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aceplace
20 November 2004, 04:56 PM
Here's a news release from TxDOT. It looks like the state will construct the DART extension to Love, not the Feds...

Strangely enough, TxDOT still considers Fort Worth as a separate metro... as if the DFW traffic patterns were not interlocked and interdependent.

Here (http://www.dot.state.tx.us/txdotnews/mmprojects.htm) is the URL

.................................................. .................................................. ..............

The Texas Metropolitan Mobility Plan Project Acceleration

Thanks to the governor, state legislators, local officials and Texas voters, funds to fight urban congestion in our eight largest metropolitan areas will more than double during the next 12 years (2004-2015). As a result, nearly 90 percent of the metropolitan mobility projects planned for the next 12 years can begin in half the time.

Using just traditional transportation funding based on gas taxes and vehicle registrations, funds to reduce urban congestion would have been limited to $6.8 billion for the 12 year period. But through financial options and innovations provided by the governor and legislature, which are being implemented by local officials and the Texas Transportation Commission, mobility funding for the state's largest cities will top $15.4 billion.

Below are brief descriptions of some of the mobility projects in the 2005 Statewide Mobility Program. The total dollars for each metropolitan area represent all mobility dollars, including traditional funding and new funding sources such as the Texas Mobility Fund and Proposition 14 bonds.

AUSTIN ($1.3 billion)

Loop 1 from SH 45 South to FM 734 (Parmer Ln.). This roadway can now be reconstructed as a 6-lane freeway with managed lanes. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 5 years.

US 183 from South of US 290 to north of Loyola Rd. Construct main lanes and frontage roads on US 183. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

US 183 from South of IH 35 to south of US 290 East. Construct an electrical toll system. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

US 183 from North of Bolm Rd. to Patton Rd. Construct a 6-lane turnpike with frontage roads. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

US 183 at IH 35. This important intersection will see significant improvements in both capacity and safety. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 2 years.

US 183A from south of the San Gabriel River to north of Avery Ranch Blvd. This new 4-lane rural turnpike facility is being build with frontage roads to provide needed congestion relief in the northwest region of Austin. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

SH 45 from the Hays County line to Loop 1. This new location turnpike with frontage roads will provide expanded capacity in the region. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 5 years.

SH 71 for 1.1 miles north of US 290. This roadway will be expanded by the addition of needed frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 2 years.

US 290 from east of US 183 to east of SH 130. This roadway will be constructed as a 6-lane turnpike with frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

CORPUS CHRISTI ($475 million)

IH 37 from east of Carbon Plant Rd. to McKinzie Rd. This interstate facility will see a new underpass and frontage roads and the modification of exit ramps to provide improved traffic flow. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

IH 37 from Waco St. to SH 286 interchange. This new interchange will enhance the traffic flow near the Harbor Bridge. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 286 from IH 37 to south of Horne Rd. This roadway improvement will expand capacity by upgrading the facility to an 8-lane urban freeway and adding an additional lane in each direction. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 5 years.

SH 358 from Ayers St. to Spur 3. This roadway will add new lanes to this urban freeway and reverse ramps to aid traffic flow. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

US 181 across the Corpus Christi Ship Channel. This new harbor bridge over the ship channel will provide enhanced access to the Port of Corpus Christi. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

DALLAS ($4.7 billion)

Loop 12 from Texas Plaza to the Loop 12/IH 35 split. Widen this roadway from 6 to 8 lanes with 2 reversible HOV lanes and 2 & 3 lane frontage roads. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 9 years.

Loop 12 from W. Lawther Dr. to Goforth Dr. This roadway reconstruction improves the safety of the roadway by raising it above the floodplain. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

FM 1171 from West of US 377 to Shiloh Rd. This roadway will be expanded from a 2-lane rural facility to a 6-lane urban highway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

FM 2499 from FM 407 to IH 35E. This new roadway will provide another 4- and 6-lane urban facility to help meet the region’s capacity needs. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

FM 407 from FM 1830 to Briarhill Blvd. This roadway will be upgrade from a 2-lane rural facility to a 4-lane divided urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

SH 114 from County Line Road to FM 156. This roadway will be upgraded to a 4-lane divided rural/urban freeway with a new interchange at FM 156 to expand capacity and improve safety. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 114 from Harriet Creek to IH 35W. This roadway will be upgraded to a 4-lane divided urban freeway with frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 161 from IH 20 to SH 183. This project will construct 6-lane frontage roads in preparation for later construction of the main lanes of this urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

SH 161 from north of IH 20 to Rock Island Rd. Construct 6 lanes of frontage road along the roadway. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 5 years.

