DFW or Austin?

[disruptivehair]

Hi, new here.

I'm a Dallas native...born and raised in north Dallas. I went to Austin for college and worked there for a couple of years before moving to the UK. My English husband and I want to move back to Texas.

We wanted to go to Austin; hubby felt more comfy there because it's more liberal, but I have to admit I always found Dallas more entertaining. He just HATES it though; he thinks it's so horrible, but he's only seen my old stomping grounds. He has this thing about north Dallas and the Park Cities. I wouldn't want to live there either, I gotta admit.

The thing is, Austin's real estate market is going insane and I was thinking it might not be such a bad idea to just go back to DFW. I know the area better than I know Austin, I've got friends and family all over the metroplex, and I have a feeling it might be easier to find work in DFW than it would be in Austin. Am I just kidding myself here? Also, how would I sell DFW to the hubby? You can find counterculture weirdos in Dallas just as easily as in Austin, except in Dallas they're not trying so damned hard.

Any advice or suggestions? :bounce:

[hamiltonpl]

Lakewood. I find Lakewood's politics more liberal than the North Dallas / Park Cities set. And I say that with conviction since I grew up in the Park Cities.

Lakewood is rather "Austin" in many ways. My wife, who also went to school in Austin, goes on and on about how Lakewood is so similar to Austin. It certainly has it's share of funky places and counterculture folks down Greenville Avenue. There are some beautiful homes built mainly in the 1920's to 1950's.

Additionally, there are plenty of good places with a funky appeal in the Lakewood shopping center down Abrams. It houses the historical Lakewood theater. One night a week they play classic movies. Other nights they have Gay Bingo. How do you get more counterculture than Gay Bingo? Then you can walk across the street to legal grounds -- a coffee shop run by a lawyer who dispenses coffee along with his legal advice. There's also a great little Jazz bar next door to the Lakewood Theater.

The good thing about Dallas is that you'll be with grown ups at these places. In Austin you'll be one of those sad people trying to relive their college days -- hanging out at all the old college haunts. Nobody wants that.

[Columbus Civil]

Sadly there's no Leslie in Lakewood.

[disruptivehair]

Lakewood. I find Lakewood's politics more liberal than the North Dallas / Park Cities set. And I say that with conviction since I grew up in the Park Cities.

Lakewood is rather "Austin" in many ways. My wife, who also went to school in Austin, goes on and on about how Lakewood is so similar to Austin. It certainly has it's share of funky places and counterculture folks down Greenville Avenue. There are some beautiful homes built mainly in the 1920's to 1950's.

Additionally, there are plenty of good places with a funky appeal in the Lakewood shopping center down Abrams. It houses the historical Lakewood theater. One night a week they play classic movies. Other nights they have Gay Bingo. How do you get more counterculture than Gay Bingo? Then you can walk across the street to legal grounds -- a coffee shop run by a lawyer who dispenses coffee along with his legal advice. There's also a great little Jazz bar next door to the Lakewood Theater.

The good thing about Dallas is that you'll be with grown ups at these places. In Austin you'll be one of those sad people trying to relive their college days -- hanging out at all the old college haunts. Nobody wants that.


Yeah, but Lakewood's way out of our price range. :(

[VectorWega]

What price range are you interested in? There may be something near Lakewood that would fit, or possibly something in Oak Cliff.

[hamiltonpl]

Oak Cliff does has some beautiful areas -- and the "funky" Bishop Arts district.

You could also live in Deep Ellum. And VG has good advice about looking at something near Lakewood. There are a few homes in the low 200s if you are willing to stay in a 2 bedroom with the house being built in the 1950s. The '50s homes don't have the immediate charm of the '20s or '30s homes. But they have decent size kitchens and closets and big windows.

[dfwcre8tive]

Maybe he would like to be near the British Emporium (http://www.british-emporium.com/) in Grapevine. Some fun pubs around there too :)

[rantanamo]

The whole liberal Austin thing is overplayed, and often the facade goes away during election time.

[VectorWega]

The whole liberal Austin thing is overplayed, and often the facade goes away during election time.

That's because most of the pot smoking hippies oversleep and miss the vote.

[Geaux Tigers]

Maybe he would like to be near the British Emporium (http://www.british-emporium.com/) in Grapevine. Some fun pubs around there too :)

The British Emporium rocks!

