DCTA: A-Train

[BryanSmyth]

Ooh exciting stuff coming to Denton County. I'd really like to see the entire commuter line run all the way to Dallas. That way you don't have to transfer in Carrolton. DART trains would be pretty crowded before it left the first station. Wasn't this the problem they had in Plano, with buses coming from Sherman to Plano and loading everyone on there? Trains were too crowded.

Chris

The way I read the article, the proposed commuter train will use the MKT line (which actually stands for Missouri-Kansas-Texas, not Missouri Kansas Trail) from Denton to Carrolton. In Carrolton, the trains will then connect to and utilize the DART ROW to travel further south. The article never mentions the terminus point in DTD, but I assume it will be Union Station. There will be no transfer needed to reach DTD...that would just be silly. Did anyone else think the same about the MKT alternative when they read this article? This article can be a bit confusing.

[RobertB]

The way I read the article, the proposed commuter train will use the MKT line (which actually stands for Missouri-Kansas-Texas, not Missouri Kansas Trail) from Denton to Carrolton. In Carrolton, the trains will then connect to and utilize the DART ROW to travel further south. The article never mentions the terminus point in DTD, but I assume it will be Union Station. There will be no transfer needed to reach DTD...that would just be silly. Did anyone else think the same about the MKT alternative when they read this article? This article can be a bit confusing.

Tranferring in Carrollton to get to downtown isn't silly, it's darn near essential. The Orange Line LRT to Carrollton will cut off two segments of freight track between Carrollton and Union Station, so there won't be a direct link. The only way to run a commuter train from Carrollton to DTD will be via Irving, using the BNSF tracks.

And in case you get the idea that DART is just trying to make things difficult, I would refer you to my detailed analysis of the engineering challenges required to preserve the freight lines that are still active in the area: NW to Carrollton: More Complex Than You Thought

[tamtagon]

Tranferring in Carrollton to get to downtown isn't silly, it's darn near essential. The Orange Line LRT to Carrollton will cut off two segments of freight track between Carrollton and Union Station, so there won't be a direct link. The only way to run a commuter train from Carrollton to DTD will be via Irving, using the BNSF tracks.

And in case you get the idea that DART is just trying to make things difficult, I would refer you to my detailed analysis of the engineering challenges required to preserve the freight lines that are still active in the area: NW to Carrollton: More Complex Than You Thought

Would it be feasible to build light rail in Denton County? Is that too expensive for still rural Denton County?

[RobertB]

Would it be feasible to build light rail in Denton County? Is that too expensive for still rural Denton County?

I've tried to figure out why DART didn't propose running commuter rail instead of LRT for the whole NW/SE corridor. The best reason I can see is that LRT does really well when stations are close together. The trains start and stop quickly, quietly, and efficiently. The traditional diesel engines, on the other hand, take a long time to start and stop, and they're not quite whisper-quiet. If the TRE is a good example, it's fair to say that commuter rail works best when stations are far apart, so the engine can build up speed.

With those parameters in mind, it really looks like commuter rail is the best solution for the stretch from Carrollton to Denton. That's 25 miles with just a handful of stations (Carrollton, Lewisville, Corinth/Lake Dallas, Denton), perfect for an 85mph run between stations. Contrast with the Carrollton-Dallas segment, with 13 stations squeezed into just 16 miles -- clearly better served by LRT.

[Haretip]

The way I read the article, the proposed commuter train will use the MKT line (which actually stands for Missouri-Kansas-Texas, not Missouri Kansas Trail) from Denton to Carrolton. In Carrolton, the trains will then connect to and utilize the DART ROW to travel further south. The article never mentions the terminus point in DTD, but I assume it will be Union Station. There will be no transfer needed to reach DTD...that would just be silly. Did anyone else think the same about the MKT alternative when they read this article? This article can be a bit confusing.
[/font]

As I recall, the NW-3 plans that I was working with did not include through freight train service along the Katy (MKT). As has been discussed in a previous thread, DART does some very interesting gymnastics of the Light Rail line and the freight spurs in order to maintain service along the Denton Drive corridor. I do not think it would be possible to operate a regular train from DTD(enton) to DTD(allas).

It is interesting to read some of the misconceptions about railroads on here, and I try to set the facts straight when I can. COMMUTER RAIL AND LIGHT RAIL DO NOT RUN ON THE SAME TRACKS. Light rail does not meet federal standards for operation in the regular railroad environment and is only used on dual purpose tracks with temporal separation.

While I have not seen their plans, DCTA will most likely be delivering passengers to the Carrollton Station for transfer to the light rail system.

[BryanSmyth]

I stand corrected. Obviously, I have not performed a detailed analysis of the alternatives, and was merely stating my interpretation of the article. The article states, "Ms. Marshall said a commuter rail – carting students, workers and shoppers from Denton to Dallas – would ease pollution by reducing Interstate 35E traffic." I don't think any of us knows the facts; however, this article led me to believe the commuter train would connect Denton to Dallas(as stated above in the quote)....not Denton to Carrollton.

