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Thread: "Dallas at the Tipping Point:" News special on WFAA

  1. #101
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    BTW, Lakewooder, I went by Lakewood today and got some shots of White Rock Lake- the area is absolutely beautiful.

    And let's think about this:

    When you go to NYC, where do you want to go? The Bronx? Brooklyn? Queens?

    or... MANHATTAN?

    err, ah, DUH.

    Uptown and downtown are Dallas' Manhattan. Uptown and Downtown will both have 4 LRT Lines (2 tracks, I know..) running through them by the end of this decade. It's where the greatest access is. Its where the money is. Its where the shops, the hotels, the clubs, the parks, and everything is! We can't act like Dallas is a bad city just because one area happens to be nicer than the other area. Its very typical for large cities to have this.

    I just wanted to point out that this is the reason why uptown has remained a "nice" area to live, however irrelevant it is to this thread.

    umm.. yeah.. sorry bout that.
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  2. #102
    Skyscraper Member LakeHighlands's Avatar
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    Thanks for the info Noelamador. I probably should of clarified what I meant by mall. I was referring to traditional all enclosed air condition malls with Anchor Stores. I know NorthPark was # 1 for a long time, but Lord and Taylor had been hurting NorthPark Sales per square feet. My favorite store is now closed. What a shame. (I despise MAY company for what they did to Lord and Taylor.) That will have a negative effect on the sales at NP for a while, until Nordstrom moves in. But NP still has the # 1, Neiman Marcus, # 1Dillard’s, and # 1 Foley’s in sales per square feet in each company. Let hope that the new Nordstrom can join that list.

    1) Bal Harbor Shops, Beautiful but it is an open air mall. It does have the # 1 sales per square feet if it is put up against regular malls. I was just at the Bal Harbor Shops 2 week ago from today. It’s a lot smaller than NP, but VERY nice. We were disappointed about one thing; Neiman Marcus does not have a salon in the Bal Harbor store. We also walked the Shops at Wellington Green, The Gardens at Palm Beach, Worth Ave, and the Town Center at Boca Raton. (Boca is getting a new Neiman Marcus)


    2) Americana at Manhasset/Long Island – Not a traditional mall. It is just like Highland Park Village. Stores that face the street like in a lifestyle center. The new Firewheel Town Center in Garland will be like this.

    3) Ala Moana/Hawaii --- I think everyone should see this Mall/ Shopping Center. Amazing, but it is not a traditional mall. The Second and third floor is a mall, but parts of the first is like a strip shopping center. (Stores face the outside) Old Navy faces the outside, and Mc Donald’s too. It is odd to see Sears, Old Navy, and Neiman Marcus in the same mall.

    4) Forum Shops/Las Vegas --Simple, not a traditional mall. It lacks Department Stores. WAY MORE beautiful than NorthPark, but not in the same field.

    5) South Coast Plaza/Orange County-- Now this is a traditional mall, the kind I was using when comparing NorthPark Sales per sq. ft. Only one thing, the mall is kind of spread out. Not touching in places. It would be like the Galleria building a sky bridge to the Galleria North.


    I am sorry I should have been clearer, you are right if the looked at all lifestyle centers, but I was referring to traditional all enclose air-conditioned malls. “The Dinosaurs of the industry” NorthPark probably isn’t number one in traditional anymore considering they have an empty Lord and Taylor sting there. But once Nordstrom moves in, hopefully NP will get its spot back.
    "One of Dallas' strongest communities, Lake Highlands boasts a true sense of neighborhood spirit. Local stores reflect passionate support for Lake Highlands schools with school posters and signs. True to its name, the area features handsome traditional homes up and down rolling hills and charming, winding roads." --Lake Highlands People

  3. #103
    High-Rise Member F4shionablecHa0s's Avatar
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    My father is a director at Neiman's and the store at NP is making money hand over fist. I visited the Bal Harbor store with him a while back. It's nice, but it still doesn't get anywhere near the volume of sales seen in Dallas.

    It's a bit sad to see other stores outperform the downtown store, but it's still making quite a bit of money. Lots of rich old ladies.

    Another thing to think about - there is one Neiman's store in all of New York state. Five in all of California. Dallas/Ft. Worth alone has four. Our economy has got to be doing something right.

  4. #104
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    We have no Bloomingdales, though. And NYC has countless Bloomingdales - the reason is that Neimans was started in Downtown Dallas, and Bloomingdales was (I believe,) started in NYC. It's more or less a matter of territory than a matter of economic health.
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  5. #105
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakewooder
    LOL BTW, we in Lakewood don't like being lumped in with North Dallas or especially Lake Highlands ...
    Ha ha, that's funny to me. I live in Parkdale- which is off Lawnview just a hair south of I-30 and the neighborhood extends west to White Rock Creek and South to Scyene Rd (at the northern tip of the Great Trinity Forest.) I can throw a rock and hit Dixon Circle......in South Dallas. By all geagraphic assounts, Parkdale is South Dallas. According the Dallas Morning News, I'm in Pleasant Grove.

    Now, my little sister is a Dallas cop and she tells me that the criminals think my neighborhood is in Pleasant Grove. And alo, the neighborhood where Bishop Lynch is......Ferguson and Oates......is also in Pleasant Grove. North Dallas is Lakewood AND Lake Highlands. East Dallas is 635 and Marsh. West Dallas and Oak Cliff are the same. About the only thing te criminals get right is South Dallas.

  6. #106
    Mid-Rise Member MustangMonkey's Avatar
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    I bet you didn't even know that TI is located in Richardson or that the Telecom coridor somehow jumped to Plano

    All claims of the Dallas Morning News

    BTW isn't Houston in Oak Cliff?