[Agnus Dei]

The whole liberal Austin thing is overplayed, and often the facade goes away during election time.

Agreed.
Austin's got its perks, as does any city. But as a liberal in Dallas, it can be frustrating but I hardly feel alone. No more alone than I feel in the US right now (which, admittedly, can be frustrating). But I never feel much more at ease in Austin than I do here. I don't feel the need to censor myself. Politically Austin is liberal, but socially I don't find it particularly so. My point is that there are plenty of reasons to live in one city or the other, but unless your husband is steeped in politics all day, I wouldn't base the decision on that.

[Tierdallas]

I live in Austin as we speak. This city is not designed very well every club or bar is centered on a few streets it seems. Dallas has better arts, zoo's , sports, lakes, victory park, trinity river project, etc. Austin is cool if go to UT or work for Dell. You could honestly do this city in two weeks way over hyped and I'm just 23.The Trinity river project will out do anything this city has to offer. Austin is a big Arlington with a downtown and town Lake nothing else

[Tierdallas]

Oh yeah I forgot the most annoying thing I-35 traffic has gotten worse there urban planners could have aleast trained on Sim City 4 or something. the Wall marts , targets, best buys are all off the high way. Where are the neighborhood stores.

[disruptivehair]

Thanks for all the responses you guys.

We're not interested in a tiny 50s house; we want to start a family soon and will need at least 3 bedrooms, preferably 4. We're also not crazy about putting any of our kids in the DISD and we can't really afford private school.

It's interesting how so many people say that Austin is played out. The more that I think about it, I agree; there are a lot of people trying to relive their college days and a lot of grownups who ought to know better trying to act like complete weirdos.

:guns:

[WestTexan]

Why not DISD? DISD has many excellent schools. Also, Lakehighlands is very affordable with many excellent RISD schools.

[disruptivehair]

Why not DISD? DISD has many excellent schools. Also, Lakehighlands is very affordable with many excellent RISD schools.


I went to DISD schools as a child; I was never impressed with all the political fighting that went on there, the lack of funding, or the issues with the NAACP's lawsuit. I hated the way the DISD handled Robin Hood in the early 1990s. In my opinion there are only a handful of acceptable schools in the DISD, and houses in their catchment areas are usually out of our price range anyway. I wouldn't even send a kid to the high school I went to (Hillcrest); I hear it has really gone down the toilet. :mad: I got a good enough education there, but I had to put up with a lot of crap to do it, including having my orbit fractured by a Texas-sized jawbreaker thrown by a student who apparently didn't like 'uppity white girls.' I had a black eye; nothing happened to him. Damned if I'll put my kids through that.

[Geaux Tigers]

Sounds like you're looking for something you aren't going to find. A funky, liberal neighborhood with cheap housing and a good school district. Probably the closest you're going to find that combo will be in Denton. Outside of that, you're SOL if you want to live IN Dallas or Austin.

[msutton]

^ and the cheaper the homes and the better the school districts you get, the more conservative the environment will be. Look around at Lakewood and surrounding areas thoroughly, trying to find some "amazing" deal, before you just toss them out entirely.

[rjlevins]

Sadly there's no Leslie in Lakewood.

She got arrested last week for public intoxication on her way to Colorado. She said she'll be back to Austin soon though.

[Boredkid]

who is leslie?

[VectorWega]

Austin's got its perks, as does any city.

You've never been to Odessa have you? How about Big Spring?

[VectorWega]

who is leslie?

You're the one that asked:

http://www.austinexperience.com/scenes/leslie/leslie1.jpg

[disruptivehair]

Sounds like you're looking for something you aren't going to find. A funky, liberal neighborhood with cheap housing and a good school district. Probably the closest you're going to find that combo will be in Denton. Outside of that, you're SOL if you want to live IN Dallas or Austin.


The 'funky' and 'liberal' isn't as important to me as it is to my husband. I grew up in north Dallas; I can handle stuffy and conservative. Good schools and affordable housing...not necessarily CHEAP, but good value for money...are far more important.

[disruptivehair]

You're the one that asked:

http://www.austinexperience.com/scenes/leslie/leslie1.jpg


I used to work in downtown Austin; had to pass that guy on my way to Starbucks. Boy, was he SMELLY.

[Boredkid]

ah... sorry I asked... I am assuming there is a backround story concerning him?

