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Thread: Southwest & American Airlines

  1. #701
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    Quote Originally Posted by PuddinHead
    You cannot use a travel service to buy a ticket on Southwest.
    Who cares?

  2. #702
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    Don't get out much, huh?
    While I have some bum type friends, most of mine are professionals in some sort of the previously listed fields. If you must fault me for the company I keep I won't be too offended.

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    Interesting that your vague allegations are contradicted by every reputable independent study of customer satisfaction.
    Well like i've said ask a jaded constant traveler like me and I won't sing praises unto anything but on time flights. I understand the realities of air travel on domestic carriers. Ask a southwest customer flying their lil john and betty to MCO to go to Disneyland and they couldn't be more happy with Southwest. Ask the poor sap in a tie who had to listen to the cattle cart full of kids on certain SW flights and he probably won't comment. Your average targeted SW customer probably has only a hand full of flights within their lifetime to compare to the flight they just boarded/deparated. Rose colored glasses.


    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    The "Southwest effect" is well known and proven... in markets where legacy carriers are forced to compete with Southwest (or another high-quality, low-cost carrier), the legacy carriers will reduce their airfares. What that means is that the cost of the flight (on whichever airline chosen) will be cheaper... it does not mean that the cheapest flight will be on Southwest.

    This is a pretty straight forward example of the free market in action.
    Thanks for the free markets lesson Junior! So what your saying is I am right that SW rarely has the cheapest flight unless you are booking over 90 days out? So I guess your "Southwest Effect" should be thanked, although I'm quite sure it hasn't lowered my DFW prices lately.

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    Here in North Texas, you find two things:
    1) AA uses it as a major hub, therefor you will find non-stop flights to a wide variety of destinations... as you would at any airline hub city; and
    2) AA has used its political muscle to prevent Southwest from offering non-stop flights to any destinations outside the region.

    Nationally, however, Southwest is the largest domestic air carrier and operates a much more diversified route network, with more "mini-hubs." This means that Southwest is more likely to offer more people a non-stop flight between their origin and destination. Indeed, air carrier statistics back this up... a higher percentage of Southwest passengers are flying non-stop versus American passengers.
    I will bring issue with this statement only by pointing out that if indeed you percentage comment is correct is probably has something to do with American Eagle and the number of cities they serve. Your very right that I'm not going to fly to Bangor, Maine or Greenville, South Carolina without stopping somewhere first on American Eagle. Sure American isn't going to offer 738 service from each of their cities, but between AA and their other legacy buddies I can usually get to within 50 to 100 miles of whatever client I am working with. I can't and won't ever be able to do that with SW.

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    If you mean non-stop, you are probably correct. The best way to predict this is to look at other nearby airports (which aren't restricted by the Wright Amendment). An examination of non-stop flights on Southwest from nearby unrestricted airports suggests that we will gain non-stop service to the following markets:
    • Baltimore
    • Chicago (Midway)
    • Denver
    • Ft. Lauderdale
    • Harlingen/South Padre Island
    • Jacksonville
    • Las Vegas
    • Los Angeles
    • Nashville
    • Oakland
    • Orlando
    • Philadelphia
    • Phoenix
    • Portland
    • San Diego
    • Seattle and
    • Tampa Bay
    Great just let me know where the SW Supersaver Lounge is where I can hide from the normal zoo sitting at the gate. Since I think you might work for SW, if you use that name I'm going to want dues for my intelectual property. I was thinking Southwest Cheapass Club might be better though.

    Oh and I can already get to all of those places non stop on AA. Or one stop on most all other legacy carriers. And one stop is still better than many southwest flights at their Mini-hubs.

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    Again, Southwest has a higher percentage of seats occupied by non-stop travellers than do the major legacy carriers, which require travelers to connect through a limited number of major hubs (unless they are going to/from the hub city).
    Its intersting that so many combinations I put into the SW trip planner on their website come back with one or more stops. Many of these from their "mini-hubs" all over the country. Oh well, its almost like the good ole days of air travel when you NY to LA meant stopping 4 places in between. But the reality is I need non stops, with or without the wright ammendment. So does the rest of of the DFW travelers.


    [QUOTE=UptownDallas]I guess I'm confused... you complain earlier about a shortage of non-stop flights. However, when you use Love Field, you artificially restricted yourself to a couple of destinations served by cramped American Eagle flights? (actually, they now only fly to one destination)[/indent]

    I will any day of the week be on the A (aisle and window), B (aisle), or C (window) or a ER4 that sitting in B or E on a 737. Regional Jets aren't really bad to fly in. You have a greater width seat in a SW 737 but the avoidance of the middle seat in entirety is golden. Ultmately all the bad publicity (maybe fueled alittle by SW?) of ERJ regionals has brought in a whole new category or 2+2 jets from Bombadier, Mitsubishi, CRJ and Embraer. These are going to be game changers for the small airport market. Much more comforable and likeable to all those who believed the bad rap of the ERJ and confused them with the ride of Turboprop.

    Oh and flying straight to Chicago from an airport close to downtown? Some would call that pretty smart. The flood of private corporate aircraft at DAL speaks volumes about how convenent DAL is to downtown and uptown. Its really too bad (for SW) that most of the large firms that have DTD office space can't book a flight on SW because we use travel agents or corporate AMEX travel services. Oh well...

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    No, but you could use the money you save flying Southwest (or redeeming Southwest miles for domestic flights you would normally purchase... Southwest frequent flyer rewards are much easier to claim than AAdvantage awards... to pay for your vacation tickets.

    If AAdvantage miles are really that important to you, you don't need to fly to earn them.... there are all sorts of ways to get them... credit cards, mortgages, eating out, flowers, the list goes on and on.

    (I assume you realize that free tickets aren't really "free," it's just a form of rebate.
    You must think I'm an amateur... I didn't get over a million AA miles by flying alone. I've used the mentioned milage earners as much as I've gotten miles by flying. Since you either work for SW or are the president of their fan club you need to take this back to their smiley loving goons: MILES ARE THE REASON I PUT UP WITH CORPORATE TRAVEL. Bar-none, and that goes for most everyone on the Monday morning/Thursday and Friday flights. I don't care that RR's will get me a free seat on your cattle carts to Orlando or Orange County John Wayne airport. I want to go sking in Whistler B.C., sitting on the beach on the Mediterrainian Sea, or looking at antiquities in Europe or Asia. I have no problem claiming AAdvantage rewards, much to the bad publicity fueled by someone out there (SW?), anyone who plans their vacations somewhat in advance doesn't seem to have problems getting seats. That includes me. Oh and again the occasional upgrade never hurts. Hell if I'm flying UA, i can even get an upgrade in the regional jets!

