Plano: Legacy Town Center

[noelamador]

^ personally I think this has turned out to be a really nice development. especially considering it's suburban location. the only other "town center" to come close would be Southlake's.

[psukhu]

^ personally I think this has turned out to be a really nice development. especially considering it's suburban location. the only other "town center" to come close would be Southlake's.

One of the advantages this development has is that they are pushing forward to build it out completely and not leaving any empty lots for future use.

This allows the development to exist as it was strategically planned. Visitors and residents experience the development as it was intended by the urban planners.

[psukhu]

I just saw a coming soon sign for this place in phase II: http://www.gordonbiersch.com/

I've been to the one in Broomfield, CO and it was pretty good. It is like a more upscale version of Humperdinks with better food.

[psukhu]

Looks like Google Maps updated their satellite image. This looks a month old:

http://maps.google.com/maps?f=q&hl=en&geocode=&q=bishop+rd+and+martin+rd,+plano,+tx&jsv=107.hc&sll=33.074497,-96.816823&sspn=0.008145,0.016909&ie=UTF8&ll=33.075208,-96.821662&spn=0.008145,0.016909&t=h&z=17&iwloc=addr

[Kelley USA]

I went to Legacy Town Center this past weekend- and WOW! It was the first time I had been in several years and I was impressed! I lived in the West Village for 4 years and I can honestly say this blows the WV away... The place looks great- and the new addition looks outstanding. Great mix of stores and some great restaurants!

[AeroD]

I went to Legacy Town Center this past weekend- and WOW! It was the first time I had been in several years and I was impressed! I lived in the West Village for 4 years and I can honestly say this blows the WV away... The place looks great- and the new addition looks outstanding. Great mix of stores and some great restaurants!

I am going to have to respectfully disagree.

I have been there several times, and there is something missing. Maybe it is the lack of the occasional bum, or lack of tall buildings, or the fact the place is essentially an island.

I wish this development would have taken off near downtown Plano. Granted, land may have been limited, but there is always the option of building up.

[psukhu]

I am going to have to respectfully disagree.

I have been there several times, and there is something missing. Maybe it is the lack of the occasional bum, or lack of tall buildings, or the fact the place is essentially an island.

I wish this development would have taken off near downtown Plano. Granted, land may have been limited, but there is always the option of building up.

Bums - Why would anyone want bums? They are human beings. Asking for people someone to live like this is horrible. There are countries where it is expected to not see any bums anywhere. (think Scandinavia)

Tall Buildings- The development must conform to the zoning. The zoning meets the needs of the area based on land use policy and market conditions. Would you rather have tall buildings with many undeveloped lots and massive surfacing parking lots, or shorter buildings with no gaps in the development? Many of the best cities in the world lack tall buildings. Take a tour of Europe to see what I am talking about.

Island- This development is 150 acres. That is a very large urban center for a city with the population of Plano.

Downtown Plano- This area is already experiencing gentrification and already has a lot of investors. There would always be an opportunity cost associated with not doing this type of development in west Plano. Developers look at NPV when deciding to take on a project. The fact that they were able to achieve their desired NPV while practicing land discipline is a good thing for the future of urban planning in DFW.

[Kelley USA]

Last time I checked there was only 1 tall building in WV- The Mondrian... This place was clean, well landscaped and well designed... It offers office, hotel, residential, retail and parks... The WV only has retail and residential.

[mjblazin]

What is it about dirt and trash that it's an acceptable, even sought, part of the "urban experience?" Mr. Bown made a comment in last week's column about a faux urban area like Legacy with clean gutters and attentive security guards on carts is not the "real thing." Why not? You get what expect and then inspect. Places like Legacy won't tolerate it; we do. That's not their problem; it's ours.

[AeroD]

Bums - Why would anyone want bums? They are human beings. Asking for people someone to live like this is horrible. There are countries where it is expected to not see any bums anywhere. (think Scandinavia)

Tall Buildings- The development must conform to the zoning. The zoning meets the needs of the area based on land use policy and market conditions. Would you rather have tall buildings with many undeveloped lots and massive surfacing parking lots, or shorter buildings with no gaps in the development? Many of the best cities in the world lack tall buildings. Take a tour of Europe to see what I am talking about.