Bypass for IH 35E from south of SH 183 to SP 310 (old US 75). This project involves the construction of a 6-lane new location bypass to alleviate traffic congestion on IH 35E. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

Construct a light rail transit connection to Dallas Love Field airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

Construct a light rail transit connection to the Dallas-Ft. Worth Airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

EL PASO ($689 million)

IH 10 from Loop 375 to Executive Center Blvd. This interstate facility will see the addition of new through lanes in each direction, expanding capacity from six lanes to eight lanes. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

From east of Railroad Drive Overpass at the Texas/New Mexico state line on FM 3255. Construct a non-freeway bypass. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

FORT WORTH ($2.3 billion)

SH 114 from BS 114L in Grapevine to the Dallas County line. This freeway will be reconstructed, along with its frontage roads and ramps, resulting in an 8 lane facility with frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 114 from W. College in Grapevine to Dallas County line. This facility will be constructed as a separate managed lane facility with four lanes, providing expanded capacity in the area. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 121 from SH 114 to SH 360. This freeway will be reconstructed, along with its frontage roads and ramps, resulting in an 8-lane facility with frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 121 from FM 2499 to IH 635 interchange. This freeway will be reconstructed, along with its direct connectors, frontage roads, and ramps, resulting in an upgrade from a 4-lane urban facility to a 10-lane urban facility. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 121 from IH 30 to the Johnson County line and the Tarrant County line to US 67. Construct a new 4-lane tollway on with interchanges at IH 30 and IH 20. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

DFW International Airport to Cottonbelt Railway. Construct a new rail connection. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

HOUSTON ($4.1 billion)

IH 10 from east of Beltway 8 to east of Silbur Rd., and from west of SH 6 to east of Kirkwood. Reconstruct and widen IH 10 to include 8 main lanes, 4 managed lanes and 3-lane frontage roads. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

IH 10 from Gellhorn to Mercury Dr. Widen IH 10 from 6 to 8 main lanes from and complete the IH 10/IH 610/US 90 interchange. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 2 years.

IH 45 from Medical Center Dr. to BW 8. This facility will be widened to 10 main lanes, with two 3-lane frontage roads and two HOV lanes. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

IH 45 at NASA Road 1. This facility will be improved with a 3-level interchange and NASA Road 1 bypass, including widening the frontage roads to 3 lanes in each direction. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

IH 45 from Loop 336 (South) to FM 830. This facility will be widened to 8 main lanes and two 3-lane frontage roads, including new ramps and necessary grade separations for safety and traffic flow improvements. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 249 from Willow Creek to Brown Rd. This project involves the construction of a new 6-lane freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

SH 332 at FM 523. This facility will see a new grade separation to facility the flow of traffic on this 4-lane divided roadway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 35 from Harris County line to FM 518. This project will widen the facility to a 6-lane divided freeway with improved property access. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

SH 99 from FM 767 to US 59 (South) – Segment C-1. This project will construct a new 4-lane divided freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 99 from US 290 to SH 249 – Segment F-1. This project will construct a new 4-lane divided freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 99 from Franz Rd. to US 290 and from SH 249 to IH 45. Construct a 4 lane section of rural divided roadway. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

US 290 from Bauer to W. Muescke. This roadway is being constructed as new location facility with 4 main lanes and 2-lane frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 10 years.

US 59 at FM 2919 and Isleib Rd. This project will construct new overpasses, improving traffic flow and safety. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

US 59 from FM 2090 to Community Dr. This project will widen this facility from a 4-lane rural roadway to a 6-lane urban freeway with frontage roads, ramps, and grade separations. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

US 90 at Normandy. This project constructs an interim grade separation for new location main lanes of US 59. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

US 90 from Hunting Bayou to Wallisville. This project will construct a new 6-lane urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

LUBBOCK ($268 million)

US 82 from east of Vicksburg Ave. to US 84 (Ave. Q). These funds are being used to accelerate the construction of Phase 2 of the Marsha Sharp (US 82) Freeway beginning in FY 2005. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

