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Thread: DFW wants to be the premier airport in the global marketplace

  1. #101
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by St-T
    America West Airlines declined an offer to expand at Dallas/Fort Worth Airport despite a generous incentive deal offered by the airport, because it would have lost "lots of money" in a battle with American Airlines, America West's top executive said Thursday.
    That sentence sums up everything. This is why the Wright Amendment needs to be repealed, we need choice in the metroplex. I don't think any city in America has it as bad as us with an airline's monopoly except for maybe Detroit with Northwest Airlines.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  2. #102
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    ^
    In an article posted in the Air Tran poised to expand at DFW thread, it noted:

    American, 61 times larger than AirTran at D/FW, wants to put a lid on the carrier's expansion while sending a message to other discounters that it will fiercely defend its turf.

    Looks like America West got the message, and probably most of the other airlines, too. Good luck to DFW renting all those empty gates.

    Here's something to ponder. DFW Airport likes to beat it's chest and trumpet the fact that they have FIVE (count 'em) low fare carriers. AirTran, America West, Frontier, ATA, and Sun Country. Yet when you add up all the daily departures of all those low fare carriers, don't you come up with something around 30 low-fare departures per day? That's a rather meager offering from the so-called economic engine of N. Texas -- an airport that has nonstop service to 132 destinations and handles 57 million passengers per year. And this is from an airport that has been around for 31 years and been protected by the Wright Amendment for 25 of those years.

    Meanwhile, over at the insignificant (in the eyes of DFW and Fort Worth) Love Field, an airport that serves a small fractions of the destinations DFW does and an airport that handles 6 million passengers a year one carrier (Southwest) is able to offer 123 daily departures (soon to be 117). What's wrong with this picture?

    It's not like like DFW hasn't tried and succeeded in getting low-fare carriers in the past. The problems, once they get here, AA runs them off. The other airlines have been conditioned to stay away.

    And DFW loves to whine about Southwest's 97% monopoly over at Love Field. Big Deal. Love Field sees 6 million passenger a year. What about AA's 80% monopoly of 57 million folks using DFW? When you add the two totals together, AA still controls around 76% of the total Dallas-Fort Worth market while Southwest has around 9%. Just who has the monopoly here?

    LoneStarMike

  3. #103
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by LoneStarMike
    ^
    In an article posted in the Air Tran poised to expand at DFW thread, it noted:

    American, 61 times larger than AirTran at D/FW, wants to put a lid on the carrier's expansion while sending a message to other discounters that it will fiercely defend its turf.

    Looks like America West got the message, and probably most of the other airlines, too. Good luck to DFW renting all those empty gates.
    This points out how little AA and DFW work together to improve the conditions of travelers - the driving factor which keeps stock holders and tax payers happy. If DFW is protected from Love Field competition, then AirTran, America West, Frontier, ATA, and Sun Country as well as Continential, Delta, United et. al. should be protected from American competition.

    Those running DFW need to consider the message they are sending to other airports and air carriers, it's like, "Here children, I have a beautiful gingerbread house, come inside and sit by the cozy oven fire." Inclusion of International gates would help take the bite out of the AA, but it would still be too risky for hub expansion.

    The most profitable approach for DFW and AA is to focus on increasing International activity. AA must realize it's domestic travel profits through DFW are dangerously and artifically supported by it's near monopoly, and in the best interest of stock holders. To maintain control of its financial future, AA should actively manage the reliquishment of its DFW domestic service which consists of passengers forced to pay the premium priced service from a legacy carrier. There will always be a big market for the premium priced product AA offers, and DFW officials should be the arbitrator brokering air carriers to an agreement of the size of premium service market.

    DFW replaces the loss from Delta, properly priced travel providers (aka discount air fair) are allowed to expand at DFW, AA can streamline operational cost by focusing on its core customer and give greater attention to International expansion through its DFW hub.