However, I never wrote the commuter line would use DART lines, just DART right-of way. And I realize this was an assumption based on the confusing article...considering the article mentions "connecting to DART lines." Why didn't the journalist say, "with passenger connections to DART LRT?" I mean...if that's what he really wanted to say.

After being gratiously invited by RobertB to read more info, I now know why utilizing DART ROW will be difficult (sigh). However, that does not change my opinion that it's "silly" not to provide a direct route to DTD. I love that word -- silly. It has too much character not to be used more often. I guess my only hope is that the commuter line will connect the downtowns of Denton and Dallas using the BNSF alternative.

Anyway, thanks for the info.

If anyone enjoys mountain biking, check out this website: http://www.bikekatytrail.com . Sort of on topic considering we're talking about the KATY lines. I'm going to do the whole thing in September 2005.

[tamtagon]

DART does some very interesting gymnastics of the Light Rail line and the freight spurs in order to maintain service along the Denton Drive corridor. I do not think it would be possible to operate a regular train from DTD(enton) to DTD(allas).

That's why I'm wondering if, in the long run, the dormant train line from Carrollton to Denton would better meet the needs of rail customers if converted for light rail use. Assuming the SE quadrant of Denton County swells by at least another 200,000 residents within 20 years, the additional up front cost of light rail modifications would be a much better investment. Long haul riders would not have to switch trains, planned stations (perhaps including the suburban DART stations) would allow for express trains, future Denton County station locations would be clearly identified bringing superior community focused developments which incorporate the train as well as the highway. Also, if DART, The T, and DCTA all operate identical systems of light rail, the overall cost should be lower and connectivity would be maximized.

Would this simply cost too much?

[dfwcre8tive]

Here are some things that I found from the DCTA service plan document:

"The Service Plan’s concept is to implement initial rail service in Denton County to connect with Dallas Area Rapid Transit light rail transit (LRT) facilities. At a minimum, it is DCTA’s intent to work as a partner with DART to develop as seamless a service as possible for DCTA and DART riders. There may also be an opportunity to work with DART, through regional funding support by the metropolitan planning organization (NCTCOG and the Regional Transportation Council) to develop regional rail service to the planned Belt Line Road Intermodal Transportation Center. That would allow not only north-south service between Denton and Dallas County destinations, but also eventual east-west services along the Cotton Belt rail corridor, and the possibility of service directly to Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport.

Vehicles--
The vehicle being considered for “regional rail” service is a type of Diesel-Multiple Unit (DMU) vehicle, as depicted in this rendering. DMU’s are self-propelled diesel-powered trains that operate in trainsets of one to three passenger cars. Newer generations of DMU’s, called “regional rail” vehicles, are approaching light rail vehicles in service characteristics and appearance.

Proposed Longer-Term Expansion Alternatives--
Carrollton to Dallas (same seat service)
This future segment will be explored at a time when technology is available to provide same-seat
service from Denton to downtown Dallas."

There is an interesting link to the different kinds of Colorado Rail Car, and it looks like DCTA will go with a similar type of train. As far as "same seat service" to Dallas from Denton, are there dual diesel / electric DMU trains in production? A diesel DMU could run from Denton to Carrollton, then "switch" to electric and use the DART ROW / wires to Dallas. Is this technology available?

[dfwcre8tive]

Rail options split transit board
Cost, convenience among factors in deciding 2 routes

08:34 PM CST on Thursday, March 31, 2005
By JAY PARSONS / The Dallas Morning News

Two long-awaited commuter rail options divide Denton County's landscape like scissors. They also have split a 12-member board that must select the best proposal for commuters craving efficient mass transit. A divided Denton County Transportation Authority may be tilted by the municipalities least affected by commuter rail, notably The Colony and Little Elm. Officials from those areas say they would probably favor the cheaper route.

Which route that will be remains unclear. The authority will release a report next month outlining the costs and impacts of both routes. From there, the board will hold public hearings, choose a route and apply for federal funding in hopes of constructing most of the rail line by 2011.

Both start in Denton and connect to Dallas Area Rapid Transit in Carrollton, linking to a planned DART stop and connecting Denton County commuters with downtown Dallas. One route hugs Interstate 35E; the other traces the Kansas City Southern (KCS) rail line to the west, through Copper Canyon and Highland Village.

City councils in Denton and Highland Village didn't wait for the study's release to pass resolutions urging DCTA to choose a route. Denton favors the I-35E option, hoping it will spur development. Highland Village wants the KCS line, believing it could lure shoppers to its future commercial corridor at FM407 and FM2499. The two routes merge in northern Lewisville, so the county's second-biggest city will choose a route based on technology and costs, said DCTA Chairman Charles Emery, who represents Lewisville.

Choosing a route is more complicated than scanning a map. Each route has obstacles:

•Denton's choice is the former Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line along I-35E. Most of that line was removed years ago, creating nine miles of nature trails through Corinth. DART owns most of the right of way, leaving this route fewer obstacles. "MKT serves the heart of the congestion," said Tom Spencer, who lives in Shady Shores and represents small cities on DCTA. "We're filled in here. My personal feelings are you serve the growth you have, that just makes sense."