PHARR ($469 million)

FM 1925 from FM 2220 (Ware Rd.) to FM 2061 (McColl Rd.). This roadway will be widened from a 2-lane rural facility to a 4-lane divided urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

FM 2061 from Ridge Rd. to FM 3072. This project will improve traffic flow by adding additional through lanes, expanding the capacity from a 2-lane rural road to a 4-lane divided urban facility. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

FM 2220 from FM 1924 to FM 1925. This roadway is being widened from a 2 lane rural facility to a 4- and 6-lane urban divided freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

US 281 from SH 107 to Business US 281. This project will widen the facility to a 6-lane urban facility. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

US 83 from Showers Rd. to Business US 83/Inspiration Rd. overpass. These three projects will reconstruct this rural roadway to an urban freeway, adding necessary ramps. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

US 83 at Bicentennial overpass. This project will construct additional elevated ramps for improved access and traffic flow at this intersection. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

US 83 South to US 281 at Spur 600. Construct a new 4-lane controlled access toll facility. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

SAN ANTONIO ($1.1 billion)

IH 10 West at Loop 1604. This project will reconstruct the existing interchange, preparing it for enhanced capacity as Loop 1604 is expanded. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 4 years.

Loop 1604 from N.W. Military to Stone Oak Parkway. This roadway will be expanded from a 4-lane divided urban facility to an 8-lane urban divided facility. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 9 years.

Loop 1604 from Redland Rd. to IH 35 North. Expand an existing roadway from 4-lanes to an 8-lane expressway. New capacity along four miles of the total 9.5 miles of this project will be tolled. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 9 years.

US 281 from north of Loop 1604 to Comal County line. This roadway will be expanded from a rural facility to a 6-lane turnpike with 4-lane frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

US 281 at Loop 1604. This project will upgrade the existing interchange with direct connectors to facilitate an expanded Loop 1604. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 2 years.

US 281 from north of Loop 1604 to north of Stone Oak. This project will reconfigure the existing interchange for enhanced traffic flow. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 9 years.

SH 130 from Southwest Caldwell County line to IH 10 near Seguin. Construct 14.2 miles of 4-lane roadway with an interchange at IH 10. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

rantanamo
20 November 2004, 05:18 PM
Loop 12 from Texas Plaza to the Loop 12/IH 35 split. Widen this roadway from 6 to 8 lanes with 2 reversible HOV lanes and 2 & 3 lane frontage roads. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 9 years.

Loop 12 from W. Lawther Dr. to Goforth Dr. This roadway reconstruction improves the safety of the roadway by raising it above the floodplain. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

FM 1171 from West of US 377 to Shiloh Rd. This roadway will be expanded from a 2-lane rural facility to a 6-lane urban highway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

FM 2499 from FM 407 to IH 35E. This new roadway will provide another 4- and 6-lane urban facility to help meet the region’s capacity needs. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

FM 407 from FM 1830 to Briarhill Blvd. This roadway will be upgrade from a 2-lane rural facility to a 4-lane divided urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

SH 114 from County Line Road to FM 156. This roadway will be upgraded to a 4-lane divided rural/urban freeway with a new interchange at FM 156 to expand capacity and improve safety. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 114 from Harriet Creek to IH 35W. This roadway will be upgraded to a 4-lane divided urban freeway with frontage roads. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.

SH 161 from IH 20 to SH 183. This project will construct 6-lane frontage roads in preparation for later construction of the main lanes of this urban freeway. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 6 years.

SH 161 from north of IH 20 to Rock Island Rd. Construct 6 lanes of frontage road along the roadway. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 5 years.

Bypass for IH 35E from south of SH 183 to SP 310 (old US 75). This project involves the construction of a 6-lane new location bypass to alleviate traffic congestion on IH 35E. The use of these new funds allows this project to be accelerated by 8 years.

Construct a light rail transit connection to Dallas Love Field airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

Construct a light rail transit connection to the Dallas-Ft. Worth Airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.
Does this mean the tunnel for Love Field?
Does the Bypass for IH35 mean the Trinity Parkway?
114 Finally as a real freeway?
NWHY will get that nice redesign?

I'm too lazy to look up the previous expected dates. Anyone know what the accelerated dates would become now?

texman
20 November 2004, 05:32 PM
Construct a light rail transit connection to Dallas Love Field airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 7 years.

