Turtle Creek Village redevelopment

[HarryMoto]

In regards to this post on the D magazine's Frontburner blog today about Ciudad restaurant in Turtle Creek Village going under, is there more info about TCV being replaced by a West Village-style development?

From Frontburner:
It is real estate that's affecting Ciudad. The new owners Turtle Creek Village have not been forthcoming with information to the tenants. There are plans to build a West Village-style complex here, but they're leaving all of the current tenants out of it. Monica is one of several tenants abandoning Turtle Creek Village. The construction on the new space is slated for spring with rents more than doubling.

[Lakewooder]

I hate to see Monica go from there -- it had a great patio - and Lee Ann with those Margaritas!

[St-T]

Oh NO! Is Ciudad moving or closing down?

[Milkman Dan]

There goes the gayborhood!

[tamtagon]

I'm surprised it has taken so long for this real estate to get the make-over. Sandwiched between Turtle Creek and Oak Lawn, it's as good a location in Central Dallas as exists.

[Lakewooder]

When the little Tom Thumb closed, it was the harbinger of hell to come!

[Columbus Civil]

cuidad's quality has really gone down the past few years. im not going to miss it.

[clipper]

We really don't need any more West Villages, Mockingbird Stations, etc. We need something different than knock offs of what's already been done.

[KBilly]

It seems to me that "central Dallas" commercial real estate (for want of a better word) is mostly a zero sum game. If this is true, and with the proposed LHTC and the new stuff going up across from Northpark, a lot of other locations are going to be hurting real bad.

[elmstreetdallas]

KBilly,

What "other locations" are you referring to?

[I45Tex]

It seems to me that "central Dallas" commercial real estate (for want of a better word) is mostly a zero sum game. If this is true, and with the proposed LHTC and the new stuff going up across from Northpark, a lot of other locations are going to be hurting real bad.

If rents are more than doubling, I would have guessed that the customer base is increasing significantly enough that zero-sum no longer characterizes it.

[1999McKinneyAve]

Oh great. Mr. Wong's is one hell of a tailor (but he only accepts cash and checks). There's no way they could afford a rent increase.

[amshepar]

if all the same tenants remained within that shopping center and it was redone and apartments/condos were built above it, the cost of adding those apartments would not be much greater than just redoing one floor. The rent/sales could subsidize the retail on the bottom.

[KBilly]

KBilly,

What "other locations" are you referring to?
Any other location within 6-10 miles. There's only so many places Gap is going to put another store. Or Lucky Brand. Or Pier One. Or Dominoes. Or Radio Shack. Or etc.

Retail leasing is a poaching game of sorts, with a lot of managers going after the same tenants. If once center gets one to move to their spot, the other center is left with a vacancy to fill, and so on and so on.

The Casa Linda build out is going to want the same types of tenants as LHTC, and as TCV. Something has to give.

And with retail vacancies rising (http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/bus/stories/071807dnbusretailvacancies.840a62f2.html)... who knows.

145Tex... doubling rents have not a lot to do, per se, with tenant customer bases rising and everything to do with what a commercial leasing company thinks it can get for space. And if the tenant doesn't like it, they move to another location where they like the t's & c's. Leaving previous space empty.

Thus, my point.

[Uptown72]

I didn't even realize that the center had sold. Who bought it and what are the major plans???

[clipper]

The center hasn't sold. It's been owned by New England investment fund for some time.

[TinMan]

I read in the "Dallas Voice" this week that Zeus (?) was moving to Lemmon Ave. The owner is citing the upcoming remodel of TCV. Any news on this redo?

[HarryMoto]

What is Zeus? A restaurant?

[elmstreetdallas]

It's a comics and collectibles store:

http://www.zeuscomics.com/

[TinMan]

It's looking like a ghost town over at TCV lately.

[Uptown72]

Looks like the bulldozers must be on their way.

[DallasMan]

Am I correct that this is the shopping center w/ Good Eats, Souper Salad, and World Market? If so, isn't that center fairly successful? Are they really kicking out the tenants and starting over? What is this lot zoned, could they even have residential there?

Sorry, if my first question is not correct, then all the following are moot.

[Uptown72]

I think Shafer bought a portion of this center. It's a great location for a suburban center that will try to look like Highland Park Village.

[elmstreetdallas]

Dear God no. Please say it's not true.

[Tnekster]

Renovation of one of Dallas' first mixed-use developments begins with 1972 office tower


10:34 PM CST on Friday, February 22, 2008
By STEVE BROWN / The Dallas Morning News
stevebrown@dallasnews.com

When developers unveiled plans for Turtle Creek Village in the 1960s, they said it was the future of Dallas development.

But after more than four decades, the future is getting a bit outdated.

That's why the project – one of Dallas' first true mixed-use developments – will get a dramatic makeover.