  7. #107
    Administrator gc's Avatar
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    Editorial

    City over suburbs: Here's why the Drehers chose to stay in Dallas
    12:01 AM CDT on Monday, April 26, 2004
    By ROD DREHER / The Dallas Morning News

    The Drehers aren't supposed to live in Dallas. We're a middle-class family with two young children, the eldest approaching school age. On a balance sheet, it makes sense for a family like us to light out for the suburbs. But after finishing our first year in Dallas living in a rental, we've just purchased our first home – and we chose to stay in Dallas. Here's why.

    It's not that we're Pollyannas about the city. We read The Dallas Morning News' "Tipping Point" report. Yow! Dallas is in trouble. The schools don't work, the cops are a mess, the economy is at loose ends, and, worst of all, there's a demoralizing leadership deficit that doesn't look to improve anytime soon. On paper, we have every incentive to leave for the suburbs. What the suburbs don't have, though, is the little 1918 arts-and-crafts-style bungalow in Old East Dallas that we've just bought. There are lots of nice new houses in nice new suburbs we could have purchased. But we wanted a house with character, a place that had the look and feel of Home. And we got one, at a good price, right here in the city. Lucky us. There were practical reasons we chose to stay in Dallas. We're home-schoolers, so unlike most families, the condition of public education isn't a direct concern for us. Being close to museums and cultural attractions makes us much more likely to use them as a family. We love the Farmers Market, and we'll be living close enough to make it our grocery store. I work long hours downtown, and the time I'll save with my short, sweet nine-minute commute is more time I'll have to spend with my boys.

    But the key element in our decision was something my wife calls the "Funk Factor." We want the funk! Gotta have that funk! We're a couple of Austin-style crunchy conservatives, transplanted from New York City, who feel most comfortable in culturally varied neighborhoods with gentle old houses that look like Willie Nelson's voice sounds.

    That's our new neighborhood, all right. Not too many Collin County McMansions go up next door to a sweet old Mexican couple who've lived there for 35 years and whose garrulous parrot can be heard squawking across the fence. People sit on their front porches on our new street. Ah, civilization. And there's the Garden Café a few blocks away, a real neighborhood hangout you can walk to, where the friendly cooks work with stuff they grow out back, and you can sit out on the patio talking about turnip greens with owner Dale Wootton, who's a pretty funky dude himself (for a lawyer, I mean).

    I guess choosing to buy a house in the city is a vote of confidence in Dallas' future, though I didn't think of it that way when we signed the papers. We bought this house for one reason only: because we loved it. I've lived in places I've loved – Brooklyn, most of all – and in places to which I've felt completely indifferent. Loving where you live makes all the difference. When you love a place and feel you belong there, you have pride of stakeholdership, and you'll take good care of it. Well, Junius Heights is my home now, and I'm here to celebrate it and to fight for it. The Dreher family owns a piece of it now. It's a someplace, not just an anyplace, and, boy, we're glad we're here.

    And given the patterns of development in the city, it's a safe bet that more folks will be discovering this gem of a neighborhood and take the same risk on the city that we have. However small in number, there will always be families like us on whom the (admittedly real) advantages of suburbia are lost. Who prefer the rich diversity of urban life to safe-bet suburban blandness. Who want their kids to grow up knowing Mexican folks as friends and neighbors, not as the help. Who feel happier in a grandmotherly Not-So-Big house than in a bright shining McMansion we'd have to work so long and so hard to afford that we'd miss out on living.

    These folks will find their way to great little city places like Junius Heights, and we'll be on our front porch – imagine, a front porch! – to welcome them. Don't mind the parrot. He's good people.

    Rod Dreher is an assistant editorial page editor of The Dallas Morning News. His e-mail address is rdreher@dallasnews.com.
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  8. #108
    Administrator gc's Avatar
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    And another...

    Michael Landauer: Why I chose the city over the suburbs
    12:01 AM CDT on Monday, April 26, 2004
    By MICHAEL LANDAUER / The Dallas Morning News

    From 1995 to 2000, almost one in five Dallas residents became suburbanites. So why are my wife and I choosing to buy our first home in East Dallas and not in the suburbs, where she was raised and where I have lived the last six years?

    After reading the "Dallas At The Tipping Point" special report in The Morning News last week, you might be wondering that, too. But I am confident in our choice. My wife and I have talked a lot about it, and our decision was based primarily on three things.

    1) Dallas has more people like us. That's most obvious to us when we visit restaurants and when we try out a new church. In the suburbs, it's all families all the time. Not that there's anything wrong with that. We've visited the church near our new home, and we've seen a great diversity of people. The church includes a school and has its share of older folks. But we see many other young married couples. We're excited about that.

    2) Dallas has that "coolness factor." Lower Greenville. Deep Ellum. Mockingbird Station. Even downtown and Fair Park. Those are cool places where you can walk around before choosing a restaurant or popping into a bar. Suburbanites visit those places, too. But let's be honest: Tilting a few and then driving 25 to 30 minutes to get home not only is inconvenient, it's unsafe. We want to live within a cab ride of cool places.

    3) Reports of Dallas' death have been greatly exaggerated. No, I'm not talking about the "Tipping Point" report, which outlines the challenges and pitfalls that the city's current management faces. Rather, I'm talking about the belief that city dwellers deal with unbearable traffic, failing schools and cement, cement, cement.

    Not true. Some cookie-cutter suburbs are growing so fast that they are forgetting to plan for open spaces. Those that do plan for parks can't compete with the natural beauty at White Rock Lake, which is about five minutes from our new home.

    I have plenty of time to figure out the best place to send my yet unborn child to school, and I firmly believe that fleeing under-performing schools won't make them better. Maybe some positive parental involvement, like mine someday, would help. While the dynamic growth of a new suburban neighborhood might seem exciting, we are moving to a neighborhood with a wave of renewal crashing over it. That's exciting, too, and our new neck of the woods actually has woods. Some suburbs have mature trees, too, but I doubt we could have afforded any of those areas.