Highland Village's choice is the KCS rail line, still owned and operated by the rail company. DCTA could try to buy the line or lease it during certain hours. A second line would be built for two-way traffic. This option is clouded by KCS. Freight lines are more crowded than ever, and KCS will not negotiate until DCTA chooses this route. "It would be a great incentive for people to relocate to Highland Village," said City Manager Michael Leavitt, a DCTA member. "This is a very corporate city with people used to the L in Chicago or the Metro in D.C." Highland Village also hopes a rail station near the FM407 and FM2499 intersection would attract shoppers – and sales tax revenue – to a planned commercial corridor.

Highland Village hopes the KCS line will woo Flower Mound and Corinth. The Highland Village station would be very close to the Flower Mound border. A Flower Mound DCTA member said he will follow the orders of the City Council, which has yet to discuss the routes. Corinth sides with Highland village. The city would keep its nature trail and be within easy driving distance of the Highland Village station once the FM2499 extension connects the cities. "A Highland Village station will at least provide some access to Corinth commuters living on the western side of the city without hurting the lifestyle of people on the eastern side," said Paul Ruggiere, a Corinth DCTA member. The Corinth City Council will vote Thursday on a resolution supporting the KCS line, said Mayor Vic Burgess, who said he strongly favors that route.

At least four DCTA board members indicated they would favor the MKT line. Most reasoned: That's where most of the population is. If Flower Mound sides with Highland Village, the KCS line should get at least three votes. That leaves five other board members. Two could not be reached, and three said they are undecided. The biggest factor for the undecided cities will be cost, representatives from The Colony and Little Elm said. "If we don't get matching funds, we're not going anywhere," said Randy Hunt, who lives near Krum and represents unincorporated territory. "A half-cent sales tax isn't enough to make anything happen."

A preliminary DCTA cost estimate for the rail line was $240 million. Three cities – Denton, Highland Village and Lewisville – are contributing sales taxes for the commuter rail. DCTA officials hope most of the money will come from state bonds and federal funding.

E-mail jparsons@dallasnews.com
or call 972-436-5551, ext. 2002

[tamtagon]

Thanks, njjeppson.

[RobertB]

I think the most encouraging thing about the article is that there is a lively debate about where the commuter rail line should go. Not WHETHER there should be rail service to Dallas, but WHERE it should be routed. Even the "why should I care" representatives are talking in terms of getting additional funding -- when they could just as easily be filing lawsuits in hopes of bringing on death by infinite delay.

[texman]

I think the most encouraging thing about the article is that there is a lively debate about where the commuter rail line should go. Not WHETHER there should be rail service to Dallas, but WHERE it should be routed. Even the "why should I care" representatives are talking in terms of getting additional funding -- when they could just as easily be filing lawsuits in hopes of bringing on death by infinite delay.

It seems most Metroplex minds have changed in favor of rail from 10 years ago. I hope they go with the MKT line.

[saxman66]

I'm a little unsure of which line I'd prefer as well. Both have their merits. I wonder what the effect on traffic will be for 35E. I'd love to ride next to 35E as I whiz past the cars all jammed up on that road. That road is a parking lot these days. If you take the KCS line, there is the deal of working with the freight line. Also it goes through alot more unincorporated areas. That area has lots of houses sitting on large plots of land with stables and the such. We'll see how long that area stays like that. It's still farely quiet. The 35E corridor, I think will atract alot more pax in the short term. Yet that line will need to be upgraded, as those tracks look pretty rough. Maybe one day, both lines will be used, only when I'm very old.

[BryanSmyth]

More news....written by the same journalist, but much more detailed this time around.


<!-- vstory begin -->Most cost-effective rail route ends in downtown Denton



Expense-per-rider would meet federal funding criteria


10:24 PM CDT on Wednesday, May 11, 2005

By DAVE MOORE / Denton Record-Chronicle

DENTON – A route that ends in downtown Denton is the most cost-effective for commuter rail service from Denton to Dallas, a consultant said Wednesday.

URS Corp. associate Tim Baldwin told the Denton County Transportation Authority board that the average rider would cost the DCTA $15.05 per year using that route. Denver-based URS arrived at the figure by dividing the annual construction, operating and maintenance costs by the number of riders per year.

To receive federal funding, rail projects in 2006 must cost $15.22 or less per rider per year, according to Mr. Baldwin.

"With this analysis, we move beyond the emotion" of those opposing the line, said DCTA board member Randy Hunt.

Mr. Hunt wouldn't specify who has been objecting to rail talks, but some residents in Corinth have voiced concerns about how the train line, proposed along a Missouri-Kansas-Texas line, would disrupt their neighborhoods.

In another alternative, URS has proposed spending $20 million to move the line parallel to Interstate 35E and away from the neighborhoods. But that pushes the cost of the project up $1 per rider per year.

The authority was created by a countywide vote in 2003, with a majority of the voters in Denton, Lewisville and Highland Village approving. Its mission is to create and operate mass transit systems for Denton County that would connect to the Dallas area.