The complex at Oak Lawn Avenue and Blackburn Street will be remodeled with a new exterior on the largest building plus other improvements.

Just the renovation of the 18-story office tower will cost more than $7 million, according to Glen Perkins, PM Realty Group's managing director of Development and Acquisition Services.

PM Realty Group owns the office and retail complex in partnership with New England-based investor CommonFund.

"We acquired it a little over a year ago," Mr. Perkins said. "Our objective is to take that building – because of the great location – and bring it up to a Class A status.

"We will completely change the entire look of the building."

Architect Gromatzky Dupree & Associates has designed a new glass exterior for the tower and a lighted sculptural top. That will replace the brown glass and metal mansard-style roof that's been on the high-rise since it opened in 1972.

Called Two Turtle Creek Village, the office tower joined a shopping center and smaller office building in the center.

Turtle Creek Village was planned in the mid-1960s on a large tract of land that was previously home to the historic Holy Trinity College – later Jesuit High School.

Holy Trinity College, later Jesuit High School, was on the site before Turtle Creek Village. It was torn down in early '60s. After the classical-style school buildings were demolished, developers Fred and Martin Tycher announced plans for their $25 million Turtle Creek Village in 1966.

With some of the buildings designed by architect George Dahl, the 13-acre Turtle Creek Village was laid out to contain high-rise apartment and office buildings connected by retail space.

Architects touted the buildings' "French Mansard" style metal roofs and bragged that the development had the largest underground parking garage in the city.

Most of the development was built as originally planned and has seen only minor changes since the early 1970s.

The 1966 original plan for the property had a combination of high rises and retail. Shopping center tenants include World Market and Good Eats. But several large sections of the retail strip have recently been vacated.

Longtime Dallas retail broker Jack Gosnell said the renovation at Turtle Creek Village is overdue and will be an asset to the neighborhood.

"They've been working on this plan for two years and are really going to fix Turtle Creek Village," Mr. Gosnell said. "It's still a fabulous location."

The shopping and office center, down Blackburn from the popular West Village, is located near the south end of Highland Park.

A nearby vacant automobile dealership at Oak Lawn and Avondale Street is being remodeled into the Equinox spa.

"The Turtle Creek Village renovation is an incredible project and will go well with what Equinox is doing," Mr. Gosnell said.

PM Realty Group has begun work, starting with the tower.

"We are replacing all the exterior with the highest-performance silver glass we can get," Mr. Perkins said.

And the main entrance for the office building will be turned to face Blackburn.

Architect Jeff Smith said the improvements to the office tower will also make the building much more energy efficient.

"The glass that is there now is nowhere near meeting energy codes," Mr. Smith said. "We are replacing all that.

"It should be quite a change on the skyline."

Mr. Smith said the architects also planned the tower redo with an eye toward remodeling of the rest of the complex.

"The goal will be to take the materials used on this building and work them into what else is built on the site," he said.

The high-rise is about 88 percent leased.

"Our rents are great, but we think we can deliver a product that is more consistent with what the market demands," he said.

Work on the office building should be finished this summer, and PM Realty is still considering what to do with the rest of the complex.

"We are looking at the smaller office building and the retail to decide the best situation for the center," Mr. Perkins said.

"The process won't be overnight," he said, "because we still have retail tenants.

"But we acquired this property because we think it is underutilized."

[vman]

I wish more skyscrapers in Dallas from that era would get a makeover like this. I like it.

[TinMan]

Noticed yesterday that the Souper Salad is being gutted. If anyone desires a lovely vinyl booth, there is a dumpster full of them. It is getting pretty empty over at TCV. Any news on when they are going forward with the renovation? Wonder what will happen to the World Market store?

[30kmillionaire]

Benihana is gone too, when did that happen?

[SDORN]

Work has been going on for some time now on this building Two Turtle Creek This building is getting a huge makeover.Is there a thread on this ?If there was I couldn't find it.

Here some shots I took today

http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/5967/twoturtlecreek1beginingqe4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img371.imageshack.us/img371/5967/twoturtlecreek1beginingqe4.dfc20f9d55.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=371&i=twoturtlecreek1beginingqe4.jpg)

[SDORN]

There wasn't much activity on this until today.

[Tnekster]

^There is a thread on this somewhere. I remember posting some story about this redo some time back. Will look around.

[US75Guy]

Shame about that Holy Trinity College/Jesuit Prep torn down in the 1960's..... wouldnt it be incredible to still have that on the corner instead of just another strip center. Very sad.

I guess this was Jesuit's home before it moved out on Inwood near Forest?