    Not only do we have mature trees in our new neighborhood, we have a mature transportation system, too. In some ways, traffic isn't as bad in the city as it is in the suburbs. On weekends, Preston Road through Plano is far busier than Mockingbird Lane. And not only will we be able to walk to a nearby rail station, we will be able to ride our bikes to White Rock Lake or to the Katy Trail. My wife and I always have been suburbanites, so we aren't sure we'll become Dallas residents for the rest of our lives. But we're excited about the diversity of cultural, recreational and transportation options in Big D.

    Someday, the suburbs may lure us back. Or maybe Dallas will have found a way to keep people like us in town. But for now, all I know is that we're glad to be swimming against the tide. I'll think about that as I race north on Central Expressway to get to work in Collin County, passing all of those suburbanites stacked up in endless traffic and crawling into work in the big, bad city.


    Michael Landauer is the lead editorial writer for the Collin County Opinions page of The Dallas Morning News. His e-mail address is mlandauer @dallasnews.com.
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  9. #109
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    Wow. That's so awesome.

    The only unfortunate thing is that neither of them are enrolling their children in DISD.. The main thing we need in our city. If we get tons of suburbanites to pack into just one DISD attendance zone.. the schools in said zone would soar.. and serve as an example of how community effort can restore DISD. The schools aren't bad.. the kids are.....
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  10. #110
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    That's a great report fom Dreher. I used to live in a funky little duplex in Junius Heights, and that's just a really neat neighborhood. It's so diverse and really fun. AND SAFE TOO.

  11. #111
    High-Rise Member F4shionablecHa0s's Avatar
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    Home schooled kids. *shudder*

  12. #112
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Hey if I made a pile of money and my wife could afford to stay home and raise kids, you bet they'd be "home schooled". We'd be at museums and plays and civic functions and all kinds of real world stuff, not just sitting at home, not learning any social skills. They would get the best kind of social interaction.

  13. #113
    LH Copycat Columbus Civil's Avatar
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    I wasn't home schooled and I still have no social skills.
    Dallas uber alles

  14. #114
    Smile... :) mikedsjr's Avatar
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    I'm sure those who hate home schooling want to have all kids taught with drugs and condomes in use while at school. geesh.

    Home schoolers are no different than anyone else. They are people raised by those who feel they can give their kids a better life, education, and safety than ISD's can. And with drugs so rampid(if i spelled that right), I wish i could do that or take them to a private christian school. Its scary how different life is today.

    If you want to be urban, you have to be a druggie. Ok. Not really, but how many of you haven't tried drugs? How many of you have had sex outside of a marraige? I'm not criticizing those who have done either or both. These are my values and i stuck to them. To me, Urban schools are more likely to have both of these very visible. And I hope to raise my child to the best of my abilities without having to fear peer pressure that you are an idiot for not doing either of these.

  15. #115
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    To me, Urban schools are more likely to have both of these very visible.
    I would rather raise children where the problem is visable, rather than hidden.

  16. #116
    LH Copycat Columbus Civil's Avatar
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    If I had kids I don't think I'd want them in public schools, either. But drug use is common in just about any kind of school, unfortunately. I went to Catholic schools 1st through 12th grade, and I knew plenty of kids that experimented with drugs. The first time I saw someone smoking marijuana was in Boy Scouts, which is an organization that promotes faith in God among other things. It's a pretty scary world to raise kids in

    I consider myself urban, and I've never tried any illegal drugs.
    Dallas uber alles

  17. #117
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    I have a good friend who lives in Kessler Park and he and his wife put their kid in DISD for this express purpose, which they have discussed at length since thier son was born: he wanted raise his kid in a world where he learned that there was "more to it than only white, anglo-saxon protestant people".

  18. #118
    Administrator gc's Avatar
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    All the kids I grew up with that went to private christian schools were worse than the public school kids...at least in terms of drug use and sex
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  19. #119
    Supertall Skyscraper Member TexasStar's Avatar
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    I'm sure those who hate home schooling want to have all kids taught with drugs and condomes in use while at school. geesh.
    The main problem for the children raised in this antiseptic, white-washed environment is that they will have no way of coping with the real world when they are finally grown and out on their own.
    Assuming that's still the ultimate goal.


    And with drugs so rampid(if i spelled that right), I wish i could do that or take them to a private christian school. Its scary how different life is today.
    No, you didn't -- The word is "rampant" and life is not nearly as scary as some the stuff you're saying.


    Ok. Not really, but how many of you haven't tried drugs?
    Never have, never will.


    How many of you have had sex outside of a marraige?
    OK, you've got me there.

  20. #120
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by texasstar
    OK, you've got me there.
    Ok then. That's special. I hope your wife never develops a sudden infatuation with the history button and just happens upon here. *hack.*

    Anyway.

    Homeschooling.. at least.. strictly beause you want your kids to grow up without worldly influences is disastrous.

    One of my best friends when I was younger was homeschooled.. and.. he's turning out a little funky. And so is his little brother, who's now 12, and still bites at people's legs. They're little sister.. no one knows yet..

    I really don't think that his parents were that great of an influence.. because they reminded me of that sick... everything-is-plastic-and-dirty-and-our-kids-smell-like-lysol-and-we're-the-kind-of-suburban-parents-you-see-on-Oprah-trying-to-figure-out-what-we-did-to-our-children.. people.

    But maybe that's just them.
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  21. #121
    Supertall Skyscraper Member TexasStar's Avatar
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    Hey! Wait a minute! I'm NOT married!
    I thought he meant any sex while outside the bounds of holy matrimony.
    I wasn't talking about CHEATING!

    That would be wrong!

  22. #122
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    oh. he was. well. still.
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  23. #123
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    DISD is not bad, it is not dangerous minds or anything.

    and NO DISD is not full of drugs and sex.
    It does have some problems but not as many as you think.