The DCTA has been collecting its half-cent sales tax since January 2004 and has been holding public meetings and forums.

The cost analysis given Wednesday is not the final recommendation from URS. The consultant will publicly disclose that at meetings Monday and Tuesday in Denton and Highland Village, respectively.

The DCTA board will use that recommendation and other public input to choose the best way to reduce commuter congestion on Interstate 35E. They are to vote on a route at a meeting May 26.

Mr. Baldwin said community input also will influence URS' recommendation of which commuting option is the best choice.

The rail option determined to be second-most cost-efficient was using the Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line to downtown Carrollton, then heading south to Las Colinas using the Burlington-Northern-Santa Fe rail line, parallel to the existing Trinity Railway Express line to Union Station in downtown Dallas.

But that would increase construction costs by at least $100 million, according to URS documents. That route's ridership would be higher, which would reduce the cost to $15.29 per passenger per year, Mr. Baldwin said.

The option was put in the mix at the advice of the federal officials, who wanted an alternative route in case Dallas Area Rapid Transit doesn't extend its rail line north to Carrollton. The URS analysis on the Burlington route assumes that the DART extension to Carrollton wouldn't be completed, Mr. Baldwin said.

One advantage to the Burlington route would be that riders wouldn't need to transfer trains in their commutes between Dallas and Denton, Mr. Baldwin said. Currently, the DCTA plans to have riders transfer from its passenger train cars in Carrollton to board DART light-rail cars, Mr. Baldwin said.

The Denton County rail line could be completed as early as 2011, depending upon DART's timeline, Baldwin said.

[texman]

It would be cool if this went all the way to Dallas. I know the option is more expensive, but transfers hamper ridership.

[Haretip]

Well, it would be even cooler if they just put in light rail all the way to Denton, then no transfers needed.

[RobertB]

The rail option determined to be second-most cost-efficient was using the Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line to downtown Carrollton, then heading south to Las Colinas using the Burlington-Northern-Santa Fe rail line, parallel to the existing Trinity Railway Express line to Union Station in downtown Dallas.

But that would increase construction costs by at least $100 million, according to URS documents. That route's ridership would be higher, which would reduce the cost to $15.29 per passenger per year, Mr. Baldwin said.

The option was put in the mix at the advice of the federal officials, who wanted an alternative route in case Dallas Area Rapid Transit doesn't extend its rail line north to Carrollton. The URS analysis on the Burlington route assumes that the DART extension to Carrollton wouldn't be completed, Mr. Baldwin said.

One advantage to the Burlington route would be that riders wouldn't need to transfer trains in their commutes between Dallas and Denton, Mr. Baldwin said. Currently, the DCTA plans to have riders transfer from its passenger train cars in Carrollton to board DART light-rail cars, Mr. Baldwin said.

The Denton County rail line could be completed as early as 2011, depending upon DART's timeline, Baldwin said.

It looks to me like the BNSF option is pretty much a non-starter then, if the ridership numbers are predicated on DART not building out to Carrollton. If DART doesn't get that Carrollton/FB LRT line built, one way or another, then those suburbs will revolt.

Texman, I think the best chance for a direct, no-transfer route between Denton and Downtown Dallas will come after people start riding the one-stop route for a few years. I don't see the ROW disappearing, now that the concept of rail-based transit has caught on. Or perhaps a new generation of dual-power engines will make it feasible to run the same train on the freight tracks to the end of the LRT, then fire up the pantograph for the rest of the trip.

Let's plan big, but be happy for small steps. It wasn't that long ago that gas was 99c/gal, and a Denton County Transit Authority was just a crazy idea from those city folks.

[drumguy8800]

The option was put in the mix at the advice of the federal officials, who wanted an alternative route in case Dallas Area Rapid Transit doesn't extend its rail line north to Carrollton. The URS analysis on the Burlington route assumes that the DART extension to Carrollton wouldn't be completed, Mr. Baldwin said.

That's a horrid statement. "In case".. "Assumes that.. [the line] wouldn't be completed".. YUCK

[tamtagon]

Well, it would be even cooler if they just put in light rail all the way to Denton, then no transfers needed.

I know that's right. DART just got those cars that can go 65 mph - kinda slow between wide open Denton County stations?

[texman]

The cars have always been able to go 65mph....

[CTroyMathis]

http://www.dentonrc.com/sharedconten...26dacf0b7.html

The DCTA homes in on a commuter route
08:24 AM CDT on Friday, May 13, 2005

Officially, all proposed mass transit methods and routes remain equal in the eyes of the Denton County Transportation Authority, but some methods and routes are beginning to look more equal than others.

It’s looking more and more as though rail is the medium and Corinth is the path.

A consulting firm retained by DCTA told its board Thursday that of the two rail routes being studied, the one that runs along Interstate 35E along the old Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line is the more cost-effective. A commuter rail line along the MKT route, as it’s known, would cost about $15.05 per rider per year to operate, consultant Tim Baldwin told the board. That’s within the $15.22 limit to be eligible for federal funding, and it’s also more cost-efficient than the alternative rail routes that have been studied.