    The physical limitations of Love Field will not allow that airport to "steel" more than 6 million annual passengers from DFW (considering that all potential gates receive maximum traffic). My gut tells me there is substantially more than 6 million annual passengers who are kept away from passing through DFW simply because AA's prices are too high.

    DFW also should recognize that many of it's problems stem from AA predation.

  4. #104
    In the O.R. Geaux Tigers's Avatar
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    The rest of the article posted above:


    Details of the new service:

    <TABLE width=450 border=0><TBODY><TR><TD width=500 colSpan=3>Scheduled flight times from Seattle to Dallas/Fort Worth are:</TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Flight Number</TD><TD align=middle width=100>
    Departs
    </TD><TD align=middle width=100>Arrives</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#daeaeb><TD width=300 bgColor=#ffffff>Alaska Flight 808</TD><TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#ffffff>11:18 a.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#ffffff>5:08 p.m.</TD></TR><TR bgColor=white><TD width=300>Alaska Flight 810</TD><TD align=middle width=100>11:30 p.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100>5:20 a.m.</TD></TR><TR><TD width=500 colSpan=3>
    Scheduled flight times from Anchorage to Dallas/Fort Worth are:
    </TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Flight Number</TD><TD align=middle width=100>
    Departs
    </TD><TD align=middle width=100>Arrives</TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Alaska Flight 808</TD><TD align=middle width=100>6:05 a.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100>5:08 p.m.</TD></TR><TR><TD width=500 colSpan=3>
    Scheduled flight times from Dallas/Fort Worth to Seattle are:
    </TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Flight Number</TD><TD align=middle width=100>
    Departs
    </TD><TD align=middle width=100>Arrives</TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Alaska Flight 811</TD><TD align=middle width=100>8:00 a.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100>10:00 a.m.</TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Alaska Flight 809</TD><TD align=middle width=100>6:10 p.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100>8:10 p.m.</TD></TR><TR><TD width=500 colSpan=3>
    Scheduled flight times from Dallas/Fort Worth to Anchorage are:
    </TD></TR><TR><TD width=300>Flight Number</TD><TD align=middle width=100>
    Departs
    </TD><TD align=middle width=100>Arrives</TD></TR><TR bgColor=#daeaeb><TD width=300 bgColor=#ffffff>Alaska Flight 809</TD><TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#ffffff>6:10 p.m.</TD><TD align=middle width=100 bgColor=#ffffff>11:35 p.m.</TD></TR></TBODY></TABLE>
    Fares shown do not include airport passenger facility charges of up to $18 (amount depends on itinerary), federal segment tax of $3.20 per segment (takeoff and landing) on itinerary, and a Sept. 11 security fee of $2.50 per enplanement (up to $10). Fares listed are each way based on round-trip purchase. Tickets are nonrefundable but can be changed for a $50 change fee and any applicable changes in fare. Seats are limited and may not be available on all flights or all days. All fares are subject to change without notice. Other restrictions apply depending on individual fare rules. See www. alaskaair.com for details.

    Alaska Airlines and its sister carrier Horizon Air together service more than 80 cities in Alaska, the Lower 48, Canada and Mexico. For reservations visit www.alaskaair.com. For more news and information, visit the Alaska Airlines Newsroom on the Internet at http://newsroom.alaskaair.com.
    By the power of greyskull!

  5. #105
    In the O.R. Geaux Tigers's Avatar
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    ^This is awesome news!! It's not taking up 20 gates or going to really give AA a run for their money, but it's a start. Hopefully, this will open the doors for other carriers that are shying away from DFW right now to take a chance.
    By the power of greyskull!

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    What is really interesting is that AA and AL are code share partners.

  7. #107
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Great news! One time my family tried to fly to Seattle but AA's fares were like $600 per person so we opted to go somewhere else. I hope AA doesnt start there predatory crap again.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  8. #108
    In the O.R. Geaux Tigers's Avatar
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    Well, once again it looks like we're getting the short end of the aviation industry stick. Today it was announced that both Pakistani Air and Air India are starting daily flights to Houston and are bypassing DFW. When will the officals at DFW wake up and realize there are more airlines on planet Earth besides AA?? Must be nice to actually have an international airport that has international airlines servicing it!!
    By the power of greyskull!