    I used to go to a bunch of different DISD schools I can name them all.
    Lida Hooe Elementary
    Stevens Park Elementary
    L.O. Donald Elementary
    W.E. Greiner Middle School
    Town View Magnet School

    They were all ok schools with the same amount of drugs and sex that any other school anywhere. I also attended other schools in others towns my dad was a migrant worker at one point. I have been more exposed to drugs and violence from the TV and Movies that I was in school.

    If you ask me it all up to the parent, to teach your kids what they need to know to survive. They need to know that for every action that they make there will be a reaction. Cause and Effect, Kids need to know that they will be held accountable for their actions. Most people will excuse their kids by saying, they are just kids. Well kids need to be punished and rewarded too.

    People will be exposed to drugs, sex and violence no matter what you do, but as parents people need to teach their kids what to do in these types of situations.

    As far as drugs go I do not touch them never have never will, not even doctor prescribe medication.
    The only think I can say I did was drink half a bottle of tequila one time but that’s it (and I was in college).

    peace,
    js



    ps. oh and by the way just about every suburb kid knows where to get drugs, they all go to the same spot. the suburb kids are also the ones with the means (allowance given by parents) to buy the drugs.
    Last edited by js; 27 April 2004 at 06:21 PM.

  24. #124
    Lakewooder Lakewooder's Avatar
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    Thanks Santiago, for 'telling it like it is' from someone who knows.

    I had such a wonderful experience growing up in DALLAS SCHOOLS that I hate to see kids being home schooled who are missing out on such wonderful traditions, sports and camaraderie.

    And I know it's still there at my alma mater, I volunteer and attend many functions...

  25. #125
    High-Rise Member Foucault's Avatar
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    Private Christian schools can have a lot worse drug use than public schools. Same with suburban schools like Highland Park. When I think of Christian schools, I think of drug use and early sex. If you want your child to get a degree from an accredited college (and homeschooling's not an option), they will be exposed to sex and drugs anyway. And they will be much, much more susceptible to peer pressure if they've never had social relationships and don't know healthy ways to make friends.
    And I've never tried drugs, FYI.

  26. #126
    High-Rise Member F4shionablecHa0s's Avatar
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    Speaking as an average high school student who has done....well, all of the "bad" things you've talked about, I can say that the evils of sex and drugs were never forced upon me by my peers. I have friends who obstain from both of those things, and I have friends who indulge. It will be the same at any place.

    The problem with homeschooling is that while it may make the parent feel warm and fuzzy on the inside, it does nothing to prepare the child for the real world. Homeschooling is actually incredibly selfish on the parent's part. In the real world, the child will be contronted with these things and they won't have any idea what to do. School is something that all kids should go through. As horrible as it may sound, kids need to be exposed to bad things. Yes, there are bad things in all schools at times. Will the child live? Of course. I went through my course of rough schools, rough friends, and rough situations. I can tell you one thing - it has made me one tough son of a bitch. When confronted with things, I know how to handle them without running to anyone for help.

    And to be honest, I've interacted with homeschooled kids. They're just creepy. They lack seasoning. It's like talking to a 10 year old in a 16 year old's body.

    DISD is no different than any other school district. The suburban schools are just shiny and new. Dallas ISD is no different than any other school district. I'm not sure what can be done to change people's perceptions of it.

  27. #127
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    The new DISD schools are shiny and new.. all the brand new schools look very nice. Especially the plans for Booker T! You could put a DISD school, i.e. the new-ish Anne Frank Elementary and put it next to a CFB school, and no one would know the difference.
    Last edited by drumguy8800; 27 April 2004 at 11:24 PM.
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  28. #128
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    Booker T is not new its some what old I dont know how old though...

  29. #129
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    Sorry.. I didn't specify that a new Booker T. building was in the works. There was a lady that donated 10 million towards the renovation of the school.. and they're gonna rebuild it.. and stuff. Here's the rendering:



    Nice, eh?
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  30. #130
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    true true i read it in the paper but it is still not new, I think they are only going to renovate it though....

  31. #131
    Skyscraper Member sterling's Avatar
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    The renovation of Booker T. includes building of two L-shaped wings which will more than double it's square footage. The plans by an Oregon firm, will make it one of the most advanced arts schools facility wise in the country. The far reaching plans include an outdoor theater among other amenities.

    And I agree with those who vote FOR public schools. Raising a child in an overly strict environment backfires as soon as the kid gets a "learner's permit". I was raised in a very strict "no dancing, no drinking, no drugging, no mixed-swimming etc..." environment. Believe me, I broke out as soon as I could and explored ALL those things forbidden by my fundamental SAFE upbringing. Hiding kids from real life just makes them that more curious about "forbidden fruit". Are you going to keep them from going to the mall and ban television as well? Why not just join the Taliban?

  32. #132
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    Speaking as an average high school student who has done....well, all of the "bad" things you've talked about, I can say that the evils of sex and drugs were never forced upon me by my peers. I have friends who obstain from both of those things, and I have friends who indulge. It will be the same at any place.

    The problem with homeschooling is that while it may make the parent feel warm and fuzzy on the inside, it does nothing to prepare the child for the real world. Homeschooling is actually incredibly selfish on the parent's part. In the real world, the child will be contronted with these things and they won't have any idea what to do. School is something that all kids should go through. As horrible as it may sound, kids need to be exposed to bad things. Yes, there are bad things in all schools at times. Will the child live? Of course. I went through my course of rough schools, rough friends, and rough situations. I can tell you one thing - it has made me one tough son of a bitch. When confronted with things, I know how to handle them without running to anyone for help.

    And to be honest, I've interacted with homeschooled kids. They're just creepy. They lack seasoning. It's like talking to a 10 year old in a 16 year old's body.