[SDORN]

In Two Turtle Creek vVllage Streets is closed. Most of the shops facing Oak Lawn are empty Inwood national bank is still open there. The shop behind that seem to be doing well. Good Eats In One turtle creek is leased till 2011 from what I was told the strip in two turtle creek was going to be bulldozed and rebuilt. This information came from One of the waiters In Good Eats. Here is some helpful on the Two turtle Creek shopping villages. First the whole shopping district is divided into to two shopping centers One Turtle creek and Two Turtle creek. The redo is occuring on the 19 story in Two turtle Creek Village. Goods Eats and World Market are In One Turtle Creek. The two Turtle creek Shopping center borders Oak lawn and Blackburn. One Turtle Creek borders Oak lawn and other street forgot the name. To prevent any confusion I will try and Illustrate with photos.
For starter lets start with A shot taken from the Good eat overflow parking lot facing the rear of the One Turtle Creek shopping center.
Not sure if this building is also needing improvement Looks Okay to me
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9123/260993411816e32e73dfta7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img504.imageshack.us/img504/9123/260993411816e32e73dfta7.d737d2f9f1.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=504&i=260993411816e32e73dfta7.jpg)

Good Eats is the first building one comes across In One turtle Creek Village as you travel south on Oak lawn toward Downtown. I ate here quite often as the food is very good here.

http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/1594/25917176939a950fcc08zk9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img47.imageshack.us/img47/159
4/25917176939a950fcc08zk9.3d7350ccc9.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=47&i=25917176939a950fcc08zk9.jpg)
The tower getting a redo is in the Two Turtle Creek Village shopping center
It is 19 stories not 18 it was built in 1972 and is 91 feet tall Architect George Dahl designed this building
http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/107/2607016170b200af06e4rt7.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img117.imageshack.us/img117/107/2607016170b200af06e4rt7.903b90489d.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=117&i=2607016170b200af06e4rt7.jpg)

Here is a vertical shot showing thr sign with the existing businesses still In Two Turtle Creek along with the tower renovation Progress.
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/8754/2609170653b1468c3f7ebt2.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img146.imageshack.us/img146/8754/2609170653b1468c3f7ebt2.f4c0d09f52.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=146&i=2609170653b1468c3f7ebt2.jpg)
Ok the here is a verticsl view of the rest of the shopping center I owe you all better view of the actual strip in Two Turtle Creek. I will add it tommorow. Hopefuly this will help in the discusiion on this thread.
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/9650/26100256467591c40279vv1.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img522.imageshack.us/img522/9650/26100256467591c40279vv1.996b395299.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=522&i=26100256467591c40279vv1.jpg)
This shot was taken from the Two Turtle Creek Rear parking lot showing the back structure In One Turtle Creek Village.
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/2301/2609219291013b8cdd82th3.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img140.imageshack.us/img140/2301/2609219291013b8cdd82th3.daf6ae8cb1.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=140&i=2609219291013b8cdd82th3.jpg)

[I45Tex]

Nice coverage, Scott!

[SDORN]

Thanks keep watching the above post I have more to add.

[SDORN]

Here is a view Shot July 1, 2008 some glass has started to do up on the top of the Building on Two Turtle creek. View looking north taken from the center median.

http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/2535/oaklawnview2dd9.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img244.imageshack.us/img244/2535/oaklawnview2dd9.950e23ac3d.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=244&i=oaklawnview2dd9.jpg)

[SDORN]

Oh by the way. Begining July 7, 2008 Street resurfacing will begining at Oak Lawn. Oak lawn wil go down to one lane at Times. I have the notice at work and will grab it tommorow If I dont forget it. The notice came from the Town of Highland Park.

[TinMan]

I saw some construction happening at the former location of Souper Salad. Any idea what it is going to be? Also, any idea what is going in the former drugstore location just North of TCV? It has a nice wood front and I suspect it will be some upscale retail outlet.

[JohnMcKee]

Oh by the way. Begining July 7, 2008 Street resurfacing will begining at Oak Lawn. Oak lawn wil go down to one lane at Times. I have the notice at work and will grab it tommorow If I dont forget it. The notice came from the Town of Highland Park.

I am getting so tired of this Oak Lawn construction, I commute from Las Colinas to McKinney Ave so my two choices are to exit Oak Lawn from 35 and deal with traffic and construction or continue on 35 in traffic and exit Pearl from Woodall. Sometimes it's a wash, somedays Oak Lawn or Woodall takes significantly less time. There is no way to guess how it's going to be on any given day but I suspect when they start on Oak Lawn Woodall is going to be faster.

[SDORN]

John the resurfacing is done. Traffic patterns are back to normal.