  9. #109
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers
    Well, once again it looks like we're getting the short end of the aviation industry stick. Today it was announced that both Pakistani Air and Air India are starting daily flights to Houston and are bypassing DFW. When will the officals at DFW wake up and realize there are more airlines on planet Earth besides AA?? Must be nice to actually have an international airport that has international airlines servicing it!!
    Maybe it has something to do with Houston's Middle eastern population. I mean, were we even a canidate for flights on those carriers? I don't know if DFW has that big of a market for the middle east.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  10. #110
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    Houston has a big market for middle eastern destinations because of the oil services companies.

  11. #111
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    Quote Originally Posted by texman
    Maybe it has something to do with Houston's Middle eastern population. I mean, were we even a canidate for flights on those carriers? I don't know if DFW has that big of a market for the middle east.
    I remember hearing serveral months ago that DFW officals were trying to talk Air India into starting service to DFW. I guess that didn't go so well.

    I understand that due to the large oil industry in Houston, the city would seem to be a more attractive destination for international carriers, but I would think that given the multitude of major global companies headquartered in N. Texas, we'd at least get a few more foreign airlines interested in coming to DFW than Aero Mexico, Korean, Lufthansa, and British Airways.

    I guess I just don't understand how the 4th largest metropalitan area in the US keeps getting shuned by the world's airlines.
    By the power of greyskull!

  12. #112
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers
    I guess I just don't understand how the 4th largest metropalitan area in the US keeps getting shuned by the world's airlines.
    'Fly AA, Its the ONLY way to go.'
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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    This is all a PRIME example of what a fortress hub does to an airport.

    Easy solution: FRIGGIN GET RID OF THE WRIGHT AMEDMENT...let a free market develop in Dallas and then watch what happens. AA will still be a major player at DFW but more airlines will come to play too.

  14. #114
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by St-T
    This is all a PRIME example of what a fortress hub does to an airport.

    Easy solution: FRIGGIN GET RID OF THE WRIGHT AMEDMENT...let a free market develop in Dallas and then watch what happens. AA will still be a major player at DFW but more airlines will come to play too.
    I cant wait to see DFW Airport renamed American Airlines Airport and A380s fly out of Love.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  15. #115
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    Did anyone post the article about American Airlines pledging to move much of its north texas operations to love field if the wright amendment was lifted? I thought that was pretty dirty, but I definetly see where they're coming from.

  16. #116
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by drumguy8800
    Did anyone post the article about American Airlines pledging to move much of its north texas operations to love field if the wright amendment was lifted? I thought that was pretty dirty, but I definetly see where they're coming from.
    Yeah, its up there. And I don't really see where their coming from..they just said that to scare everyone.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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    There is not enough space for AA to do what the have threatened. They only have 3 GATES at Love. And the city controls the rest. Go take a look at the Love Field Master Plan...it is very interesting. And, you can see for yourself how AA is using 'scare tactics'.

  18. #118
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    Perhaps the folks at DFW airport should suggest Wright Amendment modifications which limit American Airlines to occupy no more than one third of the gates at the new billion dollar international terminal. This will give protection to other international carriers and support expansion of international travel at the airport which will not happen due to the slash and burn tactics of AA. The Wright Amendment was one exception to the industry deregulation 20 years ago which needs to disappear.

    I understand the airport needs to work closely with its biggest client, but at some point they need to stop putting all their eggs in one basket. There's no exclusitivity agreement, right? If AA is given the lease on most of the international terminal gates, then they should be using them, not just holding them so no one else can.