    DISD is no different than any other school district. The suburban schools are just shiny and new. Dallas ISD is no different than any other school district. I'm not sure what can be done to change people's perceptions of it.
    That all depends on the parent. Personally, I don't see that big of difference between exculsive private schools used by the VERY RICH and home schooling by people with monetary means. Like I said earlier, if you or your wife can afford and has the knowledge to teach your kids, let's say you or she has a Masters Degree in Liberal Arts from, oh I don't know, Cambridge and wants to eventually work on your/her PhD, how can you say that you're/she's not qualified to teach your own kids? Even if you/she has a Bachelor's degree and teaching certificate and wants to raise your own kids, I would understand your desire to home school. And who's to say that you/she wouldn't take your kids to museums to veiw art or to sceince and natural history museums to learn and get a hands-on experience. If you/she took your kids with you everywhere you went and the social time they spend is with adults rather than than other kids, I can't see where that's poor socialization. Makes for some pretty precoccious kids.

    I'm just saying that all people who home school aren't poor, crazy hillbillies from the hollars on a mission from god who end up killing their kids with rocks. All home schooled kids aren't social troglodytes. And I think that if I had the monetary means, I would certainly seriously consider it. I think that I would rather impart upon my kids my personal worldview, and if I had the means to do it- say instead of reading about the Byzanntine, we could actually spend three weeks in Greece and Rome and Italy- how would that somehow be less instructive than in a classroom setting? And I think- in fact I know- that there are a LOT of home schooling parents who DO have these means and who ARE teaching their kids in this manner.

    And I find thier children to be the most polite, well adapted and inquisitive kids that are a pleasure to be around.

  33. #133
    High-Rise Member Foucault's Avatar
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    Exclusive private schools used by the VERY RICH and home schooling are way different. Different in that exclusive private schools have very good faculty with advanced degrees and experience, and parents cannot have advanced degrees in twenty different subjects. My parents were PhDs and they would never have homeschooled me; they sent me to an exclusive private school. Why? For one, they never taught grade-school and knew that they were unqualified to teach. For another, going to Greece and Italy to learn about Byzantium (which is in Turkey) is not school. That's a vacation. Likewise, you can take your kids to a museum. It's called a weekend.
    Chances are, if you're qualified to teach your kids English and History and Chemistry and Trig-you will have better things to do than home-school your kids.
    Last edited by Foucault; 29 April 2004 at 08:47 PM.

  34. #134
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Foucault
    Exclusive private schools used by the VERY RICH and home schooling are way different. Different in that exclusive private schools have very good faculty with advanced degrees and experience, and parents cannot have advanced degrees in twenty different subjects. My parents were PhDs and they would never have homeschooled me; they sent me to an exclusive private school. Why? For one, they never taught grade-school and knew that they were unqualified to teach. For another, going to Greece and Italy to learn about Byzantium (which is in Turkey) is not school. That's a vacation. Likewise, you can take your kids to school. It's called a weekend.
    Chances are, if you're qualified to teach your kids English and History and Chemistry and Trig-you will have better things to do than home-school your kids.
    Right........and my whole entire point was that:
    "all people who home school aren't poor, crazy hillbillies from the hollars on a mission from god who end up killing their kids with rocks. All home schooled kids aren't social troglodytes. And I think that if I had the monetary means, I would certainly seriously consider it."

    And: "And I think- in fact I know- that there are a LOT of home schooling parents who DO have these means and who ARE teaching their kids in this manner.

    And I find thier children to be the most polite, well adapted and inquisitive kids that are a pleasure to be around."

  35. #135
    dallacentric drumguy8800's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by foucault
    going to Greece and Italy to learn about Byzantium (which is in Turkey)
    Sure, Present-day Istanbul, Turkey was the capital of the Byzantine Empire, but at one point, it spread into all the countries that trolleygirl mentioned.. influencing them greatly. I was going to post something about it being in Turkey, but I figured that would be rude.
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  36. #136
    LH Copycat Columbus Civil's Avatar
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    It's nobody's business but the Turks.
    Dallas uber alles

  37. #137
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    Oops! My misread. I apologize.
    Thank you for pointing that out.

  38. #138
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    more things change the more they stay the same

    Sunday, July 15, 1990

    SUNDAY READER

    FORREST SMITH

    Dallas First identified problems; now let's implement solutions
    Forrest Smith

    When the law firm of Arter & Hadden presented the Dallas First
    economic study more than two months ago, we predicted it would raise
    considerable controversy.

    We were right.

    Dallas First has brought both enthusiastic applause and more than
    a few protests. Several Dallas City Council members have strongly
    supported its recommendations; Dallas school district officials have
    been defensive; suburban leaders are suspicious but open-minded; the
    business community has been generally enthusiastic but somewhat
    inactive; Mayor Annette Strauss has referred the report to the
    Business and Commerce Committee for consideration.

    Despite the mixed reviews received by the report, no one has
    challenged its findings of fact. And the report has generated far
    more favorable than negative response, particularly from "the man on
    the street.' Only those entities that feel obliquely threatened or
    criticized disagree with the recommendations.

    Dallas First was commissioned to determine the seriousness of the
    economic disparity of Dallas vs. its suburbs. Its findings are
    sobering. The report states: "The disparity in economic development
    trends between the city and its suburbs is so dramatic, and has been
    occurring for such a long period, that it could easily become
    irreversible.'

    The report catalogs Dallas' economic challenges:

    * During 1986-88, Dallas lost 0.9 percent of its population while
    the suburbs gained up to 1.6 percent.

    * During 1979-85, Dallas' per-capita income rose 8.1 percent
    whereas the suburbs' grew by 9.5 percent.

    * During 1972-85, Dallas lost 23 percent of its manufacturing
    jobs; Irving gained 18.2 percent; Carrollton gained 17.3 percent; and
    Richardson gained 7.3 percent.