Island- This development is 150 acres. That is a very large urban center for a city with the population of Plano.

Downtown Plano- This area is already experiencing gentrification and already has a lot of investors. There would always be an opportunity cost associated with not doing this type of development in west Plano. Developers look at NPV when deciding to take on a project. The fact that they were able to achieve their desired NPV while practicing land discipline is a good thing for the future of urban planning in DFW.

Slow down there.

I am not necessarily asking people to live like bums. The comment was tongue-in-cheek. But the place is not really urban. Steve Brown recently wrote an article talking about this. Part of what I enjoyed about NYC and Vancouver is that beyond it being pedestrian-friendly, the wealthy, middle-class and the downtrodden all shared the same space.

As far as it being an island, downtown Plano, unlike Legacy, is connected to Richardson, and Dallas via rail. Try driving from Allen to Legacy Town Center. You will drive pass through miles upon miles of brick walls that surround subdivisions. Once you get to the Legacy Business Park, you still have to drive past the corporate campuses just to get to the town center. Having been there are on several occassions, I have not seen many people cross the Legacy to get the other newly developed side of the town center. People still get in their cars to cross the street.

I am not necessarily asking for a 100-story a la Dubai building in Downtown Plano. But there are empty lots along Ave K and at least one abandon warehouse just adjacent to downtown Plano. Part of Plano's problem is that its East side has not developed as well as the West Side has.

[Maverick]

Legacy is a fabulous project, and I find it amazing that people will nit pick at it.

Plano's east side has not developed as extensively as the west side due to the incomes. You need a high concentration of good incomes to support a large project like Legacy Town Center....not to say that east won't continue to develop in its own fashion. Hope it does.

[Mballar]

Did they build the fountains (a la Bellagio (http://www.bellagio.com/amenities/fountains-of-bellagio.aspx))?

[Maverick]

The fountains went by the way-side.

[dfwcre8tive]

Less Than Two Years After It Opened, It's Time To Close the Book on Indie Legacy Books
By Robert Wilonsky, Wed., Aug. 4 2010 @ 3:18PM
Categories: Biz, The Unfair Park Book Club
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/2010/08/less_than_two_years_after_it_o.php

​Kyle Hall, who handles the promotions for Legacy Books up in Plano, hadn't taken a vacation since the mammoth indie bookseller opened its doors in November 2008. He was ready for his very first on July 25 when, the night before, he got a call from Teri Tanner, who manages and operates the store. She began, "I hate to lay this on you now ..." And then she told him: On August 14, Legacy Books will be no more.

The reason, Hall says: The investors who owned the place -- investors whose names he says he does not know, because, after all, it's a private venture -- decided they had lost too much money on the venture. They had been, Hall says, "extraordinarily patient," but the time had come to admit defeat. Today's announcement comes but a few hours after Barnes & Noble's board announced that the chain is on the auction block. These are bad days for brick-and-mortar booksellers.

...

[Kelley USA]

Also from DMN:

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/080510dnbus_legacy_books_closing.1facc9dc.html

[darkblood]

Less Than Two Years After It Opened, It's Time To Close the Book on Indie Legacy Books
By Robert Wilonsky, Wed., Aug. 4 2010 @ 3:18PM
Categories: Biz, The Unfair Park Book Club
http://blogs.dallasobserver.com/unfairpark/2010/08/less_than_two_years_after_it_o.php

​Kyle Hall, who handles the promotions for Legacy Books up in Plano, hadn't taken a vacation since the mammoth indie bookseller opened its doors in November 2008. He was ready for his very first on July 25 when, the night before, he got a call from Teri Tanner, who manages and operates the store. She began, "I hate to lay this on you now ..." And then she told him: On August 14, Legacy Books will be no more.