Construct a light rail transit connection to the Dallas-Ft. Worth Airport. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 1 year.


WOW!! Thats so awsome, so does this mean the line will open 7 years early?!

rantanamo
20 November 2004, 05:38 PM
I was thinking it would be finished by 2011 or 12, right? Doesn't that mean starting on the Victory to Love Field section immediately? Wouldn't this also mean the Deep Ellum line should be immediately accelerated as well since the fund it was going to use would become available? Should DART be making an announcement about this soon?

I'm proud that TxDOT has included light rail in their funding. They aren't the Dept of Highways. They are the Dept of Transportation.

drumguy8800
20 November 2004, 06:05 PM
Victory to Love Field could be finished by 2005? ::lost::

I think that maybe, in DART's eyes, this funding was already secured, so they promised 2011 or 2012. But in TXDOT's eyes, they were thinking almost.. 2020? So this might not be anything new. But if it is: Well, I'll wait until it's confirmed.. :)

aceplace
20 November 2004, 06:12 PM
Also, it looks like TxDOT is funding the connection from the Cottonbelt north of the airport, down to the 13th station, soutth of the international terminal.

This may almost force DART to route the DFW line directly to the 13th station, instead of along 114.

But the state is also going to fund the Las Colinas line, apparently...

We could have a seamless connection between Northeast Tarrant and downtown Dallas... what a deal.

Interestingly, many of the so-called Fort Worth projects seemed intended to make for easier commuting from eastern Tarrant county to Dallas... reinforcing the Feds decision to include Tarrant in an expanded Dallas metro area.

drumguy8800
20 November 2004, 06:14 PM
We could have a seamless connection between Northeast Tarrant and downtown Dallas... what a deal.

Two of them, even!

rantanamo
20 November 2004, 06:43 PM
This funding seems to have come out of nowhere. Wasn't DART actually counting on federal money? and not money that would accelerate construction? I'd like to know DART's take on it.

freewaytincan
21 November 2004, 01:53 AM
Well there's the confirmation. I'm most excited about the Cotton Belt conversion to commuter rail.

texman
21 November 2004, 03:05 AM
Well there's the confirmation. I'm most excited about the Cotton Belt conversion to commuter rail.

This is great and all, but where did you all read this?

freewaytincan
21 November 2004, 03:22 PM
This is great and all, but where did you all read this?

DFW International Airport to Cottonbelt Railway. Construct a new rail connection. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.

texman
21 November 2004, 05:03 PM
I know, I know, but I didn't see it in the article.

Mballar
21 November 2004, 10:02 PM
Keep in mind that the word "connection" does not necessarily mean "tunnel." I still think that federal funds are needed to tunnel to the Love Field Terminal rather than just a station on the outskirts of airport itself.

RobertB
22 November 2004, 02:12 PM
This is great and all, but where did you all read this?

DFW International Airport to Cottonbelt Railway. Construct a new rail connection. The use of these funds allows this project to be accelerated by 3 years.
But texman has a point. All the TxDOT "acceleration" plan does is speed up plans for a rail line *to* the Cotton Belt connection by three years. There's nothing in there to help put passenger trains on the Cotton Belt rails.

There are only three D/FW rail-related items on TxDOT's laundry list, and only one -- Love Field rail -- gets a significant bump. 7 years is substantial. But 3 years' progress on a route that hasn't even reached the study phase doesn't do much but... start the study phase. And the 1-year bump on the LRT to D/FW is even more of a nominal increment -- as discussed in other threads, DART isn't going to finalize the controversial north vs. south routing on Phase 3 until Phase 2 is nailed down.

But as for this thread's original subject: *Some* Love Field routing is getting a huge boost, even though overall, rail is getting the crumbs from the roadbuilders' table.

rantanamo
22 November 2004, 02:34 PM
This money is money DART didn't have before. Money is the only thing that was delaying the projects. If they are really getting this funding I think we'll all be surprised at the result. I've not seen one mention of DART's own coffers, meaning the SE line would be the real beneficiary as it could mightily be speeded up.