    * As Dallas lost its manufacturing base, it also lost its
    high-paid skilled labor force. During 1986-88 Dallas lost 2.4
    percent of its manager and professional jobs while the suburbs gained
    8.6 percent.

    These trends are indicators of what every taxpayer in Dallas
    already knows. Our tax base is shrinking.

    Each year we have to either cut services or raise taxes -- or
    both -- just to stay even. There simply is no "extra' money that
    Dallas must have if it is to become competitive with the suburbs.

    Dallas First makes three general recommendations.

    1) No matter how much we appreciate the job the Dallas
    Independent School District is doing, no one denies its reputation is
    a serious negative factor in the fight for economic development. The
    report recommends freedom of choice, decentralization of management,
    better curriculum design and special training for urban teachers at
    the former Bishop College campus, now Paul Quinn College.

    2) Recognizing that Dallas and its suburbs are part of a regional
    economy, the report calls for greater regional fiscal cooperation.
    The suburbs generally agree that Dallas/Fort Worth International
    Airport and the amenities offered by Dallas are key reasons for their
    growth. But they adamantly disagree that they have any
    responsibility for improving the urban core of the region. "We have
    our school district -- you have yours,' is the typical response. "We
    didn't create your public housing problem.' In fact, the burden of
    regionwide social problems today falls completely on the city of
    Dallas. It is Dallas that must find a way to finance a $118 million
    housing settlement, and come up with $15 million to pay for North
    Central's right of way to accommodate suburban commuters.

    The notion of suburbs contributing to the fiscal coffers of the
    central city are not new. In many cities, it is accomplished with a
    city income tax. Dallas First calls for some sort of tax or fee on
    commuters and reviewing the formula for water charges. It also
    suggests regional tax sharing. Under this concept, a certain
    percentage of the increase in property valuations for business
    relocations would be contributed to an "areawide pool.' The pool
    would be administered by a group composed of city and suburban
    officials.

    The most encouraging response has been from farsighted suburban
    leaders. While generally they are dubious toward sharing taxes, they
    have expressed a universal desire to explore other ways for the
    region to cooperate and reduce expenses. They recognize Dallas faces
    racial and political problems that have escaped their cities. But
    they also recognize that it is in their self-interest to see Dallas
    prosper -- not just survive.

    3) The key to Dallas' ability to compete with its suburbs is
    downtown revitalization. The Arts District and the West End have
    been major successes. But Neiman Marcus and other major companies
    are contemplating moving out of downtown. Neiman Marcus is the key
    to any hope of retail in downtown, and strong efforts are being made
    to keep it here.

    Dallas should push forward with plans to restore Fair Park,
    redevelop Farmers Market, build a downtown stadium for the Texas
    Rangers, complete the Dallas Zoo, develop Love Field to its fullest
    (consistent with the requirements for D/FW), and develop a downtown
    mall and Trinity Lakes Park. This cannot be done overnight, but we
    must move forward boldly.

    The development of downtown Dallas and southern Dallas go hand in
    hand. I have heard Dallas developers say that Dallas' economic
    development would occur on the Red River before it ever crosses the
    Trinity River. That trend can and must be reversed. A vibrant
    downtown Dallas, the Superconducting Super Collider and proper city
    funding may finally give life to southern Dallas.

    Dallas is facing the issue of further cutbacks in services and
    deferring needed improvements to streets, parks, and other public
    facilities. If this path is chosen, it will only exacerbate the
    differences in the quality of life between Dallas and its suburban
    competitors. A tax increase is inevitable: We must stand up for our
    elected officials and support them. It is no longer a question of
    whether it will cost Dallas to become competitive; only a question of
    when, and how much.

    Thus far this has been a summary of problems facing Dallas.
    However, Dallas First predicts a glowing future for the metroplex.
    It is likely that no other area in America will prosper as well as
    this area. It's true Dallas enjoys some benefits of regional
    development. But "trickle downtown' economics cannot possibly
    replace the lost tax base from corporate flight to the suburbs: Frito
    Lay, EDS, REI, Southland Life, the Dallas Cowboys. Dallas hasn't had
    a major relocation in over a decade -- Diamond Shamrock in 1979. Our
    only growth industry in Dallas is lawyers. Even those of us in the
    profession admit that our city can't survive on lawsuits.

    Is it too late to save Dallas from becoming another decaying
    central city? It will take a concentrated effort of the private and
    public sector in Dallas and the metroplex to solve this puzzle. We
    all know what has to be done. Somehow, we seem to lack the will to
    do it. The answers will come only when our elected officials decide
    that our economic health is as important as our political health.

    We hope some entity will take this opportunity to develop a game
    plan for this region. The findings and recommendations of Dallas
    First are a good place to start. The city of Dallas should take the
    lead and spearhead a blue-ribbon, areawide research group to examine
    Dallas First and chart a new course for the city of Dalas in the
    metroplex for the 1990s and beyond.

    Before it's too late.

    Forrest Smith is a senior partner with the Dallas law firm of
    Arter & Hadden, which commissioned the Center for Economic
    Development & Research at the University of North Texas to produce
    the Dallas First report.

  39. #139
    Administrator gc's Avatar
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    Wow...
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  40. #140
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Well, did our leaders take any heed then? Had they, then we wouldn't be where we are now. But, at least DISD is better now than it was then- the earlky 90's were hell. And I still beilieve that part of the problem our council leadership has faced throughout the 90's was dealing with a brand-new 14-1 system. So, a bunch f really important stuff had to take a back seat while the politicians fought over power. And this Booz Allen report is what we're left with as a result.

