What do you want built in Victory?

**snooch** · 07 May 2004, 03:59 PM

Aside from hoping that the Victory development ends up (1) being cool and (2) NOT cannibalizing our feeble attempts to revitalize downtown, there is one smallish wish that I have for the Victory Project Development Thingy.

Please guys, somebody build a big ass multiplex in central Dallas with all the fixins (stadium seating, big screens, ridiculous gourmet concessions, apathetic teenaged employees).

I've bitched about this before, mainly because I hate most of the non-art house theaters in central Dallas. I think it's f****** ridiculous that I live in one of the biggest cities in the nation and I have to drive fifteen to twenty minutes for stadium-seating. My hats off to the city for having more art house theaters (3) in the area than most big cities, but it seems like they’ve ignored the blockbuster market in the process and let the suburbs win that war.

Victory seems primed for that kind of development, mainly because it’s centrally located and looks to have the available space for it. Plus, people lingering around after a movie could help bring foot traffic to the area. I know that after my girl and I go watch a movie, we usually go out for a drink or ice cream or some manner of snack. If there was window shopping in a safe environment (a la Mockingbird Station), we’d probably be up for that too. It seems like theater traffic, especially if it’s attached to an urban development, can really help bring the area to life after sundown. Being adjacent to downtown could help too.

The only other thing I could think of would maybe be Northpark, and I seem to recall old whisperings of a multiplex being built there. That wouldn’t be bad, but I think a glitzy multiplex with the Dallas skyline as a backdrop would look pretty sharp. And it wouldn’t hurt to have some shops/restaurants/bars/cafes in the immediate vicinity either.

What do you guys think?

gc · 07 May 2004, 04:04 PM

totally

**clipper** · 07 May 2004, 04:27 PM

The plan to build a mega AMC multiplex at Northpark is still alive. In fact, they theater is ready to build it if the mall owners can ever get out of bed and start doing some real work to expand and remodel the center. There's not a lot of motivation when you are already making more money than you can spend with a mall like NP. Unlike the Galleria which realizes that in dog years it is dead, the people at NP haven't had a redo in OVER 30 YEARS. If they wait much longer it will qualify for historcal status and they won't be allowed to make any changes.

crescentboi · 07 May 2004, 04:28 PM

Actually I think the parking lots that are empty in the West End (by the Aquarium and Fountain Place) would be a great spot for it! You could build a large, very urban type of theater there with a parking garage that would look awesome! That would be my first choice.

**snooch** · 07 May 2004, 04:29 PM

Ooh, I'd never thought of that. That's not a bad idea either. As it stands that area is just a wasteland of asphalt and useless buildings. And the lots are hardly ever more than a third full.

**bloodandpopcorn** · 07 May 2004, 07:10 PM

I just want them to renovate the theater that was at the top of the West End Marketplace. I have so many good memories of that place. They could renovate it into four or five large, stadium-seating screens, since it was originally, waht, 10 or 12 smaller screens? I would go there ALL The time. The best Dallas location of a movie theater ever, in my opinion.

**texasyndicate** · 07 May 2004, 10:51 PM

crescent boi,ive felt the same way for a very long time now

**sterling** · 08 May 2004, 03:00 AM

Clipper makes some very good comments about North Park. Though NP continues to evolve, it is a good example of doing things right the first time. Would that more Dallas developers had the quality vision and follow-through of Nasher.

**psukhu** · 08 May 2004, 07:11 AM

I do the same thing. I get on 35 from Oaklawn and drive all the way to Northwest HWY!

If they build something, I hope they stack the theatres on top of each other at least three high. (like the Sony Lincoln Center in NYC)

Cinemark Theatres and Beck Construction are both based here right here in Dallas. Why can't they clone one of their Tokyo theatres and put it in the West End?

Cinemark in Tokyo: http://www.beckarchitecture.com/PAGE...S/THEATERS.HTM

"We have developed schematic designs for four new
Cinemark Theaters in Japan. All four of these designs
are for tight urban sites in major cities. The idea
has been to capture some of the kinetic quality of
Japanese urban life through the use of lights,
video projection screens and other moving elements.
Because of the tight sites the auditoriums are stacked
on top of each other, providing great opportunities
for vertical movement within the buildings."