    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    I take it you're not an aviation industry consultant.
    The only consulting I do for the aviation industry is from my armchair. Anyways I hear its a rough industry to be in... unless of course you are SW!

    Quote Originally Posted by PuddinHead
    So tell us aviation industry consultant and avowed protector of airport valet parking services how does Southwest cater to the business traveler when you cannot even book a Southwest ticket using travel services like American Express and or Carson Wagonlit?
    Don't worry about asking this... this question is posed quite frequently in addition to the Corporate Travel agents pretty much anywhere not being able to ticket. The only answer they can give is... "Hey look at our new Business Select!" Same plane, same unassigned seats, same people around you but the best part is it actually costs more! HA HA... As I believe NBC used to call it, The Fleecing of America. But wait you get to board first and you get a drink coupon. Yikes.

    Companies make their employees book through corporate travel agents both for ease and speed of Trip Planning and also to keep a tight leash on corporate spending. If I call SW and book a ticket how does my company know there wasn't a more affordable equal option out there? They don't if I can't put it into a matrix comparing fares to other carriers.

    Quote Originally Posted by Tnekster
    Who cares?
    Along with the technology company I work for, PWC, KPMG, E&Y, Lehman Brothers, AIG, Liberty Mutual, Tenet, BOA, Chase, Cap Gemini, IBM, Microsoft, General Motors, Lockheed Martin, Bell Helicopter, Deloitte, Accenture, Bearing Pointe, Dean, Nortel and many other large and medium sized companies that put hundreds if not thousands of their employees in the air every day... but not on SW. No big deal though. They may represent over 50 percent of the legacy carriers business if not more but obviously they aren't that important to SW. Which is fine with me...

    Oh and this arguement is one that can't be won or convinced. All I ask is don't drink the Jim Jones Koolaide at durring your next SW flight until you see what the issues are that SW has classically been soft on.

  3. #703
    Incoherent Rambler grantboston's Avatar
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    ^Actually, ayg, you CAN fly to GSP non-stop from DFW. It's a nice place,you ought to cash in your Rapid Rewards points and take a trip there.

    I'm going to go back to the solitude of the Crown Room Club now.

  4. #704
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by PuddinHead
    how does Southwest cater to the business traveler when you cannot even book a Southwest ticket using travel services like American Express
    ....

    Unlike the rest of the airlines there are only two ways to buy a Southwest ticket, from a Southwest Web site or the ticket counter. You cannot use a travel service to buy a ticket on Southwest.
    Perhaps it is time to update your ignorance of SWA, here a a few tidbits to get you started at a slow non life threating pace.

    http://www.swabiz.com/travel_center/fop.html
    https://www.swabiz.com/cgi-bin/selfEnroll
    http://www.swabiz.com/about_swa/pres...8_westjet.html
    http://www.authorizedagents.com/
    http://www.swabiz.com/gift_cards/gift_cards.html
    http://www.documents.dgs.ca.gov/osp/...os/MM07_07.pdf
    https://in-gotravel.doe.gov/govtrip/OnlineBooking.html
    http://dfm.fws.gov/Whats%20new/OBE%2...on%20QandA.htm
    1-800-435-9792
    Last edited by TexasPlus; 18 August 2008 at 06:47 AM.
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  5. #705
    High-Rise Member PuddinHead's Avatar
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    Well you posted 4 SWA sites, 4 government sites that no doubt non government travelers can use :roflmao2: and oh yes a site that sells vacation packages on Southwest.

    Just like I said there are only two ways to purchase a Southwest ticket, at a WN web site or a WN ticket counter. You cannot purchase a WN ticket on American Express Travel or Carson Wagonlit.

  6. #706
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    Quote Originally Posted by PuddinHead
    Just like I said there are only two ways to purchase a Southwest ticket, at a WN web site or a WN ticket counter. You cannot purchase a WN ticket on American Express Travel or Carson Wagonlit.
    Doesn't seem to hurt them since they actually carry more passengers than AA.

  7. #707
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    The most recent round of AA versus SW has been cleared from the "DFW Int'l Airport + The International Marketplace | V2.0 and deposited into this, the appropriate thread.

  8. #708
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonDallas
    The score from today was:

    AA - 200+ cancellations
    SW - 0 cancellations

    Partially due to AA being cheap and not renting enough gates at DFW, and partially due to Love being far more protected from ice/snow storms historically.
    Oh what a difference 11 miles can make:

    Southwest suspends Love Field flights

    vs.

    American Airlines officials said they don’t expect mass cancellations at the airline’s hub at Dallas/Fort Worth Airport.

    "There may be some rain and southerly winds, but nothing that would hamper operations to any major extent," spokesman Tim Smith said.

    But he cautioned that crosswinds and rain could slow traffic at D/FW, causing delays and some cancellations. American will monitor the storm throughout today, Smith said; D/FW could be affected from late afternoon and into the evening, he added.
    Source: http://www.star-telegram.com/business/story/905662.html

  9. #709
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    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    Oh what a difference 11 miles can make:
    It's really not 11 miles, it is 2 different airlines philosophies, and probably the fact that a large chunk of SWA flights go to Houston, which is closed today :

    CITY SKY/WX TMP DP RH WIND PRES REMARKS
    DFW AIRPORT LGT RAIN 80 73 79 N22 29.41F
    DALLAS LOVE RAIN 77 74 90 N21 29.39F

  10. #710
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonDallas
    It's really not 11 miles, it is 2 different airlines philosophies, and probably the fact that a large chunk of SWA flights go to Houston, which is closed today :

    CITY SKY/WX TMP DP RH WIND PRES REMARKS
    DFW AIRPORT LGT RAIN 80 73 79 N22 29.41F
    DALLAS LOVE RAIN 77 74 90 N21 29.39F
    Yet oddly, at 5 o'clock, when Hobby is still closed to traffic, Southwest can magically operate their other ex-DAL services not affected by the storm.

  11. #711
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    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    Yet oddly, at 5 o'clock, when Hobby is still closed to traffic, Southwest can magically operate their other ex-DAL services not affected by the storm.
    What are you talking about? Didn't AA's flights get off fine from Love today?