The reason, Hall says: The investors who owned the place -- investors whose names he says he does not know, because, after all, it's a private venture -- decided they had lost too much money on the venture. They had been, Hall says, "extraordinarily patient," but the time had come to admit defeat. Today's announcement comes but a few hours after Barnes & Noble's board announced that the chain is on the auction block. These are bad days for brick-and-mortar booksellers.

...


Oh man. Why?! Well I know why, but... I really liked that place. In fact I think it's the only place in Legacy Town Center that didn't feel too snooty or overbearingly normal for us. Then again we just went there monday night and their selection was feeling rather lacking.

Maybe the space can be taken over by a giant Half-Price books. Sure the super-liberal attitude may not fly in conservative Plano, but we could give it a shot.

[AeroD]

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/bus/industries/commrealestate/stories/DN-Plano_18bus.ART0.State.Edition1.3edec53.html


Canadian utility to break ground on Plano high-rise

10:27 AM CST on Thursday, November 18, 2010

By STEVE BROWN / The Dallas Morning News
stevebrown@dallasnews.com

Construction will start in about two weeks on the only high-rise office project now in the works for the Dallas area.

The three-building Plano complex will house operations for EnCana Oil & Gas (U.S.A.) Inc.

Almost 1,000 people could eventually work in the towers on the Dallas North Tollway in the Legacy Town Center. EnCana bought the building site this week and is ready to move ahead with the first 13-story tower.

The Canadian energy company, which has operations in several locations, including a main office near Galleria Dallas, bought the 7 acres of land from Legacy Town Center developer Karahan Cos.

"They expect more than 500 people to work there when it opens in early 2012 and will increase employment to 1,000 plus," developer Fehmi Karahan said. "It's a huge commitment in times like these for a company to build this project."

The first 300,000-square-foot building will go up starting in early December just north of Legacy Drive, Karahan said.

"It will only be about 12 months of construction – a very fast pace," he said. "EnCana will be the largest single employer in Legacy Town Center."

EnCana is also planning two other 12-story office buildings for the site.

Dallas-based developer KDC will build EnCana's new offices and lease the buildings back to the Calgary-based company.

KDC officials declined to talk about the project.

Corgan Associates is the architect.

EnCana doesn't intend to move large numbers of people from outside the Dallas area to fill the new buildings, company spokesman Alan Boras said.

The company has expanded its operations here in recent years.

"We've been in Dallas for a number of years, and it's organic growth," Boras said. "It's a long-term plan to manage our office needs there."

Legacy Town Center – a popular mixed-use development on the east side of the tollway, with shops, restaurants, apartments and offices – is already home to large employers including Alliance Data Systems Corp. and Publicis.

The city of Plano is preparing economic support for the development, which will be one of the largest under way in the Collin County community.

"The city will be considering incentives for that project on Monday," said Sally Bane, executive director of the Plano Economic Development Board. "The city has gone to great lengths to participate in getting the company to come to Plano."

Cushman & Wakefield of Texas has been representing EnCana in its hunt for a new office location.

EnCana is one of the largest natural gas producers in North America , with operations stretching from western Canada to Texas and Louisiana.

The company employs more than 3,900 workers in Canada and the U.S.

Next year, EnCana will move its headquarters into a new 58-story building in downtown Calgary, Alberta.

[tamtagon]

Sweet!

I wonder if the EnCana MID-rise would have gotten on the fast track, or happened at all if not for the pending five years of rebuilding LBJ traffic jam.

[AeroD]

Sweet!

I wonder if the EnCana MID-rise would have gotten on the fast track, or happened at all if not for the pending five years of rebuilding LBJ traffic jam.

One that note, going a little off track, I imagine Valley View and the surrounding are will be ripe for development after construction.

[mjblazin]

Is long term, disruptive road construction similar to the impact of high gas prices? Do the pain/higher expenses force people in the suburbs to live closer to urban core, one scenario believed by many on the forum? Or do those elements result in firms driving employment centers to the near side of the barrier/shorten the driving expense?