There still are some concerns about the MKT route. For one thing, it parallels the Denton Branch Rail Trail, a popular and busy bicycle thoroughfare. For another, there are scores of private homes along the trail, and as far as we know, not many of the people residing therein signed on to live next to a railroad track.

The pluses, though, seem to be outweighing the minuses at this point. The MKT route would start at a downtown terminal in Denton and would pass near the intersection of I-35E and Loop 288. Those two factors alone were probably enough to get the city of Denton and the Denton Chamber of Commerce on board as supporting it.

Now comes the DCTA’s consultant with its cost-per-head analysis, and the MKT route is beginning to look like a prohibitive favorite.

It is not a done deal. There will be a final public meeting at 6 p.m. Monday at the Martin Luther King Jr. Recreation Center in Denton to hear public comment about all the proposed routes and methods. Corinth residents who live along the proposed route have voiced opposition to the route in the past, and they’ll have a final chance to make their case.

Still on the drawing board, but not getting much public attention at this point, is a proposal for a permanent bus line between Denton and Carrollton. Frankly, this proposal seems to ignore both the reason for building a mass transit system and the realities of life along I-35E: Buses, no matter how fuel efficient and environment-friendly, would be caught up in the same highway traffic that now frustrates automobile drivers. We have spent enough time at a dead standstill — even in the HOV lane — to make us wary of boarding a bus when we’re traveling toward Dallas on a deadline.

And speaking of deadlines, the DCTA board will make its final decision May 26 on a method and a route. That meeting will start at 2 p.m. in the county commissioners’ chambers in the Courthouse on the Square.

Those who want to get their two cents’ worth in had better make it to the MLK Center on Monday, else they may find the train has left the station without them.

[RobertB]

There still are some concerns about the MKT route. For one thing, it parallels the Denton Branch Rail Trail, a popular and busy bicycle thoroughfare. For another, there are scores of private homes along the trail, and as far as we know, not many of the people residing therein signed on to live next to a railroad track.

They didn't sign on to live next to a railroad track? What, did their Realtors bring them to the open house blindfolded, or something?

[CTroyMathis]

Pin a tale on a donkey.

[dfwcre8tive]

City reaffirms rail route choice
07:16 AM CDT on Wednesday, May 25, 2005

The Denton City Council approved an updated resolution Tuesday for continued support of a commuter rail path from Carrollton to downtown Denton using an abandoned Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line, but also included support of a study of a possible spur to the Kansas City Southern rail line in Highland Village.
The Denton County Transportation Authority plans to build a line, for between $238 and $511 million, to reduce the congestion and pollution on Interstate 35E.
The council’s favored route, which it first endorsed in a February resolution, would end near the corner of Bell Avenue and Hickory Street in Denton.
It would share its path of travel with the Denton Branch Rail Trail.
— Cliff Despres

[saxman66]

I think the line should be extended down the BNSF line all the way to DTD anyways. It would be faster for those living in Denton getting to Dallas, then to transfar in Carrolton. LRT lines would already be packed before it left Carrolton, leaving no room for others down the line to get on. Wasn't this the problem they had in Plano, when a bus company was bussing pax to Plano station, and packing the inbound trains tight? I see the system like Chcago's. The El trains and Metra run parallel in many markets. The El stops very often, is less expensive to ride, and doesn't go as far out. Metra however stops less often, goes faster, yet costs slightly more to ride, plus it extends as far is Indiana and Wisconsin. This is exactly what we need. The NCTCOG has this plan anyways

[Tnekster]

Commuter train would take path of old rail line

Denton County: Plan would link city's downtown with Dallas


11:16 PM CDT on Thursday, May 26, 2005


By DAVE MOORE / Denton Record-Chronicle


DENTON – A green streak could be traveling through Denton County's core by about 2011.

The Denton County Transportation Authority on Thursday approved using an abandoned rail bed as the preferred route for a proposed $238 million commuter train line expected to connect downtown Denton with the Dallas area.

They also gave an early nod to paint the authority's trains green.

Corinth resident and DCTA board member Paul Ruggiere cast the lone vote opposing the use of the Missouri-Kansas-Texas rail line, which will share its path with the Denton Branch Rail Trail.

"The county residents are watching this process and how we handle this," Mr. Ruggiere said. "As a representative of Corinth, I can't ignore the people. The concerns of our city are real."

In prior meetings, residents of Corinth and Lake Dallas have complained that reviving the MKT line – which runs through those communities – would disrupt neighborhoods and endanger children. Some southwest Denton residents have made similar arguments.

Mr. Ruggiere said that the Corinth City Council has passed a resolution supporting a different proposed rail line – the Kansas City Southern rail line – which misses Corinth and Lake Dallas.

But Denver-based URS Corp., the consultant overseeing the alignment study, advised the transportation authority's board that using the Kansas City Southern line would cost $118 million more than the MKT route. That's because heavy freight-train use of the Kansas City Southern line would require the authority to build another set of tracks parallel to the freight line.

The city councils of Denton, Highland Village, Flower Mound and Lewisville, as well as administrators at Texas Woman's University and the University of North Texas, all support the MKT alignment, DCTA executive director John Hedrick said.