    Jason

  12. #712
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    Quote Originally Posted by JasonDallas
    What are you talking about? Didn't AA's flights get off fine from Love today?

    Jason
    Best I can surmise, AA was able to operate two flights to ORD today, with the latest departing at 11:00, just 30 minutes after Southwest decided to begin its window of cancelled ops for the day.

    However...

    From Love
    AA4366, the 17:00 departure to ORD, was cancelled.
    AA4372, the 18:00 departure to ORD, was cancelled.

    From DFW
    AA2364, the 16:40 departure to ORD, is about to arrive.
    AA2366, the 17:30 departure to ORD, is en route.
    AA2372, the 19:10 departure to ORD, is delayed, but still scheduled to operate.

    And don't get me wrong, I understand that often 11 miles doesn't make a difference weather wise, it's merely amusing that so many are quick to pile on American (e.g. calling the airline cheap) when it's forced to make cancellations, but when it's Southwest, well, gawsh darnit, give 'em a break... they are doing the dern best they can. The truth of the matter is that neither airline wants the headache and hassle of accommodating hundreds of thousands of displaced passengers.

  13. #713
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    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    The truth of the matter is that neither airline wants the headache and hassle of accommodating hundreds of thousands of displaced passengers.
    I don't think Love Field being closed for 7 hours (on a Saturday in September, no less) would affect "hundreds of thousands" of passengers, nor for that matter would DFW. It does bring up an interesting point, however.

    Love Field only accounts for around 4% of Southwest's total daily departures, so it's easier for Southwest to recover on a system-wide basis, IMHO. Even LAS (WN's largest station) accounts for less than 7% of their total daily departures.

    When DFW closes it has much more of an effect on AA's passengers because a larger percentage of AA's total daily flights depart from DFW. Doesn't DFW account for about 30-35% of American/American Eagle's total daily departures?

    LoneStarMike

  14. #714
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneStarMike
    I don't think Love Field being closed for 7 hours (on a Saturday in September, no less) would affect "hundreds of thousands" of passengers, nor for that matter would DFW. It does bring up an interesting point, however.
    Poor proofreading on my part... should have typed "hundreds or thousands". But the number is really beside the point.

  15. #715
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    As fares and fees rise, passengers want service
    By HARRY R. WEBER 09.20.08, 6:10 AM ET

    FORT WORTH, Texas -

    On a recent rainy day at Dallas-Fort Worth International Airport, a suitcase bound for Colorado Springs, Colo., lay on the ground outside a terminal under a maze of American Airlines conveyor belts that ferry bags to and from nearby planes.

    A field representative for the airline who was showing a reporter the long, circuitous route checked bags take put the suitcase on a belt where it was supposed to be. He said it likely fell off a belt or a baggage handler's vehicle. He didn't know how long it had been off its path.

    The airlines have been imposing new fees, raising fares, reducing flights and, in some cases, cutting out free snacks in coach. But several big and small airlines alike have struggled relative to the industry in terms of baggage handling, on-time performance and other customer service metrics. An annual University of Michigan survey released in May found customers giving airlines the worst grades since 2001.

    With the slow travel season now upon them, airlines face the dual challenges of increasing revenue to cover heavy fuel costs while also improving their product to give air travelers a return on their added investment.

    "We realize that in order for us to regain that brand recognition and the customer loyalty that we used to own in the '80s and '90s, we ought to do something very dramatic and different," said Mark Mitchell, American's managing director of customer experience.

    Delta Air Lines Inc. regional subsidiary Comair had the worst on-time performance in July among airlines surveyed by the Department of Transportation. From January through July, American Airlines on-time arrival rate was the lowest among U.S. carriers, while UAL Corp. United Airlines' was second-lowest. Comair had the highest mishandled baggage rate in July, while the highest number of consumer complaints received by the DOT that month were about Delta. Comair's on-time performance from January through July ranked 17th out of 19 airlines, while Delta's ranked eighth.

    The fourth-highest number of consumer complaints received by the DOT in July were about Tempe, Ariz.-based US Airways which said in a Sept. 3 memo to employees that they would not be receiving a $50 bonus for the month because the airline's on-time performance did not place in the top three among the 10 largest U.S. carriers.

    Executives blame weather, congestion in the Northeast and air traffic control issues for some of the problems, but they also acknowledge company specific problems. They say there have been improvements since the latest DOT figures were released.

    American, a unit of Fort Worth-based AMR Corp., is keeping planes on the ground longer in some cities before turning them for their next flight so that if something goes wrong, there is extra time to board passengers and baggage. It plans to block a limited number of seats from being sold on flights in key markets this Thanksgiving to give it flexibility in re-accommodating customers on planes that would otherwise be full.

    The carrier also is refurbishing the interiors of its Boeing 757s, upgrading business class seats on international flights, adding leather headrests to coach seats on MD-80s and testing Wi-Fi service on some aircraft.

    And to make it easier and quicker to locate mishandled bags, American is equipping personnel with automated handheld bag tag scanners.

    "There are huge costs when you have inconvenienced your customers," said Dan Garton, American's executive vice president of marketing.

    Dorothy Boydston, a 48-year-old electrician from Hawaii, knows what Garton means.

    On a recent trip from Santa Barbara, Calif., to Denver to see her daughter, Boydston had to spend a night at a Phoenix hotel at her own expense because she missed her US Airways connecting flight after, she said, an airline employee wrote the wrong gate number on her ticket. That came after she had to pay $15 to check a bag she tried to carry on the plane to Phoenix, when the airline told her there was no room in the overhead bins.

    The next morning, she was still at Phoenix Sky Harbor International Airport, on standby for another flight to Denver.

    "I could have rented a car for what it's costing me," she said.

    Asked if passengers should get better customer service in light of the higher fares and fees they are paying compared to a year ago, Boydston said, "What customer service? There's no customer service anymore."

    But Aaron Trompeter, 37, an English teacher who lives in Winchester, Va., said he still finds value in the price of an airline ticket these days, even if he has to deal with more hassles, pay to check bags and no longer gets free snacks on some flights.

    "It's so much better than a stagecoach or a car," Trompeter said at Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport after getting off a United flight from Washington. "So the lack of service, or the perceived lack of service, is still very much worth it."