[disruptivehair]

ah... sorry I asked... I am assuming there is a backround story concerning him?


Leslie is what they refer to in Austin as 'local color.'

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Leslie_Cochran

[Agnus Dei]

You've never been to Odessa have you? How about Big Spring?

Ha, I've been to both.
If what your're looking for ISN'T a big city, those are two good places to be. And that's all I can really say about that. :)


I agree that Denton's not a bad choice. I lived there for three years and I do miss the art and music scene. There's always a show to see somewhere within walking distance (check out the schedule in the UNT music auditorium for graduate students' performances and visitors) --and often it's free! I didn't like not having many of the perks of being closer to Dallas, but it's got its positives. And I did love the parks. So it's not a bad thing to check out.

[Lakewooder]

Miss Hair: Do you really want your kids compelled into conformity at some conservative, coercive, homogeneous haven of white flight?

[disruptivehair]

Miss Hair: Do you really want your kids compelled into conformity at some conservative, coercive, homogeneous haven of white flight?


Do I really have a choice?

[hamiltonpl]

Do I really have a choice?
If you don't like the DISD -- don't send your kids to the DISD. Send them to private school.

But you will not find a four bedroom house in ANY "liberal" neighborhood in Dallas for "cheap."

If you want a big house on the cheap -- you're going to have to move to the 'burbs.

I agree with Geaux Tigers that you are looking for something you are not going to find. A liberal neighborhood with good schools and cheap housing just does not exist. That will be hard to find in any city. As Msutton from Manhattan said, "the and the cheaper the homes and the better the school districts you get, the more conservative the environment will be."

I really do suggest Lakewood and a private school for the kids. You can find a good 3 bedroom home to purchase around 250k. Look for homes in around Christmas and New Years. It's a real buyers market at that time. And don't rush it. Wait for the good deal.

If 4 bedrooms is important to you, you'll need $500,000 in Dallas. (and that's cheap in the US.) You can move to a redneck town like Royse City and get a 4 bedroom for 200k. But it will tip over in a brisk wind.

[disruptivehair]

If you don't like the DISD -- don't send your kids to the DISD. Send them to private school.

But you will not find a four bedroom house in ANY "liberal" neighborhood in Dallas for "cheap."

I wasn't aware there were any 'liberal' neighborhoods in Dallas anyway, besides Oak Lawn. :angel:


If you want a big house on the cheap -- you're going to have to move to the 'burbs.

Doesn't have to be big; I just don't want a 2-bedroom house. Our house here in the UK is tiny, and I'm sick of not having any space. Or a yard.


I agree with Geaux Tigers that you are looking for something you are not going to find. A liberal neighborhood with good schools and cheap housing just does not exist. That will be hard to find in any city. As Msutton from Manhattan said, "the and the cheaper the homes and the better the school districts you get, the more conservative the environment will be."

Good schools are more important to us than the political flavor of the neighborhood. I don't really care how my neighbors vote, as long as they leave me alone. :D


I really do suggest Lakewood and a private school for the kids. You can find a good home to purchase around 250k. Look for homes in around Christmas and New Years. It's a real buyers market at that time.

What private school would you suggest that we could afford? I mean, we're not rich people. We work in I.T. which means we'd be solidly middle class in Dallas, but I'd rather put that money away for retirement and college than spend it on private school, especially any private school that we could afford.


If 4 bedrooms is important to you, you'll need $500,000 in Dallas. (and that's cheap in the US.) You can move to a redneck town like Royse City and get a 4 bedroom for 200k. But it will tip over in a brisk wind.

What's Royse City? I've never even heard of that. You CAN get 4 bedrooms in my parents' 'hood for around the $300-$350k mark, but they're in the DISD and the McMansions are taking over anyway; their neighborhood will be teardown territory in another few years. They just built a $1 million, 6,000 square foot monstrosity across the street. :mad:

[Columbus Civil]

Send your kids to Woodrow Wilson.

[VectorWega]

If you don't like the DISD -- don't send your kids to the DISD. Send them to private school.

She said that she can't afford that.


If 4 bedrooms is important to you, you'll need $500,000 in Dallas. (and that's cheap in the US.)

In certain neighborhoods. However, overall you have way overpriced Dallas.


You can move to a redneck town like Royse City and get a 4 bedroom for 200k.

You are also overpricing Royce City. That being said, you could live much closer to Dallas for under 200k.