**HarryMoto** · 08 May 2004, 09:35 AM

Cool photos, Psukhu. Are you back from Tel Aviv? I hear it's a fun, party-hearty city, despite the terrorism.

Re: Dallas theaters -- Funny, I've been thinking the same thing: there's no decent, state-of-the-art mainstream movie complex in the entire Downtown/Uptown/Oak Lawn area. Considering the average age/income and that Dallas, on a per-capita basis, is supposed to be such a moviegoing mecca, this seems to be a major oversight. I know that the exhibitor chains went through tough times a few years ago and shuttered theaters or canceled projects. But they seem to be back in building mode now and it appears the equivalent areas in most major cities seem to have at least one good mainstream theater, such as the 15-screen, two-story UA Pavilions in the LoDo area of Denver. In L.A.'s reviving Hollywood and yupscale Westside, the Arclight Cinemas, Pacific's Culver Stadium 12, The Grove Stadium 14, and The Bridge Cinema Dulux are all state-of-the-art venues opened relatively recently that are reportedly doing bang-up business even though some of them charge above-average admission prices. Building something at North Park would be great but something even closer-in, like downtown, would be better. So there used to be a theater at West End? Did it not generate enough business to survive?

I've not seen a movie at Cityplace yet but I've been warned against it (apparently they used to have some press screenings there but crime has gotten to be a problem so now most of the screenings are elsewhere.) I've been to a couple of theaters up the 75 (a UA and an AMC I believe) but they were pretty ordinary. Where do people go here for "event" movies, like, say, "Harry Potter" or "Lord of the Rings" that you want to see in comfy surroundings on a big-ass screen with eardrum-exploding sound? Plano?

**bloodandpopcorn** · 08 May 2004, 03:35 PM

I go to the UA Plaza that you just mentioned. No stadium seating, but for some reason, it has a lot more character in my opinion than the suburban movie theaters. I really like it, can't say why.

And I don't know exactly why the theater in the West End failed. It probably stopped selling very many tickets.. but I'm not sure. If you drive by on Woodall Rogers, and read the building, on it's North side (parallel to Woodall) it still says "Cineplex 10" I believe. It's a real shame that it's not there anymore. I don't remember it too well, but it was at least as good as UA Plaza and Glenn Lakes, but far more interestingly located and much more fun to go to than any other theater in the metroplex (at least in my opinion). If they re-opened it as five screens, I think they could probably expand the size of theaters and add some great amenities. But I have no idea if it would be financially feasible. I would think so, though, especially with those new apartments coming online in the West End and eventually in Victory, in addition to all of the residents in Downtown and Uptown...

crescentboi · 08 May 2004, 05:16 PM

For an awesome theater i go all the way out to the AMC at the Mills. I think its the best theater. but its way the hell out there. the lowe's cityplace is a fine theater, yeah some of the people are "interesting" but it's a fairly good theater. i've gone to the UA at Park a few times now and don't really like it, but i've never seen it too busy so that's nice. i WON'T go back to the theater at the Highland Park Village. I felt like an elephant in a shoebox. it's so small and the staff seemed to be idiots. IMO

**tamtagon** · 08 May 2004, 05:43 PM

I wish there was an IMAX theater downtown.

**zigwamo** · 08 May 2004, 05:48 PM

Recently I've been going all the way up to Plano to the theater on 75 @ Legacy. It was nice, but a ridiculous drive. I went there after having been to the theater in Richardson off 75 (forgot its name), which I didn't like. Frankly, I wish they would just bulldoze the cityplace theater and build a nice one from scratch.

**utgf** · 09 May 2004, 01:20 AM

I live uptown but I try and watch movies at UA Galaxy, which is close to Northwest Highway and 635 intersection. They supposedly have the largest screens in Texas. There are only 9 screens at the multiplex but have all the latest amenities. They are usually less crowded than other multiplexes on opening weekend of blockbuster movies.