    Airline executives are unapologetic about the need to raise more revenue through fee and fare increases to cover their hefty fuel bills. They also say that certain offerings that were free to everyone before are still free for premium passengers like elite frequent-fliers and those people who travel in first class or business class.

    "Food is the easiest one for me to defend," Garton said of American's decision to charge $3 for a cookie or a can of potato chips in coach. "When you open your minibar at the hotel tonight, it's not going to be free. When you go to the movie theater, the popcorn is going to cost you more than the ticket. Giving away food for free is an unusual thing the airlines started 70 years ago, but I would argue it was all first-class service 70 years ago."

    Delta, the only one of the six legacy carriers not charging a fee for a first checked bag, is using technology and infrastructure upgrades to improve its baggage handling. It is about halfway through a $100 million capital project at its Atlanta hub that includes upgrading conveyor belts and sorting systems. It also has invested $10 million this year to roll out more wireless bag scanners so it can keep better track of where bags are in the transfer process.

    Lee Macenczak, Delta's executive vice president of sales and marketing, said the airline holds itself to a high standard when it comes to speed and convenience.

    "To the degree we don't deliver on that, it certainly does impact our brand," he said. "We are not satisfied where we are. We have a lot of work to do."

    Stephen Gorman, Delta's executive vice president of operations, said weather issues can skew the on-time data. He said the carrier is working hard to improve what it can control.

    "The foundation is on-time, clean, with bags, and friendly customer service," Gorman said. "Those are the fundamentals we know we have to do right."

    Southwest Airlines Co. which has not faced the same threat from fuel prices as other carriers because of its aggressive fuel hedging program, boasts in recent TV commercials of still allowing all its passengers to check two bags for free. Its on-time arrival rate in July, third-highest among U.S. carriers, was nearly 20 percentage points above Comair's.

    The Dallas-based airline led the industry in passenger satisfaction in the latest University of Michigan survey.

    "We've got to be in the business to make money, but not to sacrifice what our brand and our product offering is," said Daryl Krause, Southwest's senior vice president of customer services.

    AP Business Writers Chris Kahn in Phoenix and Joshua Freed in Minneapolis contributed to this report.

    http://www.forbes.com/feeds/ap/2008/...partner=alerts
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  16. #716
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    When did sw stop taking cash for liquor sales?

  17. #717
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    Quote Originally Posted by downtownguy25
    When did sw stop taking cash for liquor sales?
    IIRC, September 9th.

  18. #718
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Another reason why you shouldn't check bags for any trips a week or less... If you feel you have to, you should become a better packer or buy more functional luggage. You're average 22" in with a built in Trifold will hold quite a bit. Not to mention the fact you still have one smaller bag you can carry on with it.

    If you really want to check, you should invest in becoming an elite. The benefit of Gold, Plat, and ExPlat are worth every penny and you don't have to fly alot to get the miles these days...

  19. #719
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    America's Most Reliable Airlines

    I am surprised AAmerican place as high as they did in this report, way to go AA.


    America's Most Reliable Airlines


    Rebecca Ruiz, 10.01.08, 6:00 AM ET

    Common wisdom says that buying cheap is more expensive in the long run.

    When it comes to air travel, consumers probably expect this to be true. After all, budget carriers aren't always considered smooth-running operations offering a consistent level of service. But according to our analysis of the nation's 10 major airlines, discount carriers actually rank first in reliability.

    Southwest Airlines , the no-frills discount carrier, handily beat the competition in most of the categories we judged. JetBlue , also considered a discount airline despite its plush leather seats and individual television sets, ranked third just behind Continental Airlines . Fourth place went to AirTran , another budget carrier.

    In Depth: America's Most Reliable Airlines

    Alaska Airlines, Northwest Airlines , American Airlines and Delta Air Lines were solidly average performers. United Airlines and US Airways landed at the bottom of the list.

    Methodology

    To judge reliability in the airline industry, particularly at a time when carriers are responding to oil prices by slashing capacity and raising prices, we looked at six different factors for 10 major airlines. (Frontier Airlines, a budget carrier, was omitted because we could not obtain certain figures for each year.)

    We collected five years' worth of data relating to on-time arrival, cancellations, complaints and mishandled baggage from the Aviation Consumer Protection Division of the Department of Transportation. Delays and cancellations, the factors most likely to ruin a flier's day, were given double weight.

    In Depth: Best And Worst By Category

    To better gauge the overall flying experience, we included J.D. Power and Associates' consumer satisfaction rankings from 2005 to 2008. These surveys reach more than 9,000 travelers annually and ask participants to rate factors like cost and fees, in-flight services and check-in.

    Finally, because solvency is critical during these uncertain times, we considered an airline's asset-to-liability ratio for the latest quarter.

    The Results


    When all of these figures were combined, the discount airlines consistently rose to the top. For each of the years we studied, Southwest's flights were punctual more than 80% of the time; the average was 76.8%. Alaska Airlines gave the most dismal performance, with only 74.6% on-time flights.

    In terms of canceled flights, Southwest reigns yet again. The carrier canceled an average of 0.65% of its flights over the five-year period, compared with the worst airline, American, which canceled an average of 2.4%.

    AirTran, another budget carrier, had the fewest reports of mishandled baggage--a contentious issue now that airlines are charging as much as $50 to check regular-sized luggage. In 2007, AirTran had about four reports of mishandled baggage per 1,000 customers. The worst-ranking airline, US Airways, had 8.5.

    While consistency in these categories is important, customer service is an equally powerful factor. Sam Thanawalla, director of the global hospitality and travel practice at J.D. Power and Associates, argues that reliability means "delivering on the promises." This includes getting passengers to their destination in a timely fashion, but also cultivating a workforce that puts the consumer first and can resolve problems or complications quickly.

    Thanawalla says that JetBlue and Southwest, along with Continental, have excelled at this approach. Consumers have routinely rewarded these airlines with high rankings in annual J.D. Power satisfaction surveys.

    Long-Term Reliability


    While the budget carriers currently have a "reliability" edge over their competition, the industry is transforming swiftly under the pressure of oil prices, and long-term reputations hinge on how companies respond now.

    William Swebar, research engineer at Massachusetts Institute of Technology's International Center for Air Transportation, views the change as invigorating for the troubled industry. This year alone, 30 airlines around the world declared bankruptcy, and major airlines posted record losses.

    What's your experience with the nation's airlines been like this year? Weigh in. Post your thoughts in the Reader Comment section below.