  19. #119
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Perhaps the folks at DFW airport should suggest Wright Amendment modifications which limit American Airlines to occupy no more than one third of the gates at the new billion dollar international terminal. This will give protection to other international carriers and support expansion of international travel at the airport which will not happen due to the slash and burn tactics of AA. The Wright Amendment was one exception to the industry deregulation 20 years ago which needs to disappear.

    I understand the airport needs to work closely with its biggest client, but at some point they need to stop putting all their eggs in one basket. There's no exclusitivity agreement, right? If AA is given the lease on most of the international terminal gates, then they should be using them, not just holding them so no one else can.
    How much has AA leased currently out of the international terminal?
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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    ^ I believe AA has leased about 23 of the 28 gates. Its absolutely, ridiculous what DFW is letting them get away with. How will the International Terminal ever get new airlines. Secondly, DFW needs to stop pandering to AA with the Wright Amendment and stop insulting our intelligence. Anybody with a brain knows that the Wright Amendment needs to end. I hope this goes to court again and DFW (shame on them) and AA get slapped in the face. I really do think the Federal Court or any Congressman with half a brain stops this Wright Amendment nonsense. I for one don't what to have one non stop option when I fly Paris or Europe.

    As much as this sounds cold and heartless, maybe AA needs to go bankrupt. They are really damaging the growth of DFW.

  21. #121
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    Perhaps if Delta had been promised one third of the international gates, they would have kept their DFW domestic hub in operation for the potential of vital high prifit international flights, who knows.

  22. #122
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Perhaps if Delta had been promised one third of the international gates, they would have kept their DFW domestic hub in operation for the potential of vital high prifit international flights, who knows.
    I think your on to something. It could of been their 'mexico and south america gateway'. Probably just a dream.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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    ^ O.k maybe, I was a little harsh about AA going bankrupt, but I wonder if AA would share its gates with a new International Carrier? I'm willing to bet that DFW and AA didn't even discuss that and if they did AA would probably bully and give any excuse for a new carrier not to join the International Terminal.

    Having one major airline monopolize a International Terminal is by no means positive growth. Hopefully that will change in the next two years.

  24. #124
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARTMAN
    ^ O.k maybe, I was a little harsh about AA going bankrupt, but I wonder if AA would share its gates with a new International Carrier? I'm willing to bet that DFW and AA didn't even discuss that and if they did AA would probably bully and give any excuse for a new carrier not to join the International Terminal.

    Having one major airline monopolize a International Terminal is by no means positive growth. Hopefully that will change in the next two years.
    You wonder why they even bother calling it 'international'. Does AA have to use the gates for international flights?
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  25. #125
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    An airline monopolizing an airport is not uncommon. It's called having a hub. Detroit, Atlanta, St. Louis, and lots of other cities around the world are in the exact same position DFW is in. American is not some evil company that has invented some terrible, mean buisness model designed to screw DFW out of every penny.
    Its not uncommon for a city our size to have 2 airports that can serve all destinations, not just one. Thats where the problem comes in.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  26. #126
    Federalist woodrg0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARTMAN
    As much as this sounds cold and heartless, maybe AA needs to go bankrupt. They are really damaging the growth of DFW.
    i don't think bankrupting the largest employer in dfw would do much for the region...just a hunch...
    "To be intimate with a foolish friend is like going to bed with a razor."

  27. #127
    Federalist woodrg0's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by tamtagon
    Perhaps if Delta had been promised one third of the international gates, they would have kept their DFW domestic hub in operation for the potential of vital high prifit international flights, who knows.
    Quote Originally Posted by texman
    I think your on to something. It could of been their 'mexico and south america gateway'. Probably just a dream.
    this is info from my aunt who has 31 years with delta. she says delta left because they don't need two western hubs (slc and dallas) and a midwest hub (cinnci) with such close proximity to their home base/southeastern hub (atlanta)...their loads were not what they should have been to destinations other than the other hubs, so dallas was cut to save money in the hopes that they could avoid bankruptcy...

    also, draw a straight line south from atlanta and you will see that dallas does not have the edge that one might assume in service to latin america...mexico for sure, but south american traffic leans to atlanta...that is the reason that AA has a South American Hub in Miami...
    "To be intimate with a foolish friend is like going to bed with a razor."