**akack** · 09 May 2004, 01:56 AM

"Frankly, I wish they would just bulldoze the cityplace theater and build a nice one from scratch".

I completly agree......cityplace is an alright theater, but you gota have stadium seating. Placing a new theater near Victory devlopment/ empty parking lot next to the Dallas Aquarium would be a great idea.

**drumguy8800** · 09 May 2004, 03:36 AM

Here's my idea: There's this huge.. obnoxious, parking lot, on the western side of Houston Street next to the West End. It looks like a giant puddle of asphalt, because on the I-35E side of it, they didn't even cut it straight.. its like this giant, ragged curve. So, we need to build over it. They can make like this huge building.. that looks very similar to the rest of the West End. It would go from the LRT Line to Woodall Rogers. (It would be 5 or 6 stories tall, with a double-decker theatre stack.) At the very center, where there is currently a light that leads into the parking lot, there would be a road that goes back in there and you can either turn into a parking garage, or keep going, then turn left on a brand new street that goes from Woodall Rogers, to again, the LRT Line, and then curves back around the building. On the opposite side of the road in between it, the new Orange Line and the theatre, there could be low-rise office space that looks very industrial. Then on either side of the entrance road (the one that goes towards the parking garage and the back street), there would be an entrance into the theater, and box offices on either side. The theaters would also be on either side of the street, so people might have to cross the street, but that would only make more pedestrian traffic, which is a good thing. On either side of the entrance, (like, 1/8 of the entire front facade would open into the theater in the very center on either side of the street) there would be restaurants. We could put in an Outback, a Chilis, and other stuff that we need downtown. No retail though, because people don't go to the West End to buy clothing, they go there to eat dinner and be entertained. Here's my ghettomatized map (because this post is unbelievably confusing..)

Yeah: Here's the map.. light blue is office space, yellow is theater, green is box office, lime green is a parking garage, and blue is restaurants. I'd put it up as an image, but I did it with paint in like 2 minutes.. so.. its kind of embarassing.

Heh. Click: Map..

This plan is just retarted, but somethin' needs to be done there. We need some kind of big, attractive development to seemlessly connect Victory and the West End.

**jsoto3** · 09 May 2004, 10:51 PM

That's a great idea for that site Drummy! Having read all of the great ideas on this forum over the last few years I am beginning to think that we should start 'DallasMetropolis Development, Inc.'!

**drumguy8800** · 09 May 2004, 11:07 PM

thankya thar, jsoto. you're a little more skilled at the entire computer generated stuff than me, in case that wasn't evident enough. You're proposal for the Trinity River Corridor 'connector' thing certainly would've made it to the final blueprints had you been allowed to make input. I think the forum should try and make connections with developer bigshots.. maybe some of our opinions would help them out. After all, if we're passionate enough to spend time on a forum about Dallas development, then we have to have at least a working-knowledge of whats good for the city and stuff like that.. I really think that developers could benefit from chatting on here.

**sogod** · 10 May 2004, 11:22 AM

The Cinemark 14 in McKinney is a pretty good theater. I knows it far out there, and kinda old, but its saving grace is that tickets are only $2.50 before 6 pm and $4-5 after words.

**rantanamo** · 10 May 2004, 12:21 PM

Originally Posted by utgf

I live uptown but I try and watch movies at UA Galaxy, which is close to Northwest Highway and 635 intersection. They supposedly have the largest screens in Texas. There are only 9 screens at the multiplex but have all the latest amenities. They are usually less crowded than other multiplexes on opening weekend of blockbuster movies.

I've tried theaters all over the metroplex and Austin and this is the one I've settled with as well. Very compact compared to most its size, but most attractive throughout the exterior I think. During typical openings its laid back, but when the truly big openings take place this is the best opening buzz in the metroplex.

box office

The whole thing. Very compact for 10 theaters

This is from when there were 9 theaters. A duplicate to the largest was added to create the Galaxy 10

I also like the round front plaza of the AMC 30 in Mesquite. Combine that with the Galaxy 10. Stack the theaters, drop it into the West Village or Victory and you have something special.

