proposed $170 million bond package — its portion of the financial burden of the project — did not receive a AAA Standard & Poor's rating earlier this year, which was a requirement for the Irving Entertainment Center to move forward.
The Las Colinas Group has sent several proposals over to the city, saying the group would take over the majority of the funding of the proposed 550,000-square-foot entertainment venue. However, the city hasn't responded.
When I recently spoke to Irving Mayor Beth Van Duyne, she said she would ensure the City of Irving upheld its contracts and obligations, but she declined to comment further.
Friedman said he was hired by the developer after the city hired Parker Young, whom Friedman said is "a good litigation attorney," who said the development group could no longer directly communicate with city workers. Young is an attorney with Figari & Davenport .
The hiring of Young, who declined comment through a secretary, was premature on behalf of the city, Friedman said.
Why? Because there's a contract deadline through August and — if there are differences between the city and the development group — they should be worked out, he said.
"If there is a business hurdle, you can solve it if you have all the parties in one room," Friedman said.

[muncien]

Irving entertainment center backers gearing up for deadline push
http://irvingblog.dallasnews.com/arc...center-ba.html

I can't see this ending any other way than the push failing > the city thinking they're in the clear > the developer suing > and we all get screwed...
I think the city has completely missed the ball on this one and I, myself as well as all other Irving tax payers are going to pay the price.

[muncien]

Irving City Counsel members fail to show up for meeting on Irving Entertainment Center. This is an absolutely pathetic showing by folks who are supposed to represent us. Unfortunately, developer is going to use this against us in court as we are still under contract (until tomorrow) and by not showing up we are failing to meet our obligations. These members MUST be held accountable.

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...ion=reregister

[muncien]

Cities contract with the developer expired last night after the counsel voted 5-4 against extending it. Future is uncertain... Las Colinas Group (developer) has said it will sue, but the city says it is looking forward to new contract negotiations with quasi-new developer TDI that was actually part of the old developers proposal. Time will tell...
http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...ion=reregister

[BigD5349]

Looks like the lawsuits have begun:

http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/ne...t-against.html

[AeroD]

Looks like the lawsuits have begun:

http://www.bizjournals.com/dallas/ne...t-against.html

So let me get this right, the developers are basically suing Irving voters for voting the "wrong" way?

[tamtagon]

What a mess. I think the entertainment center would have been fine eventually, but just really better after a couple more years go by.....

Might be a good time for Dallas to "steel" the concept back and get it built into/next to the convention center as initially envisioned.... Jack Matthews et al seem to be struggling to figure out what's supposed to come after the hotel - duh, a tourist friendly entertainment complex. Upgrading/updating the City Auditorium is way overdue....

Irving was too ambitions? I bet the city gets out of any major financial consequences.

[rantanamo]

another potential olympic venue for downtown

[BigD5349]

Irving was too ambitions? I bet the city gets out of any major financial consequences.

The Mayor of Irving was on TV basically saying, "we're done," but then she also said the City is open to any serious offers from other groups to get the project moving. I tried to imagine what group would come in with a big investment if the ability of Irving to step up with more funding is almost certainly not going to happen... this thing is totally done. What a waste of $40M, probably nearly the same amount Dallas has wasted studying the Trinity River Tollroad.

[tamtagon]

I don't know, sometimes when I read some of this stuff, I just wonder how we got so whacked out.

http://www.dallasnews.com/news/commu...artnership.ece

The city tried to get financing for a $170 million contribution, but found out in May that it couldn’t afford that large of a bond package. Las Colinas Group’s suit accuses the city of breaking the two entities’ agreement by not trying to put together a smaller bond package.

I'm sure it's happened before, but I wonder how often a municipality sues a company for the same reason.... Public-Private agreement to build something fancy and expensive, municipality pledges support, company pledges support, everything gets studied, company backs out because it doesn't have the money, gets sued by municipality.

As much as I love the prideful boosterism that has brought an abundance of fantastic civic amenities to the both sides of the Metroplex, this deal in Irving was just getting forced, it's not time.

[muncien]

^^^
Unfortunately, we're (Irving) now stuck with a convention center sitting out on it's own little island with no supporting venues. These items were linked together for a reason, and each supported the other. I really don't think the concept was ahead of its time... The Las Colinas area is booming (especially just outside of the Urban Center) and there is certainly a critical mass to support something like this. But, with the 'bad blood' generated from this failed deal (whomever responsible) will make it extremely difficult for the city to find a partner to work with going forward.
The convention center hotel which is now being planned seems less likely to lure bids without the entertainment center as well.
If any good news (and this is a reach), I read that the city counsel is looking at reducing the dreadful 60/40 alcohol law that has bound the hands of small private business owners for so many years. The most voiceful supporter of 60/40 (Joe Putnam) is open to the idea of 50/50 while business are advocating a 40/60 level (if any).

[tamtagon]

So this thing is dead and buried, right? Law suits are done and settled, it all fell apart..... the city might still have something pending against it, reneging on something....?

It's a great idea to have a wide variety of entertainment venues in Las Colinas, but that crop just not ready to harvest.

[Kelley USA]

Not sure about totally dead, but it's pretty dang close. I think TDI still has a big interest in developing the property. Remember TDI is the same company that's getting ready to break ground on a new apartment complex just steps away from this site. I have a feeling they may make a new pitch to the Council at some point, and hopefully all sides can work together. If we can get the CC Hotel going, this entertainment development and Water Street going Las Colinas will be something special!

[muncien]

So this thing is dead and buried, right? Law suits are done and settled, it all fell apart..... the city might still have something pending against it, reneging on something....?

It's a great idea to have a wide variety of entertainment venues in Las Colinas, but that crop just not ready to harvest.

I don't think the law suits are done and settled yet. The court threw out a bunch, but there's still contractual $ on the table. According to city hall, they intend to look for a new developer for this but until everything gets settled in court, they're in no hurry. From what I've heard, they have tens of millions of dollars of plans which are still perfectly good when the next developer is brave enough to venture into this arena.
Last I heard, the convention center hotel is now under bid, but I have a hard time seeing that play out without the Entertainment Center. The North Shore development across the street may help, but it too was probably leveraging the IEC.
Unfortunately, the city leadership seems oblivious to the implications these projects have on one another... and when they renege on a deal, they set a bad precedent for the others.

[muncien]

Just when you thought it was dead and gone... The Irving Entertainment Center (or, "Irving Music Factory") seems to be clawing its way out of the grave...

A confidential document given to council members last week outlines a tentative deal they could vote on Thursday to make another go at bringing an entertainment center to Las Colinas.
Under the deal, a Louisiana company specializing in entertainment centers, Ark Promotions, would pay to design and build an 6,500 person capacity amphitheater, plaza and indoor concert hall next to the Irving Convention Center. The surrounding complex would house at least nine restaurants and 5,000 square feet of retail space. It would be called the Irving Music Factory, and Ark would have to break ground by the end of 2014 and finish construction by summer 2016.
In return, Irving would build a parking garage and offer Ark tens of millions of dollars worth of tax rebates. These would include 2 percent of the hotel taxes collected city-wide. A city source estimated the hotel taxes would be worth about $40 million over several decades, but by law that money has to be used on an entertainment center anyway....