[AeroD]

Do the pain/higher expenses force people in the suburbs to live closer to urban core, one scenario believed by many on the forum? Or do those elements result in firms driving employment centers to the near side of the barrier/shorten the driving expense?

The way you framed the questions is rather simplistic. Yes, a suburb was chosen, Plano, but what part of that suburb was chosen? Legacy Town Center. That itself is an attempt to create an urbanesque core for Plano. So in terms of design, EnCana is leaving a suburban Dallas location for an urban Plano location.

[mjblazin]

Assuming your statement is true, it supports Joel Kotkin's thesis that urbanesque features in the suburbs are the future, not movement to downtown core. As Sean Connery stated in "The Rock": thanks for proving my point.

The suburbs will not die a la Mr. Kuntsler's and other's beliefs. They will evolve and grow. The urban core can't look for suburban transplants to solve its problems.

[AeroD]

Assuming your statement is true, it supports Joel Kotkin's thesis that urbanesque features in the suburbs are the future, not movement to downtown core. As Sean Connery stated in "The Rock": thanks for proving my point.

The suburbs will not die a la Mr. Kuntsler's and other's beliefs. They will evolve and grow. The urban core can't look for suburban transplants to solve its problems.

So for Joel Kotkin suburbs that pursue "urban" strategies for development is okay, cities that try to revitalize their urban cores pointless.

[mjblazin]

Kotkin believes revitalizing will work if focused on creating neighborhoods, not monuments, that will draw middle class families with children. Espousing that inevitable economic situations will shutdown the suburbs and force chastened residents into the urban core is foolish.

[AeroD]

Kotkin believes revitalizing will work if focused on creating neighborhoods, not monuments, that will draw middle class families with children. Espousing that inevitable economic situations will shutdown the suburbs and force chastened residents into the urban core is foolish.

Not to go off tangent, but you kinda miss Kotkin's other point about immigration. By American standards, working class Hispanic immigrants may not be "middle class" but they are living in Dallas because for them, as much as people talk down at Dallas, a bad day in Dallas beats a good day in Guanajuato.

[AeroD]

http://planoblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2010/11/plano-gives-estimated-45-milli.html


The package includes a $2.4 million cash grant, as well as a 10-year property tax break that is estimated to be worth about $2.1 million (given today's tax rates and the company's estimated tax benefits to the city). The company, in turn, has pledged to relocate and/or create 510 jobs and add some $88 million to Plano's tax rolls.

Encana's package constitutes the city's largest recent economic development package, almost doubling the combination of cash and tax breaks that drew the headquarters of Pizza Hut to Plano from Addison last year.

Colleague Steve Brown offered the highlights of Encana's move to Plano in today's newspaper. But only now is the scope of the incentive deal becoming known. The company plans to move to a three-story complex in the Legacy area.

"The city will be considering incentives for that project on Monday," Sally Bane, executive director of the Plano Economic Development Board told Brown. "The city has gone to great lengths to participate in getting the company to come to Plano."

[mjblazin]

Not to go off tangent, but you kinda miss Kotkin's other point about immigration. By American standards, working class Hispanic immigrants may not be "middle class" but they are living in Dallas because for them, as much as people talk down at Dallas, a bad day in Dallas beats a good day in Guanajuato.

Kotkin says it only works if the pie expands and immigrants, principally Hispanic, get a big share of it. Immigration provides the fuel that will help us avoid the dead ends facing Europe and most other developed nations, but we still have to tune the engine to do well for everyone here. How you do it depends on your individual political philosophy.

[jrd1964]

Robb & Stucky closing all of its stores, including Plano

By MARIA HALKIAS
Staff Writer
mhalkias@dallasnews.com
Published 10 March 2011 01:32 PM

High-end furniture retailer Robb & Stucky is liquidating all of its stores, including its Plano location.

The Fort Myers, Fla.-based chain is selling $90 million worth of home furnishings at 20 stores in Florida, Texas, Arizona and Nevada.

Robb & Stucky, which has been in business for 95 years, was acquired by a liquidation company after filing for bankruptcy in February.