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    ^ That is very true and to be premier DFW has to match service with Houston and ATL. I don't think DFW even has a strong Euro connection. I checked Delta and they fly to Rome, Madrid and Amsterdam directly from ATL. Unbelievable! AA doesn't even offer those direct flights from DFW. DFW officials should at least pressure AA to offer more Euro connections since they will dominate International Terminal D. Also, the ATL International Terminal is expanding to 38 gates. I guess they beat DFW again. Damn...we need to really get some of ATL's marketing executives and fire DFW's, because a smaller city like Atlanta is beating DFW which is 2 times bigger.
    Last edited by CARTMAN; 28 February 2005 at 02:20 PM.

  29. #129
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARTMAN
    ^ That is very true and to be premier DFW has to match service with Houston and ATL. I don't think DFW even has a strong Euro connection. I checked Delta and they fly to Rome, Madrid and Amsterdam directly from ATL. Unbelievable! AA doesn't even offer those direct flights from DFW. DFW officials should at least pressure AA to offer more Euro connections since they will dominate International Terminal D. Also, the ATL International Terminal is expanding to 38 gates. I guess they beat DFW again. Damn...we need to really get some of ATL's marketing executives and fire DFW's, because a smaller city like Atlanta is beating DFW which is 2 times bigger.
    Thats true, I can only think of 4 cities in Europe served by DFW, add more if I'm wrong, but isnt it Frankfurt, London, Zurich, Paris? Pretty sad.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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    You are definitely right TEXMAN. DFW only has direct access to those 4 destinations. Well, let me try to get on a positive note.

    Does anyone have any International travel plans when the International Terminal opens?

  31. #131
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    DFW may have an advantage during the next four or five years, depending on when those big Airbus planes start flying and how quickly other airports can expand to accommodate the bigger planes. Does anyone know which will come first, the big planes or the new big runways?

    In the future, DFW should see steady increase in international flights simply because the next generation planes will be built for longer flights. A plane that can get why up in the atmosphere for a long time will be able to minimize the additional flight time traditionally needed to reach the middle of the country versus the a costal airports.

  32. #132
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    D-FW becoming a major partner
    Area on pace to be 3rd-largest U.S. cargo market for China
    03:20 PM CST on Saturday, March 12, 2005
    By KATHERINE YUNG / The Dallas Morning News
    http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcont...ies.50a6e.html

    Once nonexistent, the ties between Dallas-Fort Worth and China are growing closer all the time.

    Cargo flights between the two trade partners are multiplying. Trans-Pacific relationships are also getting a boost, in part through trade missions. Dallas-Fort Worth's total trade with China jumped 51 percent in 2004 to $10 billion. Imports of Chinese goods – particularly machinery, furniture and toys – made up the bulk of the exchange. China Cargo Airlines, Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport's first carrier to serve mainland China, started service a little more than a year ago with three weekly flights. Another Chinese cargo carrier may start service this year, said Bill Frainey, an assistant vice president at the airport.

    "There's a very untapped market here," he said, noting that North Texas is expected to become the third-largest U.S. cargo market for China by 2010. At China Cargo, freight volume grew so quickly that the carrier added another flight to D/FW in September, said Fuqiang "Alex" Shen, the airline's local manager. China Cargo chose Dallas over Miami, Atlanta and Houston. "We made the right choice," Mr. Shen said. United Parcel Service is also experiencing huge increases in its China business. Already, imports from China rank as UPS' largest international market in Texas, said Bobby Carter, its international sales manager for the Southwest region.