But it will tip over in a brisk wind.

Very doubtful.

[disruptivehair]

Send your kids to Woodrow Wilson.


Yeah, Woodrow's a good school; it had an OK rep when I was a student at Hillcrest but apparently it has improved a lot. I don't even know what zip codes go to Woodrow, though. I was friends with a girl who enrolled at Hillcrest by mistake; she had to transfer to Woodrow the next year. She lived in Lakewood and her parents had this awesome 20s house on a huge piece of land. It was a gorgeous place; I'd love to be able to afford a place like that. Better keep buying those lottery tickets tho. :eek:

[Columbus Civil]

http://www.ebby.com and http://www.cbdfw.com (just to name two) tell you what school district each property is in. Parts of 75214 are in Wilson's area..not sure what other zip codes, though.

[Lakewooder]

Perhaps you should give us an idea of your budget. You really won't need to pay for a private school in Lakewood if you are in the Stonewall Jackson or Lakewood Elementary attendance zones:

http://www.dallasisd.org/eval/schoolinfo/eszones2006/JacksonStonewall2006.pdf

http://www.dallasisd.org/eval/schoolinfo/eszones2006/Lakewood2006.pdf

You are going to have a real problem finding a home under $200K in those areas, but it's possible. Search zip codes 75206 and 75214 -- ebby.com is pretty easy to use, just set least expensive to appear first.

Sounds like you are afraid to be in a school where there aren't many whites, otherwise I would recommend these East Dallas elementaries where you could find a home for less: Bonham (exemplary) in 75206, Lipscomb in 75214 (exemplary) and Mount Auburn in 75223 (recognized).

I don't think you can judge over 200 schools in DISD by someone throwing a jawbreaker at you at Hillcrest 15 years ago. Kids throw things sometimes.

Oh my god, I'm defending Hillcrest!

Besides, Hillcrest will be changing soon when the new high school in Vickery Meadows opens and takes half the student body.

[disruptivehair]

http://www.ebby.com and http://www.cbdfw.com (just to name two) tell you what school district each property is in. Parts of 75214 are in Wilson's area..not sure what other zip codes, though.


http://www.realtor.com tells you what school district each property is in, but you can't search by the schools.

I knew a lot of people who lived in 75214 when I was growing up; they send kids to Hillcrest and Woodrow.

[Columbus Civil]

Here's a cute house:

http://www.abiorealestate.com/property/property.asp?PRM_MLSNumber=10420318&PRM_MlsName=NTREIS#

(I love looking at houses)

[Columbus Civil]

I'm pretty partial to Lake Highlands. The homes are a bit cheaper than Lakewood and the schools (Richardson ISD) are good as well.

[disruptivehair]

Perhaps you should give us an idea of your budget. You really won't need to pay for a private school in Lakewood if you are in the Stonewall Jackson or Lakewood Elementary attendance zones:

http://www.dallasisd.org/eval/schoolinfo/eszones2006/JacksonStonewall2006.pdf

http://www.dallasisd.org/eval/schoolinfo/eszones2006/Lakewood2006.pdf

You are going to have a real problem finding a home under $200K in those areas, but it's possible. Search zip codes 75206 and 75214 -- ebby.com is pretty easy to use, just set least expensive to appear first.

Sounds like you are afraid to be in a school where there aren't many whites, otherwise I would recommend these East Dallas elementaries where you could find a home for less: Bonham (exemplary) in 75206, Lipscomb in 75214 (exemplary) and Mount Auburn in 75223 (recognized).

I don't think you can judge over 200 schools in DISD by someone throwing a jawbreaker at you at Hillcrest 15 years ago. Kids throw things sometimes.

Oh my god, I'm defending Hillcrest!

Besides, Hillcrest will be changing soon when the new high school in Vickery Meadows opens and takes half the student body.


I'm not afraid of sending kids to a school where they'd be in the minority; I was a minority at Hillcrest and I am not a racist. I just don't want my kids to have to put up with some of the same s*** I had to put up with at school. Overall I have a pretty rotten impression of DISD schools; my brother and I both went to Pershing, Franklin, and Hillcrest and we turned out fine, but we had some experiences I'd rather not have to relive as a parent.