DCTA board member Tom Spencer said he advocated using green for the trains. UNT, which uses green as a school color, was not involved in the color decision for the rail line, a marketing official told the board.

"I was pushing for the green," Mr. Spencer said. "We're North Texas. Green is our color."

The authority was created by a countywide vote in 2003, with a majority of the voters in Denton, Lewisville and Highland Village approving. Its mission is to create and operate mass transit systems for Denton County that would connect to the Dallas area.

The DCTA has been collecting its half-cent sales tax since January 2004 and has been holding public meetings and forums.

DCTA is paying Ilium Associates Inc. about $65,000 to develop a brand for the agency, which includes developing a color and theme that authority trains and buses will share.

While the DCTA decides exactly what its vehicles will look like, the authority will also begin the environmental review of the MKT line, which includes notifying residents nearby that the area is under consideration for reviving rail travel.

[dfwcre8tive]

I'm glad they went with the MKT line. I grew up in Corinth and my family has lived there for the past 15+ years, before all the growth surrounded us. My parents voted to join the DCTA but most in the city didn't. I think all the complaining about the rail line through the city is stupid. I've known that was going to someday be a commuter rail line ever since I can remember. And it makes complete since to follow alongside IH35 where all of the congestion is. Just wait until the line opens... Corinth residents will beg and plead to joing DCTA and get a station so they won't have to drive to Denton or Lewisville to catch the train. And all those stuck in traffice will see the "green train" fly by.

[incrediculous]

Former MKT rail line is the best route, according to study

The regional rail system between downtown Carrollton and downtown Denton is one step closer to reality.

URS Corporation, the consultant company hired by Denton County Transportation Authority to do an alternative analysis study of ways to alleviate current and future traffic congestion, has decided that the best route for the rail system is the former MKT railroad line, said consultant Tim Baldwin.

This route parallels Interstate 35E to the east running through Lewisville, Lake Dallas and Corinth. This track is closer to I-35E allowing more access to the interstate, Baldwin said.

The MKT line would have a good ridership according to a survey done during the alternative analysis process and has the lowest cost of any of the other rail alternatives, including the Kansas City Southern railroad line, Baldwin said. This system is also more centrally located, being closer to downtown Denton, Texas Women's University, the University of North Texas and to I-35E, and has more community support, Baldwin said.

URS Corporation will take the suggestion to use the MKT line to the DCTA board meeting next week.

One problem the $240 million rail system is facing is residents from the neighborhoods the rail line runs through. Many residents of Corinth and Lake Dallas don't want to hear the increase use of the rail system adding the public transportation would make.

"Our homes back up to the rail," Lake Dallas resident David Goodnight said. "It is intrusive to our neighborhoods."

Residents are also concerned about a bike trail that runs next to the rail system.

"Trains jump tracks what are you going to do to ensure the safety of the people on the trail," Corinth council member Shannon Bryant said.

The environmental process, which is the next step, will answer more questions about the bike trail but the safety of users of the trail would be addressed by barriers or differences in levels between the track and trail, Baldwin said.

DCTA leaders hope to contact the rail system with the DART North light rail in downtown Carrollton when the light rail system is complete in 2010, Baldwin said.

But resident Jack Rochester pointed out that DART hasn't let other transportations hook on with them before and asked what insurance is there that the connection in Carrollton will be made.

Baldwin said the DCTA board has been talking with DART and they are working out the details. He also said the Trinity Railroad Express connecting Fort Worth and Dallas is a good example of different transportation systems working together.

[US75Guy]

"Our homes back up to the rail," Lake Dallas resident David Goodnight said. "It is intrusive to our neighborhoods."

Maybe buying a house backing up to a rail line wasn't such a good move. I have no patience with homeowners complaining about pre-existing conditions. Be it a rail line or Love Field, if you buy next to something like that, you need to be prepared for them to be used.

[warlock55]

Maybe buying a house backing up to a rail line wasn't such a good move. I have no patience with homeowners complaining about pre-existing conditions. Be it a rail line or Love Field, if you buy next to something like that, you need to be prepared for them to be used.

Heh, no kidding. Back when I was working in Allen, a group of homeowners who bought new houses next to a sewer line transfer station ended up suing the city and the developer because of the bad smell.

[Texan#1]

Trains jumping off tracks and hitting joggers??? how often does this happen? lame excuse!

[saxman66]

Yeah, and cars never "jump the road" and hit the joggers on the jogging trail on the side of the road. Very lame excuse. I don't usually let arguements like that bother me though.

[Haretip]

I think you have better odds of being hit by an asteroid than a derailed train coming after you.

[saxman66]

I think you have better odds of being hit by an asteroid than a derailed train coming after you.

Haha, yes I was going to mention that you have better chances of getting struck by lightning.

[incrediculous]

I think you have better odds of being hit by an asteroid than a derailed train coming after you.

[Haretip]

Yeah, and cars never "jump the road" and hit the joggers on the jogging trail on the side of the road. Very lame excuse. I don't usually let arguements like that bother me though.