    UPS' small-package exports from North Texas to China from small and medium-size companies have soared 42 percent since 2000. Meanwhile, imports skyrocketed 974 percent. "The markets are there, the walls are coming down, but the infrastructure's not there," Mr. Carter said of the poor roads and other challenges. The constant stream of goods isn't the only North Texas-China connection. Last year, delegations from the Greater Dallas Chamber made three trips. Another mission will leave this spring. And in 2003, the Chinese Council for the Promotion of International Trade re-opened an office in Richardson that had closed because of a shortage of personnel.

    E-mail kyung@dallasnews.com
    “We shape our Cities, thereafter they shape us.”

  33. #133
    In the O.R. Geaux Tigers's Avatar
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    ^Yet, when AA was awarded the right to fly between the US and Shanghai, they chose to fly from Chicago!!!
    By the power of greyskull!

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    Quote Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers
    ^Yet, when AA was awarded the right to fly between the US and Shanghai, they chose to fly from Chicago!!!
    Because AA serves passengers to China and not cargo. (well some cargo maybe)

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    I wouldn't be so harsh on AA if they just offered more direct flights to Europe. We shouldn't have to fly to Atlanta or Houston when DFW is just as good or better. Does anyone know why flights to South America are so expensive?

  36. #136
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by CARTMAN
    Does anyone know why flights to South America are so expensive?
    Well who other than AA serves South America from DFW?
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  37. #137
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    Quote Originally Posted by texman
    Well who other than AA serves South America from DFW?
    Well, it's almost S. America, but Grupo Taca Airlines serves DFW from San Salvador. Outside of that, AA is your only choice for a direct flight.
    By the power of greyskull!

  38. #138
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Geaux Tigers
    Outside of that, AA is your only choice for a direct flight.
    You could sorta count TAM Brazil, but its a codeshare agreement with AA.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

  39. #139
    In the O.R. Geaux Tigers's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    Note: AA chose to fly to China from Chicago
    But that doesn't make their decision right!
    By the power of greyskull!

  40. #140
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s

    The people in Philidelphia, San Antonio, San Diego, Miami, Boston, Phoenix, Seattle, and so many other places bitch because their service to Europe is far less than our "limited" service.

    EDIT: Wow. I sound like a know it all asshole. Sorry about that.

    My problem isn't with AA's lack of commitment and service, because its far more superior than most American carriers, but with its lack of maximuming flights from DFW it's "HUB". DFW is twice as large in marketing/population numbers compared to all of this cities expect for Boston and Miami which gains in tourist numbers. So I think our bitching is valid when we need could and should have more International destinations. The only reason for DFW's limited service is because AA chooses not to fly more out of DFW when they could.

    For example, I flew back from ATL last weekend and happened to land in their Int'l Terminal. In comparsion, ATL is twice as small as DFW and I noticed Delta partnered and flew to twice as many European destinations (Milan, Rome, Madrid, Amsterdam, Manchester, Dublin) and all the flights were full and overbooked. Gosh, I was thinking these kind of flights from Atlanta???? So my question is why can't AA use more its OneWorld partners here such as Iberia, Lan Chile or Finnair? So, I don't think its that AA can't fly to these places successfully, but AA does not because they have the ultimate fare control here. Thats why Air France hasn't returned yet and what happened to Thai Airways flying from DFW?

    My point is this kind of foolishness has got to stop with AA especially with the Int'l Terminal opening, because I shouldn't have to fly Delta or connect in ATL when DFW is just as capable.

  41. #141
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    I think there is a big difference with Delta in Atlanta. American has two other substantial gate ways that are more important to them than Dallas. Those are Chicago and New York. Delta uses Atlanta to capture most of its European travel. It makes more sense to focus on Chicago and New York because there is more traffic. Dallas is primarily a mid-contintent hub, not a European hub.

  42. #142
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    That is true of Delta in Atlanta, but then you have to compare Houston IAH and Continental. Houston still has about 11 Foreign carriers, even with Houston and Newark being Continentals main hubs. I guess I'm frustrated with AA because if they want to make Chicago, NYC and Miami their main International hubs thats fine. But stop trying to run competing domestic and international carriers out of town. We all pay the higher $$$ for it.