    Swebar's hope is that airlines will restructure their business plans for long-term stability instead of building them around cheap oil. This means cutting capacity and charging customers for services that were once free; even the budget airlines have begun charging as much as $30 for seats with extra leg room.

    "That's the sensitive part of all of this," he says. "It's going to move the consumer's expectation needle."

    But, he says, consumers have been on the winning side of a deregulated airline industry for the past 30 years. When adjusted for inflation, airfares are now 50% cheaper than before deregulation.

    "Consumers have won big on price," he says, "but they've paid on the reliability side."

    Swebar envisions a day when the increased fees will reflect an actual premium of service, not just desperation to break even or turn a small profit.

    "Any call to arms for the industry to look at itself and begin to put the consumer first," he says, "would be a terrific first step."

    Methodology:


    To judge reliability in the airline industry, particularly at a time when carriers are responding to oil prices by slashing capacity and raising prices, we looked at six very different factors for 10 major airlines. (Frontier Airlines, a budget carrier, was omitted because we could not obtain certain figures for each year.)

    We collected five years' worth of data concerning on-time arrival, cancellations, complaints and mishandled baggage from the Aviation Consumer Protection Division of the Department of Transportation. Delays and cancellations, the factors most likely to ruin a flier's day, were given double weight.

    To better gauge the overall flying experience, we included J.D. Power and Associates consumer satisfaction rankings from 2005 to 2008. These surveys reached more than 9,000 travelers annually and asked them to judge factors like cost and fees, in-flight services and check-in.

    Lastly, because solvency is critical during these shaky times, we considered an airline's asset-to-liability ratio for the latest quarter.

    Scores were calculated for each category, then a mean score and standard deviation determined. Airlines were given points based on where they fell between the upper and lower limits of the standard deviation. Those points were combined for a total score.

    http://www.forbes.com/2008/09/30/air...vel_print.html
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  20. #720
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    Quote Originally Posted by aygriffith
    Another reason why you shouldn't check bags for any trips a week or less... If you feel you have to, you should become a better packer or buy more functional luggage. You're average 22" in with a built in Trifold will hold quite a bit. Not to mention the fact you still have one smaller bag you can carry on with it.
    Unless you want to bring a tube of toothpaste along.

  21. #721
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Southwest Airlines Announces Intent to Begin Service to...

    This could develop into a great tie in with the new international codeshare service previously announced by Southwest.

    Southwest Airlines Announces Intent to Begin Service to Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport
    Carrier Plans Modest Start-Up with Flights to Chicago Midway in March 2009


    Last update: 4:30 p.m. EDT Oct. 1, 2008
    DALLAS, Oct 01, 2008 /PRNewswire-FirstCall via COMTEX/ -- Southwest Airlines today announced its intent to begin service from Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport (MSP) in March 2009. The carrier has not released specific service details, saying only that it will begin a modest operation at MSP with flights to Chicago Midway only.
    "Minneapolis-St. Paul's geographic location complements the vast Southwest Airlines network really well," said Gary Kelly, Southwest's Chairman of the Board, President, and CEO. "We have studied and been interested in serving this very popular market for quite some time, and we look forward to bringing our low fares and legendary Customer Service to the people of Minnesota.
    "Presently, we intend to grow our 2009 fleet by no more than ten Boeing 737-700 aircraft. We recently deferred four aircraft scheduled for delivery from Boeing in 2009 to 2016. While it is very likely we will not grow our available seat miles in 2009, our new schedule optimization tools allow us to better manage our fleet and adjust our flight schedule to take advantage of great opportunities such as Minneapolis-St. Paul," Kelly said.
    The Company plans to release more details of its future service to Minneapolis-St. Paul in the coming months.
    "One of the most frequent questions I have been asked over the years is, 'When is Southwest Airlines coming to Minneapolis-St. Paul International Airport?' Today, I can finally give people the answer we have been working toward: 'Very, very soon.' I am confident Southwest will receive overwhelming community support for its new service to the Twin Cities," said Executive Director of Metropolitan Airport Commission Jeff Hamiel. "The Metropolitan Airports Commission stands ready to assist the airline in establishing and growing service to Minnesota."

    After 37 years of service, Southwest Airlines, the nation's leading low-fare carrier, continues to stand above other airlines -- offering a reliable product with exemplary Customer Service with no hidden fees. Southwest Airlines is the most productive airline in the sky and offers Customers a comfortable traveling experience with all premium leather seats and plenty of legroom. Southwest recently updated its gate areas and improved its boarding procedure to make flying Southwest Airlines even more convenient. Southwest Airlines

    , the nation's largest carrier in terms of domestic passengers enplaned, currently serves 64 cities in 32 states. Based in Dallas, Southwest currently operates more than 3,400 flights a day and has more than 34,000 Employees systemwide.

    http://www.southwest.com

    SOURCE Southwest Airlines
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  22. #722
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal Lecter
    Unless you want to bring a tube of toothpaste along.
    http://www.minimus.biz/SearchResult.aspx?CategoryID=29

  23. #723
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal Lecter
    Unless you want to bring a tube of toothpaste along.
    Your friendly neighborhood downtown CVS has a whole section of travel sized bathroom items right at the front by the Main St entrance. If that doesn't work for you, you can always ask your hotel. I don't even bring a toothbrush anymore when traveling, I just ask the hotel front desk for one. Its much easier and cleaner than putting a toothbrush in your little zip lock bag.

    This works unless you are staying at the Econo lodge. If thats the case maybe you need to invest in better lodging...

    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    United Airlines and US Airways landed at the bottom of the list.
    This was all too apparent in my latest United flight plan on Sat to Tues from DFW-DEN-EGE-DEN-DFW. The 735 and 733 that I rode on make an AA MD-80 look brand new. The combination of horrible old seat coverings in coach and even worse textiles in First Class (if you could call it that) just make you feel like the plane hasn't been cleaned or updated since the 80's.

    As for US Air, I'm sad to say I hold quite a bit of miles with US because of traveling to small east coast cities that AA doesn't seem to serve reguarly out of DFW. Their service and staff are deplorable and seem to get worse with every flight. "Sir would you like a Coke Product?... That will be 2 dollars!" People still get pissed every flight I'm on because of that. And their choice of PHL as a east coast hub makes an AA trip through MIA or ORD enjoyable. My favorite is transfering planes at PHL and having to do it in the F('ed) terminal... a real pleasure!