RobertB
22 November 2004, 02:49 PM
This money is money DART didn't have before. Money is the only thing that was delaying the projects. If they are really getting this funding I think we'll all be surprised at the result. I've not seen one mention of DART's own coffers, meaning the SE line would be the real beneficiary as it could mightily be speeded up.
What worries me is that I haven't seen any mention of *anyone's* coffers. I want to know more than what TxDOT decided to include in its press release: how much more money for each project, who it's coming from, and what strings are attached. Are these Love Field funds tied to the tunnel proposal? Is there a requirement that DART, the city, or the airport provide matching funds or risk losing them? So far, there's nothing from DART's newsroom (http://www.dart.org/newsroommain.asp?zeon=newsreleases) other than the Thanksgiving bus schedule.

Mballar
22 November 2004, 03:10 PM
Send them an email RobertB.

RobertB
22 November 2004, 03:23 PM
Send them an email RobertB.
Sent! I sent it to the "Community Affairs Representative" who gave me his card at the Victory Station opening. I'll let y'all know if he replies.

rantanamo
22 November 2004, 03:25 PM
I thought the funding source was in the original article. By DART's coffers, I mean the normal tax revenues they collect. That funding source is not going away and is different from this new money.

texman
22 November 2004, 03:29 PM
I think were the most skeptical people alive.

RobertB
22 November 2004, 03:35 PM
I think we're the most skeptical people alive.
No, only about 48% of us. :)

Mballar
22 November 2004, 03:36 PM
Lets keep in mind that just because some agency announces funds for rail (in this case TXDOT), it does not mean that DART has not already relied on that money in its projections. For example, if the FAA announces its authorization of the $3 passenger fee at Love Field next week, that won't mean that DART didn't already factor that into its current projections. It just means that the 3rd party agency is just confirming what was already expected. That's my thinking, and that's why I'm so cautious about this announcement and what it actually means for the Love Field Tunnel/underground station.

rantanamo
22 November 2004, 04:26 PM
This money was just proposed very recently, so DART couldn't have been relying on it.

Mballar
22 November 2004, 04:33 PM
This money was just proposed very recently, so DART couldn't have been relying on it.

I didn't know that. In that case. . . .?hmmm??

RobertB
22 November 2004, 04:33 PM
Just got this note back from DART Community Affairs Representative, Carlos Huerta! He's passing the information up the chain, so the response should be very interesting.

Thanks Robert, I will pass along your questions to our System Planners and get back with you as soon as I hear some answers. By all means yes, feel free to use my name on your website. I guess officially, I am the DART Community Affairs Representative assigned to the Irving/DFW area.

Take care.

For reference, here are the questions I sent to Mr. Huerta:


Thank you again for your time at the Victory Station opening. I was very happy to hear over the weekend that the just-passed Federal budget included significant funding for rail projects in North Texas. Specifically, a page on the TxDOT web site (http://www.dot.state.tx.us/txdotnews/mmprojects.htm) mentions that "a light rail transit connection to Dallas Love Field airport" will be sped up by 7 years. But that number is terribly vague. Can you give me some additional information (which I will be sure to pass on to the dallasmetropolis.com forums):

* Is the money TxDOT mentioned part of the new Federal budget?

* Was this funding already anticipated in the NE rail plans, or is it "new funding"?

* What strings are attached? Is this funding only applicable to the Love Field Tunnel option? Does it require additional matching funds from DART, the city, and the airport?

* Will this funding help ensure that the SW line is built as well?

* And of course, how much funding are we talking about, exactly? "Sped up by 7 years" doesn't imply a dollar amount.

Please let me know if I can mention your name when I post the information from your reply. Thank you very much for your time, good luck, and God bless!

Mballar
22 November 2004, 04:37 PM
Thanks for staying on top of it Robert! :)

Wineguy2000
23 November 2004, 09:16 AM
Just heard on FOX 4 that the love field dart rail has fallen through and won't be built.

Mballar
23 November 2004, 09:33 AM
Just heard on FOX 4 that the love field dart rail has fallen through and won't be built.

I'd feel sick if I believed you! :(

Mballar
23 November 2004, 09:56 AM
Now I believe you, and now, I really feel sick. :(

http://www.dallasnews.com/s/dws/news/city/dallas/stories/112304dnmetdart.d156d.html


Funding for DART tunnel to airport may be rejected
DART expects thumbs down from agency on Love Field light-rail line


11:50 PM CST on Monday, November 22, 2004


By TONY HARTZEL / The Dallas Morning News



DART officials expect the Federal Transit Administration to notify them today that a plan to build a $160 million light-rail tunnel under Love Field airport will not receive federal funding.