The company closed its stores at NorthPark Center in Dallas and in Southlake in the last year. It stocked upscale brands such as Ralph Lauren, Elements, Tommy Bahama, Paloma, Trump Home and Monterey.

The Plano store is at the southeast corner of Legacy Drive and the Dallas North Tollway.

[US75Guy]

Old news, but as they seem to be moving right along on the construction- thought it deserved a post:


New ground has been broken on the Encana Corp office in Plano.

Dallas’ Texan suburb Plano has seen new ground broken on what will be new regional headquarters for the Encana Corporation. The site will contain 320,000 square feet of office space and is being developed by Dallas firm KDC. The company agreed a long term lease with Encana which will see the Canadian natural gas company office space in the class A offices. Encana’s new home will be situated in Legacy Town Center, which constitutes 150 acres and has been deliberately set aside for mixed use occupation. With the building expected to cost approximately $70 million, Encana will be buying into a project which besides office space will also have a conference and training floor, a parking lot based over seven levels and a pedestrian bridge.

Encana’s American headquarters are based in Denver Colorado, while the company also have 130,000 square feet of office space at Stanford Corporate Center in Texas’ Farmer’s Branch. The new property in Dallas’ Plano suburb will be a replacement for the Farmer’s Branch site, with the changeover taking place in 2012. KDC President Tobin Grove believes that the new office site in Plano will enable the Canadian corporation to expand and continue its growth in the financial markets. The firm trades on the New York and Toronto stock exchange.

Grove said: “Encana was looking for a long-term home [and] the company chose a site in Legacy Town Center because it really wanted a live-work-play environment. “Encana wanted to create a great environment for their employees. It’s hard to hire and retain the best talent, and they’re competing for people,” he added.

Between 500-600 people will be employed on the site but with plans for at least two more office blocks to be built which would give the firm 960,000 square feet of office space in the future.

[ChampionDallas]

Although I do like Plano's Legacy Town Center, I would have to say that I enjoy Southlake's Town Square much more, and not solely because I live here. Personally, I believe that STS has a more "authentic" feel AKA a closer feel to a historic town and a wider array of stores. In addition to the environment, I would argue that it is more pedestrian friendly in that the streets are seem much smaller and the stores seem closer together. Having said that, I would rather visit Plano's LTC rather than fighting crowds at Frisco's Stonebriar Center.

In conclusion:

STS="Historic", more options, less like a shopping center.
PLTC= "Modern", more congested, more urban.

[gchrisbailey]

Although I do like Plano's Legacy Town Center, I would have to say that I enjoy Southlake's Town Square much more, and not solely because I live here. Personally, I believe that STS has a more "authentic" feel AKA a closer feel to a historic town and a wider array of stores. In addition to the environment, I would argue that it is more pedestrian friendly in that the streets are seem much smaller and the stores seem closer together. Having said that, I would rather visit Plano's LTC rather than fighting crowds at Frisco's Stonebriar Center.

In conclusion:

STS="Historic", more options, less like a shopping center.
PLTC= "Modern", more congested, more urban.

Between Southlake and Plano, it would be a wash, but what gives Legacy a huge advantage, IMO, is that they have an Angelika theatre there. Southlake seems more family-oriented, Plano Legacy a little more hip singles and young couples.

[Tnekster]

Trammell Crow working on Legacy office tower

By STEVE BROWN
STEVE BROWN The Dallas Morning News
Real Estate Editor
stevebrown@dallasnews.com
Published: 28 March 2012 10:09 AM

Developer Trammell Crow Co. is preparing to enter the hot tollway office market with a new project in Legacy Business Park.

Crow has formed a partnership with the owner of the former Robb & Stucky furniture store at the tollway and Legacy Drive.

“The venture contemplates redeveloping the property, which is located on a 6.2-acre site in Plano, Texas, into up to two class A office buildings,” property owner One Liberty Properties Inc. said this month in a financial filing.

Crow officials said Wednesday that it is too early to talk about the project.

But real estate brokers said that Crow is proposing to build a tower with as much as 500,000 square feet on the property in the Legacy Town Center development.