    If you want to read the latest thread about someones current train wreck experience on US Air I'll link to it below, it envolves gate attendants cursing at military personel and vise versa...

    http://www.flyertalk.com/forum/showthread.php?t=871866

  24. #724
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    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    Hindsight is 20/20. Of course, now, it's easy to say hedging was the right thing to do. Had oil not skyrocketed in price, however, Southwest would not be so 'wise'. But that's not to say that I think they are lucky. As stated before, they definitely did the smart thing. Good management, no doubt.
    Southwest Airlines posts first quarterly loss in 17 years on fuel charge
    10:36 PM CDT on Thursday, October 16, 2008
    By ERIC TORBENSON / The Dallas Morning News
    etorbenson@dallasnews.com

    The words quarterly loss and Southwest Airlines Co. haven't been put together for more than 17 years, but the Dallas-based company said Thursday it lost $120 million in the third quarter based on accounting charges related to its fuel-hedging program.
    In full:

    http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...11a244a34.html

  25. #725
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    U.S. airfares hit new high in second quarter

    Thanks SW for keeping it low.

    DMN: U.S. airfares hit new high in second quarter
    03:40 PM CDT on Wednesday, October 29, 2008
    By TERRY MAXON / The Dallas Morning News

    Average air fares on domestic routes have reached their highest level in the 13 years they’ve been tracked by the U.S. Department of Transportation, the DOT said Wednesday.

    The department said the average domestic fares reached $352 in the second quarter, up 8.1 percent from the same period in 2007. That number beats the previous high of $348 set in first quarter 2001, just before the industry plunged into a prolonged recession.

    DOT said the highest average fares were paid by passengers flying out of Cincinnati, at $595. That number represents the one-way fares or half of a round trip fare. Next was Greenville/Spartanburg, S.C., $568, Knoxville TN, $524; Madison, Wis., $468; and Grand Rapids, Mich., $461

    Dallas Love Field had the lowest average fares at $221, followed by Burbank, Calif., $252; Houston Hobby, $256; Chicago Midway, $257; and Oakland, Calif.

    The results underscore the success that U.S. airlines have had in raising average fares, an effort that picked up speed as the carriers dealt with sharply higher fuel prices in latter 2007 and through much of 2008.

    In third-quarter earnings reports, the carriers touted their higher passengers revenues despite cuts in capacity or pullbacks in growth rates. In addition, they as a group are bringing in billions of dollars more through new fees for checking bags, better seat assignments, onboard sales and other items.
    Last edited by tamtagon; 29 October 2008 at 04:53 PM. Reason: crediting & linking source media and author

  26. #726
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    Quote Originally Posted by ihavebeenseen
    Thanks SW for keeping it low.
    Thanks in large part to those airports having relatively little (if any) first/premium class fares (due to Southwest's significant presence).

    Because I can assure you that my regular DAL-HOU-DAL hops are only getting more expensive. Non-advance one-way fares continue to climb, jumping 4% next month ($122 to $127).

  27. #727
    Incoherent Rambler grantboston's Avatar
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    It also helps that the vast majority of DAL fares are to destinations beginning and ending within the Wright perimeter. Once Wright finally goes away, I would expect to see the average fare go up due to the longer stage length. Simply, it typically costs more to fly someone to Seattle than to San Antonio.

  28. #728
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    Thanks in large part to those airports having relatively little (if any) first/premium class fares (due to Southwest's significant presence).
    I believe there isn't any FC at DAL... unless CO Connection is flying 2 class CRJ-900's. But I'm pretty sure they're flying an ERJ out of DAL.

  29. #729
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    Quote Originally Posted by grantboston
    It also helps that the vast majority of DAL fares are to destinations beginning and ending within the Wright perimeter. Once Wright finally goes away, I would expect to see the average fare go up due to the longer stage length. Simply, it typically costs more to fly someone to Seattle than to San Antonio.

    Burbank is a SW destination and Hobby, Midway and Oakland are SW focus cities. These were next lowest.

  30. #730
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    Quote Originally Posted by ihavebeenseen
    Burbank is a SW destination and Hobby, Midway and Oakland are SW focus cities. These were next lowest.
    Quote Originally Posted by interestedobserver
    Thanks in large part to those airports having relatively little (if any) first/premium class fares (due to Southwest's significant presence).

    Because I can assure you that my regular DAL-HOU-DAL hops are only getting more expensive. Non-advance one-way fares continue to climb, jumping 4% next month ($122 to $127).
    ...

  31. #731
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    Southwest Airlines to buy ATA to get New York LaGuardia slots

    http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...a.3129e9f.html

    Finally, that Long Island destination was useless. SW going to LGA makes a strong case for them finally going to ATL.

    07:20 AM CST on Wednesday, November 19, 2008
    By TERRY MAXON / The Dallas Morning News
    tmaxon@dallasnews.com

    Southwest Airlines Co. plans to buy ATA Airlines so it can obtain the bankrupt carrier's operating slots at New York LaGuardia Airport, the airline confirmed Tuesday evening.

    Southwest spokeswoman Beth Harbin said the airline intends to start service out of LaGuardia, assuming the U.S. Bankruptcy Court in Indianapolis approves Southwest's bid of $7.5 million.

    "We're working with ATA Airlines with the conditions and terms of the bid," Ms. Harbin said. "The intent is not to operate ATA Airlines. The intent is to allow Southwest Airlines to acquire the LaGuardia slots."

    The deal, first reported by Bloomberg News, would give Southwest the control of 14 takeoff and landing slots, sufficient to operate seven round-trip flights a day.

    While Southwest has operated on Long Island out of Islip, N.Y., since 1999, it has bypassed the three major New York-area airports, LaGuardia, Kennedy and Newark.

    Its strategy has long been to avoid congested airports like the New York facilities and to fly to secondary airports where operating costs and air traffic control problems would be less.

    However, as it has begun to run out of those types of airports and markets to enter, Southwest has turned its eye to markets it previously avoided.

    Southwest chairman and chief executive Gary Kelly recently announced plans to launch flights in March to Minneapolis-St. Paul, a connecting hub for Northwest Airlines Inc. In the last two years, it has re-entered the highly competitive San Francisco market and Denver.

    Now, Ms. Harbin said, Southwest officials think it is time to enter LaGuardia.