  41. #141
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    Here is an excerpt from a 1991 report



    Dallas doesn't have a strong mayor form of government. But
    there's a tremendous amount that a forceful mayor, demonstrating
    sufficient vision to command support from his or her council and
    administration, could push:

    * Hire an imaginative, nationally respected planner. Dallas
    hasn't had a strong planning voice since Weiming Lu left for St.
    Paul, Minn., in 1978. A planner should comprehend the fabric and
    potentials and shortcomings of cities and know how to work with
    neighborhoods and business leaders alike. He or she should develop a
    vision of how the disparate elements of downtown Dallas could be made
    into a coherent whole. A lead planner, in Mr. Lu's words, should be
    a "designer-servant' sensitive to the varied sounds and sights and
    customs of the city's varied cultures, who then can suggest how to
    reflect and amplify those cultures on the street level.

    * Clean up the wastelands. The ugly lots in and circling
    downtown present an awful city image; they breed fear of crime.
    Because it's in the shadow of skyscrapers, this land was held by
    speculators hoping to make a killing with a megastructure. With the
    bust of recent years, most of the land has shifted through
    foreclosure into lenders' hands. There's talk of progressive
    downtown-based corporations trying to get control of these land
    parcels, maybe turn some into baseball diamonds or soccer fields to
    help generate more downtown activity.

    Lots of lots

    That's fine and good. But now's the time for the city to engage
    the owners in some serious conversation about the future of this
    land. It may be years and years until the market justifies big
    buildings on these sites. A pro-active City Hall should be
    encouraging the lenders to think of more modest use, as soon as the
    market begins to perk up at all. What's probably feasible is
    middle-scale development -- two- or three-story offices and shops or
    perhaps townhouses and apartments. Dallas desperately needs,
    architect-critic James Pratt has noted, some middle scale, something
    between the massive skyscraper and the 7-Eleven. A tax code change
    ought to invite it.

    A complementary strategy is to set stiff requirements, full
    landscaping included, for vacant pieces of land. The owners may be
    reluctant, but how this land looks is critical to Dallas' appearance,
    an inescapable element of how downtown looks. Building codes require
    homeowners in residential neighborhoods to maintain their properties;
    why not require that downtown? If Dallas public policy were as
    protective of downtown as it is of neighborhoods, it might start
    looking better.

    * Stress that downtown's for everyone. It's wrong to think that
    the only winners from a strong downtown are the big businesses there
    or the people from North Dallas or Highland Park who hold executive
    jobs in its high-rises. African-Americans, Hispanics and Asians need
    downtown, now and in the future, as a work site.

    Downtown provides the only major employment center close to South
    Dallas or southern Dallas as a whole. Shut up downtown, and there'd
    be a disastrous loss of livelihood for low-income people, especially
    those of color.

  42. #142
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    All the reports and pretty pictures are great but the same underlying problems are forcing Dallas in many regards to stagnate. Why are the same problems being dealt wth for 10 20 years without anything being done about them? It makes you really wonder if Dallas can get its act together or at least stop from fouling things up.

  43. #143
    Administrator gc's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Quiz03
    All the reports and pretty pictures are great but the same underlying problems are forcing Dallas in many regards to stagnate. Why are the same problems being dealt wth for 10 20 years without anything being done about them? It makes you really wonder if Dallas can get its act together or at least stop from fouling things up.
    I agree Quiz...where are you getting these reports?
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  44. #144
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    I think much of the confusion and inability to get positive results hinges on whether or not Sunbelt metros will ever support central business districts - those which are deserted after business hours. Look it, most efforts with Dallas' CBD are to make it more liveable, increase the residential population. Uptown is the incarnation of an urban business district modeled after the successful subruban models with office, entertainment and residential space - with the urban setting instead of suburban.

  45. #145
    Lakewooder Lakewooder's Avatar
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    Yes, if I remember correctly the "T.P." had praise for Phoenix, which has a really crummy downtown and surrounding area.

  46. #146
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    More Stuff...

    ...from the civic strategies website

    Psst: Time to Sell That Dallas Stock
    You've often heard it said, "If only this city were run like a business . . . " Well, the Dallas Morning News acted on that thought recently, commissioning the corporate consulting firm of Booz Allen Hamilton to look at Dallas as if it were a corporation. Booz Allen's findings: Unless Dallas makes a dramatic turnaround, it's headed for the urban equivalent of Chapter 11. What's wrong with Dallas? You name it: The schools are mediocre, job growth is anemic, crime is too great, the tax base is out of kilter, the city's hemorrhaging its middle class, and the government is utterly dysfunctional. How blunt was the assessment? The first two sentences of the article explaining the study give a hint: "Dallas calls itself 'the city that works.' Dallas is wrong." (To view the articles and the Booz Allen study, which are titled "Dallas at the Tipping Point," click here.) The study's bottom line: "On its current path, Dallas will, in the next 20 years, go the way of declining cities like Detroit — a hollow core abandoned by the middle class and surrounded by suburbs that outperform the city but inevitably are driven down by it." The most withering criticism is directed at the city government, which the Booz Allen consultants say is a mess: no vision, no plan and nobody clearly in charge. A sign of the dysfunction: The government lacks basic information about itself and its performance. Note the consultants, "Ironically, our research revealed that on many dimensions San Diego and a few other cities have more information on Dallas than Dallas does — ranging from its fire cost loss index to the number of research questions asked per librarian." Footnote: So how did city hall officials react to this blistering criticism? About like you'd expect. Some said this was old news, that things had changed in the last few years. Some ignored it (fewer than half of the city's council members accepted an invitation to be briefed on the study). Some dismissed it (the city manager called the report's public safety criticisms "a pile of doo-doo"). And some warned the study would do more harm than good. "All you can do is find fault," one council member told a reporter, adding with a gesture toward the report, "I think this is a piece of junk."