Oh, I forgot to mention, if you take your hands off the steering wheel of a car, or get distracted, or fall asleep, or get bit by a bee, or see a spider, or have a heart attack, or swerve to avoid another car, you could quite easily jump the curb and run down some pedestrians. But, if any of that happens on a train, you just keep rolling down the tracks.

Good poster, incred.

[Agnus Dei]

Trains jumping off tracks and hitting joggers??? how often does this happen? lame excuse!

I want to see this argument made during a presentation to the residents.

"Imagine you're cycling along the trail. You're listening to your iPod, enjoying the fluffy-tailed bunnies and gentle breeze Just as a monarch butterfly lands on your shoulder, --BAM! A train jumps the tracks and smacks into you! Is that what you want? Is it? What about your spouse? Your children? Think of your loved ones. This train wants to kill your entire family. Do you want your tax dollars to go to a malicious train? Do you?"

*audience gasps*

A way to connect Denton to Dallas would be perfection --and to Carrolton in the meantime is also a great step. The amount of commuters in UNT always astounded me. I couldn't imagine dealing with the traffic --nearby housing was my saviour.

[tamtagon]

Residents are also concerned about a bike trail that runs next to the rail system.

"Trains jump tracks what are you going to do to ensure the safety of the people on the trail," Corinth council member Shannon Bryant said.

You might think council members would be more concerned about the people on the train; at least in a derailment, people using the bike trail would have the chance to get out of the way.

[CTroyMathis]

These people need a representative from Chicago's Metra to speak. The UPN line I take every day goes alongside the Green Bay bike/ped trail for great distances. Harmony baby.

[sterling]

It sounds like Lewisville is jockeying to become the next destination of Amish settlers. Of course, even a horse and buggy can kill if given opportunity. Beware progress!

[mikedsjr]

By my house, a whole section of land that was filled with big trees was decimated for progress. You couldn't even see through the trees it was so thick.

It's sickening. I love where I live, but I would rather see Fort Worth create laws that protect nature from developers.

[darkblood]

Well if they're so concerned about trains derailing, or too much noise in backyards of people dumb enough to buy houses next to existing rail lines, then the transit authority can just build walls. Walls are a great way to keep people, noise, and malicious trans from going where they shouldn't go. And if the neighbors don't like the way the walls look, then we can paint it. BRIGHT RAINBOW COLORS!!

:firegrin:

Darkblood
*Making people question themselves since 1978*
-2k5

[F4shionablecHa0s]

But resident Jack Rochester pointed out that DART hasn't let other transportations hook on with them before and asked what insurance is there that the connection in Carrollton will be made.

When has DART ever refused to let another system connect to theirs? The only example I can think of is the TRE and obviously that worked out pretty nicely.

[saxman66]

When has DART ever refused to let another system connect to theirs? The only example I can think of is the TRE and obviously that worked out pretty nicely.

Some bus company was bringing passengers each morning from the Sherman area to the Plano station. Trains were so crowded at the beginning of the line, no one else could board later on down the line. DART said the bus company could no longer bus those passengers to the Plano station. Not sure what happened after that.

[incrediculous]

I don't know how I feel about that.

On one hand, the private bus company was exploiting the light rail. On the other hand, shouldn't DART just increase the number of trains or train capacity to meet the demand the private sector is willing to bring it?

[dfwcre8tive]

Corinth reconsiders joining DCTA
08:13 AM CST on Thursday, January 19, 2006
By Peggy Heinkel-Wolfe / Staff Writer

CORINTH — The city of Corinth may yet join the Denton County Transportation Authority, underscoring the old adage that if you can’t beat ’em, you might as well join ’em.

The Corinth City Council will consider adopting a resolution at tonight’s meeting that declares an expression of interest in joining DCTA in 2006. The resolution would be a big step in another direction after Corinth voters rejected membership in DCTA — and the required sales tax to fund it — in 2003. The cities that did vote yes are Denton, Lewisville and Highland Village.

A lot has changed in Corinth since then. With DCTA established and the rail route selected, trains will be coming through Corinth in six years whether the residents want them or not. So DCTA board member and Corinth resident Paul Ruggiere, who himself originally opposed the route through Corinth, is now recommending that the city revisit the issue before a new, small window of opportunity closes. “The council has to stick its neck out a little bit in order to be considered,” Ruggiere said. If the council passes the resolution, DCTA will respond with a preliminary offer of services. Then, the steps needed to join can begin.

Ruggiere told the council in a workshop session last week that he expects the offer to include some financial amnesty. Instead of more than $500,000 in tax revenue that would be owed, DCTA is expected to discount Corinth’s re-entry fee to about $200,000. Mayor Vic Burgess said he and the city manager have looked at where the money would come from, adding that city officials have time to figure out how to include the funding in next year’s budget.

By rejecting DCTA membership in 2003, Corinth voters didn’t escape the cost of joining if they ever change their minds. But since DCTA is currently applying for federal support of the rail line, potential riders from Corinth would be beneficial to their grant application, Burgess said.