Crow has filed with the state to set up a partnership called TC Legacy Tower, records show.

The 112,389-square-foot Robb & Stucky store closed last year when the retailer pulled out of the market. Stacy Furniture has occupied the building on a short-term lease.

“The redevelopment of this property is subject to, among other things, obtaining the necessary equity and debt financing, sufficient tenant commitments and requisite third-party approvals,” One Liberty Properties said in its filing.

The New York-based real estate investment trust owns almost 100 commercial properties across the country.

In Texas, it owns nine retail buildings that are leased to tenants including Haverty’s Furniture, PetSmart and Office Depot.

The office tower Crow and One Liberty Properties that hope to build is the latest in a series of recent multi-tenant office projects proposed for the Dallas North Tollway corridor.

Developer Randy Heady is building a six-story speculative office building in Legacy business park. Other office buildings in the same area are planned by developers including Granite Properties, Hines and Hall Financial.

Follow Steve Brown on Twitter at @SteveBrownDMN.

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/commercial-real-estate/headlines/20120328-trammell-crow-working-on-legacy-office-tower.ece?action=reregister

[ChampionDallas]

Is 500,000 square feet about twenty-five stories, depending on thickness?

[Tnekster]

Is 500,000 square feet about twenty-five stories, depending on thickness?

Noticed that, does sound like a significant structure. If so it would be the tallest building out there.

[downtownguy25]

Just to give an idea of scale, Granite Park 3 a 14 story building, is tallest building in Plano and has 369,000 sqft of office space.

http://www.graniteparkthree.com/

[profbarium]

Just to give an idea of scale, Granite Park 3 a 14 story building, is tallest building in Plano and has 369,000 sqft of office space.

http://www.graniteparkthree.com/

Wow; 14 stories is No. 1?! That would get lost in the weeds in Uptown (to say nothing of Las Colinas, Galleria, High Five, or even Preston Center).

[ChampionDallas]

So then perhaps more like twenty stories. This building will only help develop the DNT/SRT interchange skyline.

[jrd1964]

But what is Stacy Furniture going to do? Find another Plano location, or just be satisfied with Allen and Southlake?

[CTroyMathis]

^ According to this article (http://www.dallasnews.com/business/retail/20110920-stacy-furniture-leases-former-robb-stucky-store-in-plano.ece), it's an 18-month lease testing the Plano market area. Perhaps they will stick around, but, in another nearby location. . . No idea.

[LongonBigD]

"The venture contemplates redeveloping the property, which is located on a 6.2-acre site in Plano, Texas, into up to two class A office buildings,” property owner One Liberty Properties Inc. said this month in a financial filing."

Two buildings = 500,000 sq ft or one tower?

[Random Traffic Guy]

"The venture contemplates redeveloping the property, which is located on a 6.2-acre site in Plano, Texas, into up to two class A office buildings,” property owner One Liberty Properties Inc. said this month in a financial filing."

Two buildings = 500,000 sq ft or one tower?

Two buildings, 500ksf total, 12ish stories...

[Random Traffic Guy]

Article with a rendering in the DMN business section today.

[cowboyeagle05]

I assume you mean this story...

http://www.dallasnews.com/business/commercial-real-estate/headlines/20120425-trammell-crow-ramping-up-west-plano-office-project.ece



Trammell Crow ramping up West Plano office project

In this artist’s rendering, the office project will start with a 13-story tower at Dallas North Tollway and Legacy Drive in West Plano. A possible second phase could add 192,000 square feet of office space in a seven-story building.
Trammell Crow Co. is taking the wraps off a new West Plano high-rise it hopes will lure more jobs to the Dallas North Tollway office market.
The 13-story office tower is planned for a more than 6-acre site at the southeast corner of Legacy Drive and the tollway...slam...paywall

http://img560.imageshack.us/img560/7379/up133537729705446330013.jpg (http://imageshack.us/photo/my-images/560/up133537729705446330013.jpg/)

[NThomas]

^ A much better fit than the old Robb & Stucky.