**Lakewooder** · 10 May 2004, 04:45 PM

OK I refuse to go to Plano to see a movie! Or for anything else.

I think they've put up a fence at the CityPlace theater -- I've never had a problem with crime there, but maybe that will help.

I too, attended several movies at the West End theater and it was a more interesting experience, being able to stroll around shops after the movie. Seems like it closed once, then reopened and closed again. There was free parking in the multi-story garage on Lamar.

I hate the Village Theater too, because I remember it from the old days as a grand place. They just shoved in the ice cream place and shoehorned in some reel rabbit warrens upstairs. I think they did it just too keep the theater marquee!

The only high traffic places with some land I can think of now are drumguy's by or in Victory - or the Driving Range at West Village / CityPlace. How cool would it be to take the subway to the movies!?!

**Lakewooder** · 10 May 2004, 04:48 PM

Or perhaps Magic Johnson or someone might get behind a theater adjacent to Fair Park or edge of Ellum, especially if the stadium goes in. There aren't any theaters close to that area, and I think it would be a 'destination' type place and would draw from the Eastern suburbs, even. There don't seem to be any great theaters in Mesquite, correct me if I'm wrong.

**rantanamo** · 10 May 2004, 05:06 PM

AMC 30 (yes 30 screens) is in Mesquite. Rivals the best in the area. Huge individual theaters. It has a cool round plaza at the entrance. The box offices wrap around the plaza, so I think it would make a great urban meeting place. Has cool lighting scheme at night. If you could xross it with the Galaxy 10 I think you'd have something really great.

As for crime at Lowes Cityplace, it was "smash and grab central" when the rash of smash and grabs were taking place a couple of months back.

gc · 10 May 2004, 05:10 PM

I have never had a a problem at Cityplace. That is where my wife and I go most of the time.

**drumguy8800** · 10 May 2004, 06:47 PM

I'm a loser, so I made a better map of my stupid concept. i even sent a proposal to cinemark, cause again, i'm a loser. i hope they at least email me back. i just said 'theres a great lot and a lot of demand in town.. you should look into it,' and told em to email me if they wanted to see my idea. even though my idea is bleagh. but if done right, would be cool. or something. anyway.

Click righta hur .

**bloodandpopcorn** · 10 May 2004, 09:52 PM

Great work. I think it would be great to see that as some development with retail on the ground floor, some second floor restaurants (you could access the level by going up an escallator and then walking around inside to choose from your retaurant, with big widows on the sides for great views of DART, downtown Dallas, the activity of the area, or whatnot. Then, on top of that, two or three levels of parking. And on top of that, two or three levels of movie theaters! From the Box office, you would take an elevator up to your level. Like how the Loews theaters say "Right" or "Left" your ticket stub would say "floor 6" or "floor 7" or "floor 8." You'd buy your refreashments, be able to relax in a lounge with floor-to-ceiling-windows before your movie starts, watch trailers on plasma screens, etc.

And, of course, you'd have to pay $10 at least for a ticket. Hahaha!

**freewaytincan** · 11 May 2004, 12:07 AM

Originally Posted by zigwamo

Recently I've been going all the way up to Plano to the theater on 75 @ Legacy. It was nice, but a ridiculous drive. I went there after having been to the theater in Richardson off 75 (forgot its name), which I didn't like. Frankly, I wish they would just bulldoze the cityplace theater and build a nice one from scratch.

The one at Legacy is Cinemark Legacy, and even for me, in Richardson, it's a long drive. Then the one off of Central here in Richardson is Lowe's Keystone. Many around here maintain that if you want a hooker, don't bother with Harry Hines, just go to Keystone on a weeknight, sometime after 8.00 PM...

**dallashorn** · 11 May 2004, 09:55 PM

Over the past couple of years, I have always thought that a great place for a movie theater would be in the middle of Preston Center West, where the two story parking garage is. I thought it would be great if you could tear down the garage, build a new structure that had retail on the bottom a garage in the middle and then the theater on top of that. I saw a movie at a nicely done AMC on Camelback Road in Phoenix, it was built on top of a parking garage as I am suggesting. Not like a huge megaplex, but maybe 8-10 theaters.