The jawbreaker incident is just one thing that happened to me at HHS. I had some excellent teachers, but there are a lot of things I'd have changed about that place if I could have. I got sick of my purse being stolen, my wallet being stolen, my locker being broken into, my car being vandalized, and being teased for being a 'rich girl,' which I was NOT. I also got sick of all the DRUGS. Of course, you can't escape drugs in the suburbs; if anything, there's MORE drugs there!

We also want nothing to do with the 75230 mentality or the Park Cities mentality. Ugh, ugh, ugh. I'd rather live in Plano than put up with that again. I fled north Dallas as soon as I was old enough, and even when I returned to Dallas after graduating from college, I moved to Irving. On purpose! :bounce:

[disruptivehair]

I'm pretty partial to Lake Highlands. The homes are a bit cheaper than Lakewood and the schools (Richardson ISD) are good as well.


I did a summer course at Lake Highlands HS when I was in high school; I took a trip to Europe that summer and got back too late for the DISD but the RISD was happy to have me! I was the only Dallas kid there; all the other kids were Lake Highlands students and they seemed OK. I knew some Lake Highlands kids at UT, too; but I've heard some really bad things about it which is why we didn't even consider it. I'd like to know more. :)

[VectorWega]

If you're willing to look in the 'burbs here is a cute one that I've been lookin at for a while. I could hook you up with a sweet deal on this one. The sellers are probably getting pretty desperate. Let me know:

http://www.abiorealestate.com/property/property.asp?PRM_MLSNumber=10369418&PRM_MlsName=NTREIS

[disruptivehair]

If you're willing to look in the 'burbs here is a cute one that I've been lookin at for a while. I could hook you up with a sweet deal on this one. The sellers are probably getting pretty desperate. Let me know:

http://www.abiorealestate.com/property/property.asp?PRM_MLSNumber=10369418&PRM_MlsName=NTREIS

Ha. Ha, ha, ha.

[VectorWega]

Sorry..wasn't sure about your price range. While the $230,000 a month mortgage payment doesn't sound too bad, adding taxes and insurance to that figure can make it seem a little daunting.

[disruptivehair]

Sorry..wasn't sure about your price range. While the $230,000 a month mortgage payment doesn't sound too bad, adding taxes and insurance to that figure can make it seem a little daunting.


I don't have anything to say to that.

[Columbus Civil]

I just bought my first house in February, and it was tough finding something in our price range in Dallas.

[disruptivehair]

I just bought my first house in February, and it was tough finding something in our price range in Dallas.


This is why the burbs were attractive. We could buy something in our price range in Dallas and end up in an area with less than great schools and a run-down, crappy atmosphere. Let's face it, some areas of Dallas are really clapped out. Or, we could buy a house in the suburbs, be surrounded by Republicans with SUVs, not be able to find our house because it looks just like the one next to it, and just maybe send the kids to a decent school. It's a tough choice; it's a choice a lot of people have to make. We'd have to make the same choices in Austin, but no matter where we ended up in Austin we'd be paying more money and having less fun; there's more to do in DFW. I'll risk the scorn of the uptowners if it means we get what we we're looking for.

[Columbus Civil]

I understand completely. We were in the same dilemma, except we didn't have to worry about schools too much since we're not going to have children.

Good luck!

[Lakewooder]

Your philosophy would fit in well in Lakewood -- we have a fair amount of republicans but also a lot of democrats and people are not afraid to put a political sign in their yard and be 'dismissed' or 'reviled'. Variety and maverick types are celebrated in East Dallas!

Check out: http://www.worldservice-uk.com/about.html

on Greenville -- also there's the Cock'n Bull Pub in Lakewood Shopping Center which is supposed to be pretty good in the opinion of displaced Brits. Also the sort of Irish Tipperary Inn and Dubliner, and the Old Monk on Henderson east of Central.

For God's sake we have a lot of interesting types at the Whole Foods on Greenville (been there for a long time you might remember it) alone. And don't forget: http://www.kalachandjis.com/ in Mount Auburn.

And besides Greenville you are close to Ellum/Fair Park/White Rock/Knox-Henderson, full of funky places. I don't imagine you'd like Mockingbird Station or the West Village, but they are close. And of course our burgeoning downtown scene about which you may read plenty here...

[DalMac]

Austin blows Dallas, Houston, Ft. Worth, San Antonio, Abilene, Tyler, Beaumont, and any other place in Texas out of the water. It's not even close.