[SDORN]

Okay I have an update with a funky twist I shot some of the two turtle creek construction with my fisheye2 cam I recently got have fun looking the photos by the way a fence is up and look at all the new glass going in on the windows on the highrise now. This is going to fun to watch.
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/6589/twoturtlecreek1jd0.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img294.imageshack.us/img294/6589/twoturtlecreek1jd0.0e6c632337.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=294&i=twoturtlecreek1jd0.jpg)

[SDORN]

http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/897/twoturtlecreek2nc4.jpg (http://imageshack.us)
http://img125.imageshack.us/img125/897/twoturtlecreek2nc4.72d27c51a6.jpg (http://g.imageshack.us/g.php?h=125&i=twoturtlecreek2nc4.jpg)

[freewaytincan]

I don't mean to be "that guy" but honestly, that redesign looks a bit bland. When you get a shot like this, I say go for it, and do something spectacular. This is Dallas, after all, not Idaho or Kentucky. We're allowed at least a little edginess.

[supertrooper]

Hey...what's with the knock on Kentucky? I think Museum Plaza is one of the "edgiest" projects happening right now.

http://www.worldarchitecturenews.com/news_images/1000%20Rex%20Riverside%20Museum%20Plaza.jpg http://www.envizionary.com/wp-content/museum_plaza.jpg

Museum Plaza (http://museumplaza.net/)

[dallasag00]

That thing looks like an oil drilling platform in the gulf.

[SDORN]

WOW Dude that awesome!!!! almost looks like a modern Dallas

[kclapp]

I don't care how edgy and new age the developers make this project out to be. Museum Plaza is one of the most ugly buildings I've seen being built. In 25 years people will be begging to tear down that eye sore.

[Tnekster]

I don't care how edgy and new age the developers make this project out to be. Museum Plaza is one of the most ugly buildings I've seen being built. In 25 years people will be begging to tear down that eye sore.

That long?

[aygriffith]

As long as we are totally off topic... I would expect Museum Tower to happen before Museum Plaza happens. They have failed to secure a 300 million construction loan, and the site prep was shaking the older buildings in downtown off their foundations from what I read a few months ago...




---------------------
Electrical tower to be taken down

Developers of the $490 million, 62-story project at Seventh Street and River Road said yesterday they are investing $14.5 million to have Louisville Gas & Electric create a new electrical transmission system for downtown and remove electrical lines under the site.

The work started earlier this week and will culminate in January, when crews finish removing a 10-story transmission tower that has been an eyesore on the downtown skyline for a generation.

The futuristic skyscraper is meant to reshape Louisville's skyline when completed in 2011. It is the vision of arts patron Laura Lee Brown and her husband, Steve Wilson; developer Steve Poe; and attorney Craig Greenberg.

Greenberg said the four developers still haven't secured the $300 million construction loan necessary to complete the project because of instability in the financial markets. But that hasn't stopped them from investing more than $38 million of their own money at the site.

"We've decided to go ahead and make that investment now because we're so dedicated to this project," Steve Wilson said. "This is a huge investment in downtown."

Greenberg couldn't say what will happen in January if the developers haven't landed the loan.

"The best I can answer that today is to say our team has a significant investment in this project. We are personally and civically committed to completing it and we're going to find a way to get it done," he said. "It's a question of when, not if."

Poe said the utility work being done over the next few months will help the project move forward more quickly when the loan is secured.

"We have a great project … and a bad, but improving, worldwide economic market," Greenberg said. "We're ready to go as soon as they solve their problems and give credit to good projects like Museum Plaza."

LG&E spokesman Chip Keeling said the utility must build a redundant system to deliver electricity to downtown, power it up and ensure it works before disassembling the old lines and tower. He said the 10-story tower will come down "like an erector set, bolt by bolt."

"Removal isn't that difficult, we just have to make sure the new system is working properly first," Keeling said.

Museum Plaza was named one of the most architecturally innovative skyscrapers in the world by The Wall Street Journal in 2006.

When completed, the building will include three towers of various heights that look like an upside-down, three-legged chair. Inside, there will be condominiums, offices, shops, a museum and a Westin hotel, among other features.

Louisville will issue $47 million in bonds to help pay for a flood wall at the building and new streets, lighting and other infrastructure improvements.

The state of Kentucky has agreed to help the project with a 30-year taxing district that allows 80 percent of the taxes generated by the development to pay for infrastructure improvements. The state also will rebate sales taxes on construction materials used at the site.

No public money has been used so far at the building, Greenberg said.

Crews had been digging the foundation at the site in January when severe vibrations rattled 19th century buildings on Main Street, causing work to be halted. That work has not resumed, but Greenberg said crews will use a corkscrew drill, which will minimize vibrations, to install foundation beams when it does.

It will be the next phase of work after the utilities are relocated. Greenberg said it probably will be necessary to have the loan in place before doing so.

The development agreement between the developers and the city calls for work to begin in July, or the parties would have to negotiate a contract amendment. Greenberg said the work happening with the utilities counts. "It's real construction. It's a real start," he said.

[lesterleelee]

That thing looks like an oil drilling platform in the gulf.

There has to be a Chesapeake Energy joke in there somewhere...