**hamiltonpl** · 13 May 2004, 10:43 AM

That's a great idea. There are so many restaurants there already it could be a real destination. It would be a great destination. That is another area that could have a few more highrises in the future.

By the way, when you guys go to Preston Center try out the Flying Fish! It's a great!

**drumguy8800** · 17 May 2004, 02:18 AM

In the very VERY VERY preliminary renderings for the Victory Project (I got these from the actual dallasmetropolis site..).. there is this: a CINEMA! maybe there's still hope!!

oooooo. i know i'd go there.

**uptown** · 18 February 2005, 02:19 PM

I would have to say Victory Plaza. I think the attraction would bring more people to the area, even more than if we didn't have it.

**yaga** · 18 February 2005, 02:32 PM

House of Blues

**rantanamo** · 18 February 2005, 02:40 PM

I'd want the MATA line branching off somewhere/somehow into Victory that starts a new loop through Victory, to the West End, and looping back to the DMA where the current line ends. Everything else will probably be built for sure whether I'd want it or not.

**The Great Hizzy!** · 18 February 2005, 03:12 PM

I think Victory should have a statue of Mark Cuban punching Donald Trump in the eye. I'd definitely go up there to see that.

**rantanamo** · 18 February 2005, 03:22 PM

or one of the city chasing Cuban

**The Great Hizzy!** · 18 February 2005, 03:24 PM

Lol!

**The Great Hizzy!** · 18 February 2005, 03:27 PM

In all seriousness, I think it's all about the enviroment. Victory's going to have all the retail you need (eats and buys and what have you) so in order to make it stand out more from the West Village, there needs to be something that ties the populace in with the surroundings, something that says, "Hey, this isn't just a pretentious walk up some faux Manhattan landscape. This place is unique."

A large fountain with unique lighting, a garden with a bird sanctuary, a waterfall... you get the picture.

**rantanamo** · 18 February 2005, 03:30 PM

I imagine they'll have a gaudy fountain in the park thingie. They just need to promote my Grand Prix and all will be well.

**HarryMoto** · 18 February 2005, 03:40 PM

^If the Times Square/Tokyo-style neon signage and videoscreen display is as impressive as envisioned then that will be one element that will make Victory unique.

And because it can't be stated often enough: a stadium-seat movie theater!

**texman** · 18 February 2005, 03:46 PM

The originally planned Victory Tower.

**rantanamo** · 18 February 2005, 03:49 PM

seriously, that would be cool. I think it would fit their image more now, than before.

**texman** · 18 February 2005, 03:50 PM

Originally Posted by rantanamo

seriously, that would be cool. I think it would fit their image more now, than before.

Also, Victory Tower would add some needed architecture. I don't want this whole development to be the new urbanism arch. We need some glass!

**rantanamo** · 18 February 2005, 03:57 PM

The current plan seems to have a good mix compared to the old one. The old plan reminded me of the current West Village.

**US75Guy** · 18 February 2005, 05:13 PM

Also, there needs to be more effort made to tie this into the West End. I want a complete string of attractions, shops, nightlife from the West End to Victory. Together, this area could be a serious national entertainment district.

gc · 18 February 2005, 05:15 PM

^ I agree. I would hate to see Victory completely cannibalize The West End. There is a perfect opportunity for these two districts to complement each other.

**Razorback** · 18 February 2005, 05:35 PM

I want the huge LCD, something along the lines of the one outside the mall on the strip in Vegas, super modern high tech version of Time's Square, only cleanly contrived in typical Dallas fashion. I think an unmistakeable central plaza, with the video-walls, and a water feature equally cool at night as in the daytime.

**jsoto3** · 18 February 2005, 05:56 PM

Originally Posted by texman

Also, Victory Tower would add some needed architecture. I don't want this whole development to be the new urbanism arch. We need some glass!

Umm, haven't you been keeping tabs on the latest renderings? There is now more 'glassy' architecture than not. The latest design for Victory Tower (One Victory) by KPF kicks the old design's ass.