    "We've matured to the point where we can contemplate it," Ms. Harbin said. "Gary has said several times that if there are prudent opportunities out there, we should be looking at them. This is certainly one."

    Ms. Harbin stressed that although Southwest has legally offered to buy ATA Airlines, it is doing so only to gain control of ATA's LaGuardia's slots.

    "We're being very clear that it doesn't include any aircraft, facilities or employees of ATA," she said.


    In bankruptcy

    Southwest had once competed heavily against ATA out of Chicago Midway. But after ATA filed for bankruptcy its first time, Southwest worked out a deal in 2004 to buy gates and other facilities at Midway and to share passengers with ATA, including having ATA carry Southwest customers from Chicago to LaGuardia.

    ATA exited bankruptcy in 2006. But after months of mounting losses, the carrier filed for bankruptcy again earlier this year and ceased operations. It already had stopped service to New York, and its grounding also left Southwest without any way to get its customers to Hawaii.

    Southwest's bid, which was filed Tuesday evening by ATA, will be taken up in hearings scheduled for Friday and Dec. 2 in the Indianapolis court.

    In its request for approval of the deal, ATA told the bankruptcy court Tuesday that the FAA had been talking for months about whether ATA could retain control of the slots it was no longer using, since the federal government has proposed redistributing some of the landing and takeoff rights at the New York airports.

    "The FAA indicated during those discussions that it would only recognize the continuation of the operating authorities through a sale of the company," ATA said in its filing.


    Only bidder

    ATA said it leases 12 of the LaGuardia slots to AirTran Airways Inc., as well as two at Washington National.

    Although 13 parties had expressed interest in bidding, ATA said in its filing that Southwest wound up being the only bidder. ATA attorneys and Southwest officials met for five hours Nov. 10 in Dallas.

    "As part of that negotiation session, the debtor was successful in getting Southwest to increase materially the purchase price for the business and also negotiated the exclusion of the debtor's slot rights at Ronald Reagan Washington National Airport from the assets comprising the business," ATA said.

    The documents indicate that ATA and Southwest expect the deal to close March 2.

    Shares of Southwest fell 8 cents to $9.82 on Tuesday and fell to $9.79 in after-hours trading.

  32. #732
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Do 738's not have the range to get to hawaii?

    Wouldn't you love to see one of the ATA Trijets in southwest colors doing widebody service to Hawaii? Its almost be good as the lone Southwest DC-9 once flown.

  33. #733
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    The newer 737's have the range. In fact, Alaska Airlines flies them between Seattle and Honolulu. The problem is you have to have the aircraft, crews and maintenance procedures all certified for ETOPS, which is neither easy nor cheap. SW management has publicly said it's not worth it to them.

    One of the problems with offering service to Hawaii is it's a money-loser. Not many folks travel there for business (on business fares), but lots of folks want to use their frequent flier miles to get there. This problem would be particularly pronounced for SWA with their segment-based awards. Fly 8 roundtrips between Dallas and Austin and you get a free ticket to Hawaii? :-)

    I heard once of the head of America West making the point with a picture of a 747 they used to Hawaii. He said that all the paying customers were on the upper deck. Everyone on the lower deck was using frequent flier miles. It cost them a fortune to operate the service, but they had to in order to compete with American.

  34. #734
    Skyscraper Member Spjz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal Lecter
    Everyone on the lower deck was using frequent flier miles. It cost them a fortune to operate the service, but they had to in order to compete with American.
    Don't mind if I do!

  35. #735
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Correction

    Quote Originally Posted by aygriffith
    Do 738's not have the range to get to hawaii?

    Wouldn't you love to see one of the ATA Trijets in southwest colors doing widebody service to Hawaii? Its almost be good as the lone Southwest DC-9 once flown.
    First part is academic, as WN does not have any 737-800's in the fleet or on order. http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/p...eet.html#Fleet

    I think you meant 727 not DC-9.... they did operate a 727 years ago, I don't recall any DC-9's ever being in the WN fleet.
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  36. #736
    High-Rise Member F4shionablecHa0s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    First part is academic, as WN does not have any 737-800's in the fleet or on order. http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/p...eet.html#Fleet

    I think you meant 727 not DC-9.... they did operate a 727 years ago, I don't recall any DC-9's ever being in the WN fleet.
    You know exactly what he meant.

    And yes, the 737-700 that Southwest operates has ample range to reach Hawaii.

    I'm so sick of people nitpicking each other to death in a desperate attempt to sound smarter online.

  37. #737
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    You know exactly what he meant.

    And yes, the 737-700 that Southwest operates has ample range to reach Hawaii.

    I'm so sick of people nitpicking each other to death in a desperate attempt to sound smarter online.
    Not sure what you perceive the problem with my response to be??

    The OP mentioned 738, which is accepted shorthand for the B-737-800 model. That model has the seating capacity (180+) to offer a good return on that type of route. WN has 737-700's which while they have the range, are configured with 137 seats, therefor would not be a great choice for that particular route vs the 737-800 or 900ER.

    Now if your complaining about my correction of McDonald Dugless DC-9 vs Boeing 727, the huge difference between these two aircraft from two different manufactures, could hardly be called a nit.
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  38. #738
    High-Rise Member F4shionablecHa0s's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    The OP mentioned 738, which is accepted shorthand for the B-737-800 model. That model has the seating capacity (180+) to offer a good return on that type of route. WN has 737-700's which while they have the range, are configured with 137 seats, therefor would not be a great choice for that particular route vs the 737-800 or 900ER.
    Well, speculating on how Southwest would configure their 737-800's would be purely academic, as would attempting to extrapolate the yields they could get on a Hawaii route.

    And the problem I had with your post was how you jumped on the poster who confused the 737-800 with the 737-700 and didn't even bother to include the answer to the question the poster was asking.

    Southwest could make the yields to Hawaii work, but the real problem would be certifying those planes for ETOPS, as Hannibal Lecter pointed out.

  39. #739
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    Well, speculating on how Southwest would configure their 737-800's would be purely academic, as would attempting to extrapolate the yields they could get on a Hawaii route.

    And the problem I had with your post was how you jumped on the poster who confused the 737-800 with the 737-700 and didn't even bother to include the answer to the question the poster was asking.

    Southwest could make the yields to Hawaii work, but the real problem would be certifying those planes for ETOPS, as Hannibal Lecter pointed out.
    I have no idea why you are being so hostile, or think I was jumping on anyone...but it is clear you are jumping all over me for providing information.The OP used the shorthand for the 737-800, so it did not look as if he was confused as you assumed.