John Hedrick, DCTA executive director, agreed that it was hard to look at the long gap in the rail line, especially knowing that there was not a Corinth station for commuting North Central Texas College students. But he also said the agency has committed $7 million to an environmental impact study that will take 18 months. It would be better to include Corinth now, rather than commissioning an impact study solely for Corinth some time in the future, he said.

To join in 2006, be a part of the impact study and get a rail station in six years, voters not only would have to adopt a DCTA sales tax, but they also would have to rescind a current 1/2 cent sales tax. The city tax rate is at its allowable maximum by law, so one of the current dedicated revenue streams would have to change. Ruggiere told the council that rail stations often spark economic development and a rise in property values near them, so perhaps all or a portion of the sales tax dedicated to economic development could be rescinded and redirected toward DCTA.
Burgess said he also sees potential economic development from a rail station, pointing in particular to the response of developers interested in the property between City Hall and North Central Texas College.

“They tell us that a rail station brings more and takes it to a different level,” he said, adding that developers thought a rail station would attract more lucrative tenants to nearby projects.

[dfwcre8tive]

Corinth votes to join DCTA

07:22 AM CST on Friday, January 20, 2006
By Peggy Heinkel-Wolfe / Staff Writer

CORINTH — The Corinth City Council voted unanimously Thursday night to declare its interest in joining the Denton County Transportation Authority. DCTA board member and Corinth resident Paul Ruggiere told the council that with the rail line set and a $7 million environmental impact study in motion, the current offer to join in 2006, “for all practical purposes, is our last chance for a very long time.”

With the resolution in place, the ball is now in DCTA’s court. The agency must come up with a preliminary offer of services for the city. Then, Corinth will have to consider how it will pay for its participation along with the cities of Denton, Lewisville and Highland Village, which voted in the bus-and-rail transit project in 2003. Although Ruggiere told the council that it may be premature to consider how to pay into DCTA, several council members were so concerned that the city would tap into its tax revenue for economic development that they amended the resolution expressly forbidding the option.

DCTA’s preliminary offer of services is expected to include some financial amnesty for the city. When Corinth voters first rejected joining DCTA in 2003, they were still liable for revenue from the creation of DCTA forward if they ever reconsidered. But instead of owing about $500,000, Corinth may be able to enter DCTA in 2006 for about $200,000. Once DCTA has made its offer of services, the chain of events progresses quickly, Ruggiere told the council. The city will need to hold forums to assess citizen interest and determine how best to fund the membership. Then, the city will need to call an election in May to rescind a current half-cent sales tax. Finally, DCTA would call a sales tax election in November.

North Central Texas College Provost Lee Ann Nutt said she was excited that the chance for a rail station had returned and that the college was looking at how it might help contribute to the project. “I don’t know legally yet what all our options are,” Nutt said. “But I’ve already called our president to say that we should put this on our radar.”

PEGGY HEINKEL-WOLFE can be reached at 940-566-6881. Her e-mail address is pheinkel-wolfe@dentonrc.com


Timeline
The steps planned for Corinth to join the Denton County Transportation Authority:
January 2005 — Corinth City Council expresses resolution of interest.
February-April — DCTA prepares service offer.
May — Vote on rescinding half-cent sales tax.
June-July — DCTA prepares memorandum of understanding.
November — Sales tax election.
December — City pays re-entry fee.
January 2007 — Sales tax collection begins.

SOURCE: Paul Ruggiere, DCTA board member

[NThomas]

If you can't fight em', join em'

[dfwcre8tive]

Shady Shores looking into joining DCTA
By Marcia Rios
Sun Writer

The Town of Shady Shores Council voted unanimously Monday to declare its interest in joining the Denton County Transportation Authority.

DCTA board member and Shady Shores resident Tom Spencer told council members he had been active in the development of a new member policy recently which gives non-member cities a “once in lifetime" opportunity to join the regional transportation system at a reduced price.

Spencer said Shady Shores will be able to enter the system at a cost of $10,175, and if voters approve a 1/2 cent sales tax in November, Shady Shores residents will have full benefits as those given to citizens in the original member cities of Highland Village, Denton and Lewisville.

According to Spencer, bus service from Denton into Carrollton is expected to start as early as May.

With council's resolution on Monday, Spencer said, “The ball is now in DCTA's hands, and they will be coming to you and making a presentation about what services they can offer. If you like what you are offered, you can accept their plan and they will call an election to encumber the sales tax,' Spencer said.

Spencer said that since DCTA would soon begin a $7 million environmental impact study, Shady Shores was coming into the system at a great time. He also added the town is in an excellent geographical location, being within a 1/2-mile proximity to a potential station south of Denton or north of Corinth. “Wherever they put the station, if that might be approved in Corinth or if it is built in the southern part of Denton, either way it will be great for us," Spencer said.

The steps required for Shady Shores to join DCTA include a service offer to be made before April, completion of a memorandum of understanding by DCTA in May, and a sales tax election in November. If the citizens approve the sales tax, the city will pay the entry fee, and sales tax collection will begin in January 2007.

[FoUTASportscaster]

That would be good news for the region, however small that city is.