    I just hope this vicious cycle stops when the Int'l Terminal opens, because its going to even more obvious for all you skeptics if we don't get at least 2 or 3 new Foreign carriers within 2 years. You can't have maximum growth at DFW if you don't have maximum competition. You can offer all the incentives in the world, but if you have a bully carrier who doesn't like to compete, the new carriers could care less. Why can't AA offer the lowest fares without someone else doing it first?

    I'll be happy when those runways are packed with jets (like Chicago and ATL) because I know at least we are kicking ass.

  43. #143
    Administrator tamtagon's Avatar
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    I'll guess the partener strategy between AA, it's Intl code sharing parteners and DFW airport plots to use DFW for new route service. It would probably be disasterous for the airport and/or airlines to attempt an encroachment on traditional routes NYC, Chicago, Atlanta, Miami routes. However, equity for DFW will come through new service cities. Combining the ease with which DFW connections to domestic flights compares to other airports and building DFW as hub among immerging markets should cause a natural migration to DFW from the historical American-European links.

    Latin and South America travel through DFW seems to offer entirely new market potential for AA without canibalizing its Miami hub. The future of business transactions between Texas and all of Latin America will support an activly growing International terminal at DFW - there is some serious potential for the Metroplex to become the primary North American business destination for many Latin American organizations. The shear volume of immigration into Texas is poised to deliver millions of trips a year between Texas and Latin America. I just do not understand why Airline, Airport, city and state officials have not seen fit to expedite the TRE/DART train station in DFW airport. You just gotta be able to take a non-stop train from the airport to either downtown, it's that simple. The easier and faster people can get to the final destination, the greater the number of people will who will come. Millions of trips are just waiting south of the border for an usher to show the convenient way into Dallas.

  44. #144
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    So what did happen to Thai Airways from Dallas? Can we get them back? I remember seeing them advertise in the Dallas Relocation Guide back in 1994, plus they still maintain a cargo office off of 35 if I'm not mistaken.

  45. #145
    LH Copycat Columbus Civil's Avatar
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    Wow. I sound like a know it all asshole. Sorry about that.
    Don't worry. There are quite a few people here that have that same problem.
    Dallas uber alles

  46. #146
    The Urban Pragmatist Mballar's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Columbus Civil
    Don't worry. There are quite a few people here that have that same problem.
    Stop talking about me CC!!
    A wise man speaks because he has something to say; a fool because he has to say something. - Plato

  47. #147
    the-young-and-the-bright RobertB's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Columbus Civil
    Don't worry. There are quite a few people here that have that same problem.
    Thank goodness I just know it all...
    As for our common defense, we reject as false the choice between our safety and our ideals... Those ideals still light the world, and we will not give them up for expedience's sake. - B. Obama 1/20/09

  48. #148
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    Damn, that is terrible :-(

  49. #149
    Skyscraper Member sterling's Avatar
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    I've really enjoyed the expansion of American Eagle into regular terminal space. Taking the bus to that terminal annex always seemed like being banished to Siberia.

  50. #150
    Supertall Skyscraper Member texman's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by F4shionablecHa0s
    Just some DFW news for everyone:

    Mexicana will be returning to DFW with daily A319 service to two cities in Mexico, as well as charter flights to many other destinations.

    Also, Korean Air will be upgrading their current daily 777-200 service to DFW to a 747 three days of the week. The other days will retain their 777. After an absence of a few years, looks like the passenger 747 is making a comeback at the airport.

    American Eagle has been expanding like crazy at DFW but I don't have any numbers on that. Add in Alaska Airlines adding service and it looks like the Delta thing hasn't hurt the airport quite as much as they'd like us to believe.
    Thats great! DFW was never big on 747s but now its a start.
    "And we will probably be judged not by the monuments we build but by those we have destroyed."-"Farewell to Penn Station," New York Times Editorial, October 30, 1963

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