    "Rethinking City Hall"
    When Booz Allen Hamilton studied Dallas as if it were a corporation (see item above), its study was thick with criticism. But it also had specific ideas for turning things around. The place to begin, Booz Allen suggested, was by "rethinking city hall." "Dallas city government," the study said, "labors under an antiquated city charter that is ill equipped to cope with current challenges." This was music to Mayor Laura Miller's ears. Miller has been urging for a year that Dallas scrap its city manager form of government and put the mayor in charge. But the Booz Allen study says that debate (strong mayor vs. city manager) was a distraction from the real problem. "Either model can work," the consultants said, "so long as operations of the city government are transparent and, most importantly, questions of who does what are clearly resolved." The study went on, "Successful organizations need clear alignment between accountability (who is held to account for delivering results), responsibility (who is tasked with taking actions to deliver the results) and authority (who controls the resources to deliver). When accountability, responsibility and authority become misaligned, organizations are plagued by inaction and finger-pointing." And that's the problem in Dallas, Booz Allen says. Take public safety. Citizens say this is their most important priority, but nobody in Dallas is clearly in charge of making the streets safe. The city manager and police chief appear to have authority, but the mayor meets weekly with the police department and city council members call directly on precinct commanders. (In an accompanying article, the Dallas Morning News reported that the police department's narcotics officers say they spend 80 percent of their time responding to requests from city hall. The article added, "Imagine that the board of directors (of a corporation) has stationed itself on the production line, where it micromanages the way the workers make widgets. That irritates and embitters the workers, who figure, rightly, that no one on the board has ever made a widget.") Recommendations from Booz Allen: Choose either a strong mayor or city manager form and hold that person accountable for administering the city. Create a strategic plan and stick to it. Make it plain that the city council's role is to set strategy, objectives and goals, not to interfere with employees' work. Set clear performance measurements that show progress toward goals, such as making the streets safer, and not just measure activities, such as answering emergency calls faster. Oh, and publish honest and meaningful information about government performance because, as the study says, "democracy, like business, thrives on openness."
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  47. #147
    High-Rise Member dallastophoenix's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Lakewooder
    Yes, if I remember correctly the "T.P." had praise for Phoenix, which has a really crummy downtown and surrounding area.
    You're correct. dt phx is horrible, but...

    the city is aggressively pursuing turning around its feeble dt... how, u ask? they are using the preliminary plans drawn up by local businesses, residents, and a couple of planning firms to construct an overall development plan. i attended the city's town hall meeting last week, and was amazed at how detailed it was for everyone that saw the presentations. the mayor and council were very open to each person that had a comment or question - and even paired these people up w/ city staff for more one-on-one question and answer periods... not knowing what to expect after hearing what goes on in dallas, i was impressed.

    main thing about dt phx: they are building a new strategic plan now, in conjuction w/ asu to bring more businesses to dt, a new university campus (15,000 students), and 10,000 new residents by 2010... i think this is very aggressive compared to what exists down there right now...

    if dallas could just create a detailed strategic plan - and stick to it!!

  48. #148
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    Just a thought on downtown Dallas' revitalizing core: The very center of the city, like.. the complete and utter CENTER of downtown, at Main and Field, there is Pegasus Plaza. And next to that is the freaking BEST MEXICAN FOOD RESTAURANT EVER TO GRACE THE PLANET (because I went there tonight and fell in love with it,) the Iron Cactus. Below that is a new sandwich shop. Down the street, Campisi's is expanding, there is a new newstand, and everything else at Stone Street Gardens, the opposite direction, there are the brand new Kirby Lofts and the Davis Building lofts (whose lights are amazing.. and change colors over and over), right next to the Iron Cactus is the really nice Magnolia Hotel, and Pegasus Plaza is a beautiful place where people walk their dogs, sit around and read their newspaper, drink coffee, and there are really cool fountains and places to sit. Across the street is also Jeraboam Restaurant. It's the most urban environment I have EVER been in, and sitting on the outdoor patio of Iron Cactus looking at the view (I could see the Davis Building.. that had me mesmerized) and all the 'party' lights strung along Main Street.. and all the lights from the buildings and everyone walking around.. I was really wowed. I remember being driven down Main Street a few years ago and it being completely DEAD. Tonight, there were hoardes of people (45 minute wait at Iron Cactus.. was as busy at 11pm as it was at 7pm,) and tons of downtown residents walking their dogs, etc. I even heard one lady said 'we're gonna go ahead and head home..' and I watched them walk from the Iron Cactus to the Kirby. It was so cool. I want a loft..

    Anyway, yeah, downtown Dallas.. especially the Main St. corridor, is feeling some GREAT growth.

    Iron Cactus rocks. Great prices, the best ribs I have ever had in my entire life.
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  49. #149
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    NPRC's Gold Guide ranks Dallas top city for business
    A new publication by the National Policy Research Council ranks Dallas as one of the top U.S. cities in categories like business and entrepreneurial climate, technology and infrastructure.


    The Washington, D.C.-based think tank's Gold Guide puts Dallas as the No. 1-ranked city for business climate; No. 2 for technology; No. 3 for entrepreneurs and small businesses; and No. 4 for infrastructure.

    Dallas ranked No. 5 in the Gold Guide's overall category, after Denver (No. 1); San Diego (No. 2); Austin (No. 3); and Boston (No. 4).

    Texas tied with California for the No. 2 spot among best states for business climate; the top-ranked state was New York.

    In the overall category -- which took into consideration factors like business climate, economic dynamism, environment, government, health and welfare, infrastructure, public safety, quality of life, technology and education -- Texas came in at No. 22.

    To compile the listing, researchers at the National Policy Research Council looked at more than 16,000 sources, analyzed other published city and state rankings, and used a consensus-based technique to calculate the results.

    Web site: www.nprcouncil.com

  50. #150
    The smartest gal in town! trolleygirl's Avatar
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    Is this the same National Policy Research Council that says our air quality is, in reality, much better than we are being led to believe by "environmental extremists" and other climate scientists and oceanagraphers?

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