    Perhaps you missed the facts I pointed out in my first post, WN does not have any 737-800 in their fleet, nor do they have any 737-800 on order. In addition I will point out, all current WN orders are for 737-700.

    Perhaps you do not realize Boeing announced the end of 737 production in 2014, although that has now been modified. http://www.b737.org.uk/newsreports.htm
    Can things change between now and then? Of course, but the logistics of adding 800 and 900 variants to the WN fleet suggest that to be a very low probability.
    Rather adding one of the newer aircraft designs is a higher probability. With all the other more productive opportunities directly available, adding a code share partner that operates to Hawaii is the highest probability.
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  40. #740
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    Would Southwest be allowed to fly to Mexico from Love Field?

  41. #741
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Would Southwest be allowed to fly to Mexico from Love Field?
    Non-stop international flights may not arrive or depart from Love Field.

    http://commerce.senate.gov/public/in...th=9&Year=2006
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  42. #742
    Mega-Tall Skyscraper Member AeroD's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    Non-stop international flights may not arrive or depart from Love Field.

    http://commerce.senate.gov/public/in...th=9&Year=2006
    Give it about 2 or 3 years after Love is open to the entire country, and the whisper campaign to open Love Field to Canada and Mexico will begin.
    Tighten the female dog!

  43. #743
    Incoherent Rambler grantboston's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by AeroD
    Give it about 2 or 3 years after Love is open to the entire country, and the whisper campaign to open Love Field to Canada and Mexico will begin.
    Ding ding!

    I think an interim first step (assuming Southwest's pilots don't shoot it down) will have Volaris fly to Houston or somewhere else. DAL flights will connect to Mexico and elsewhere from there. I agree though, once the renovation of DAL is done, I can see Southwest (and maybe some others) clamor for a truly open DAL.

  44. #744
    Skyscraper Member electricron's Avatar
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    Lightbulb

    How many International Airports, with US Customs in place, does DFW need?

    DFW is available for both passengers and freight.
    Alliance is available for just freight.

    Love Field isn't needed. I'm not even sure US Customs would want to man another airport in the DFW area.

    Dream on, but let's be realistic. If there is no need, it's not going to happen.

  45. #745
    Just Changing Planes aygriffith's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    First part is academic, as WN does not have any 737-800's in the fleet or on order. http://www.southwest.com/about_swa/p...eet.html#Fleet

    I think you meant 727 not DC-9.... they did operate a 727 years ago, I don't recall any DC-9's ever being in the WN fleet.
    Sir Sorry Sir! I appologize for my gross errors on trijet types and 737NG series types.

    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Would Southwest be allowed to fly to Mexico from Love Field?
    I think you only need to fly on AA A300's with heavy usage in the Carribean and South America to realize how dirty and worn planes to anywhere south of the border get. Discount fares to Mexico and the Carribean would age a plane's interior 3 years for every 1.


    I did get to fly on a SWA 737-700 simulator on Saturday... pretty amazing ride from the cockpit. But due to my performance, I unfortunately should probably stick to riding in the back of the plane.

  46. #746
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by aygriffith
    Sir Sorry Sir! I appologize for my gross errors on trijet types and 737NG series types.



    I think you only need to fly on AA A300's with heavy usage in the Carribean and South America to realize how dirty and worn planes to anywhere south of the border get. Discount fares to Mexico and the Carribean would age a plane's interior 3 years for every 1.


    I did get to fly on a SWA 737-700 simulator on Saturday... pretty amazing ride from the cockpit. But due to my performance, I unfortunately should probably stick to riding in the back of the plane.
    No apology necessary, obviously an honest error. I just wanted to set the record straight so it did not propagate via the power of the internet.

    Good point you make on aircraft operated outside the US proper.I have not flown on their A300 series, but their ATR's did seem to hold up OK in the Caribbean over the last few years.

    However, whoever the person was that decided for AA that the ATR was a good fit for their inter island fights should be fired. I say that because they must operate these 66 seat aircraft with about 15 empty seats whenever the weather gets above about 84f, due to power to weight limitations of this design. In my many trips between SJU and the other islands over half the time passengers were bumped to another flight at a cooler time of the day or next day because American Eagle had to reduce payload weight by leaving 15 seats empty. I have wanted to ask AA just when is it they don't have warm days in the Caribbean? duhh....
    I see they recently replaced most of the ATR's with other aircraft types on the Caribbean routes.... about time...

    Back to the SWA 727, did you see the pictures of it hanging in the 2nd floor hallway of the training center when you were there to fly the Sim? If not I can understand, because they have so many pictures and memorabilia displayed in hallways, the place is a virtual aviation museum. Was Joi your "tour guide" when you went to fly the Sim?
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  47. #747
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    Quote Originally Posted by electricron
    Love Field isn't needed. I'm not even sure US Customs would want to man another airport in the DFW area.
    Love Field already has a U.S. Customs office. I've flown a charter to/from Mexico from Love. Private jets fly to Mexico and the Caribbean all the time. Only scheduled, non-stop service is prohibited.

  48. #748
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    Quote Originally Posted by Hannibal Lecter
    Love Field already has a U.S. Customs office. I've flown a charter to/from Mexico from Love. Private jets fly to Mexico and the Caribbean all the time. Only scheduled, non-stop service is prohibited.
    I believe (but am not positive), that the Wright Amendment also somehow limits the number of charters per month. Because, you know, the world would explode if Dallas residents were actually able to take commercial flights out of Love to places they wanted to go.

  49. #749
    High-Rise Member TexasPlus's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UptownDallas
    I believe (but am not positive), that the Wright Amendment also somehow limits the number of charters per month. Because, you know, the world would explode if Dallas residents were actually able to take commercial flights out of Love to places they wanted to go.
    From the link I posted a few messages back:
    "* Charter flights at Love Field: Charter flights at Love Field will not be affected and will continue to hold all current rights and privileges."
    "Liberalism: Moochers Electing Looters to Steal from Producers."

  50. #750
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    Quote Originally Posted by TexasPlus
    From the link I posted a few messages back:
    Thanks... but doesn't the original Wright Amendment contain some sort of monthly cap on scheduled charter flights... I could have sworn this was one of the issues I looked at. Then again, I may just be going senile.

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