The decision probably crushes the city of Dallas' and DART's hopes of building a single rail line that connects the central business district, Dallas Love Field and Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport.

"All we know right now is that the staff at FTA has said it is not going to be recommended. From what we understand, it's a matter of getting a letter from the agency," said DART board member Linda Koop of Dallas, who led the board's effort to bring a rail station under the Love Field terminal. "We are committed to serving Love Field. How that manifests itself is anyone's guess."

Once the tunnel plan is formally rejected, DART is likely to revert to its second option for Love Field service. A main light-rail line to northwest Dallas, Irving and Carrollton would run beside the airport, and a $70 million rail spur and shuttle train would drop off airport passengers at the nearest main line station.

The bad news for Love Field could be good news for communities along the rail line that want their projects open as soon as possible. The Love Field tunnel would have delayed the construction of other lines by about six months. Without it, schedules improve.

For example, the rail line to Fair Park would open by mid-2009, and rail lines should reach Carrollton and Farmers Branch by late 2010.

Dallas City Council member Sandy Greyson, who leads the council's transportation committee, said the primary reason for the Love Field tunnel rejection is the project's cost-effectiveness compared with other projects nationwide.

The Love Field option, part of DART's quest for $700 million in federal financing, would cause the total funding request to exceed the federal subsidy cutoff point of $25 per passenger.

Without the tunnel, the cost-effectiveness has been estimated at $19 to $22 per passenger.

"To have it boil down to one number is disappointing," Ms. Greyson said. "It's very disappointing to have this missed opportunity. We're going to look back on this in 20 years and regret it."

FTA officials declined to comment on the project review. DART officials expect to receive formal notice today that the project will not receive a recommended rating.

E-mail thartzel@dallasnews.com

Mballar
23 November 2004, 10:40 AM
RobertB isn't going to like this one bit!

Mballar
23 November 2004, 11:15 AM
Call me an idealist, but I just could not let the tunnel option go down the tubes without at least trying to do something. So, in what may be considered a desperate attempt to save the tunnel/terminal station, I have forwarded the following text (via email) to Councilwoman Sandy Greyson (Chair of Dallas' Transportation Committee):

I understand that DART's Love Field Tunnel project is in serious jeopardy due to lack of federal funding. As Chair of the Transportation Committee, can you tell me whether there is another push to obtain local/private funds for DART's Love Field Tunnel project. What can citizens like me (people who understand the importance of a station at the terminal) do to make this project a reality? I just don't think that a City as great as Dallas should have to settle for an option that makes little sense. Surely we can find a way. By the way, there are many others in the area who are following this issue and strongly support the tunnel option. So, if you feel that a display of citizen support will help on this issue, please let me know. Also, If you go to the following web address, you will find an ongoing discussion regarding this issue:http://forum.dallasmetropolis.com/showthread.php?t=239
Thank you in advance for your time and attention to this matter. I look forward to your response.

If anyone else is inclined to, please send a similar message to Council member Greyson and DART. At least they will know that there are people who care about the issue. Who knows, it might make a difference, and at least we can say we tried to do our part!

Thanks in advance fellow forumers.

gc
23 November 2004, 11:23 AM
^ Done

rantanamo
23 November 2004, 12:30 PM
Can't win em all

tamtagon
23 November 2004, 12:39 PM
The Love Field option, part of DART's quest for $700 million in federal financing, would cause the total funding request to exceed the federal subsidy cutoff point of $25 per passenger.

Without the tunnel, the cost-effectiveness has been estimated at $19 to $22 per passenger.


I believe a light rail train station at a busy airport is the type of project which must not be judged by the same cost-effectiveness criteria. The nature and purpose of any intermodal station preclude it from the same scrutiny as a park and ride station. A destructive lack of vision and anemic grasp of the overall benefit to the community infiltrate a decision which fails to realize that some things are worth the extra cost.

palchik
23 November 2004, 12:53 PM
This isnt the end of the world...its possible to create a very similar level of service from a station adjacent to the terminal as one underneath it. While an underground station would have escalators, an adjacent station could have a moving sidewalk...the end result is comperable.

rantanamo
23 November 2004, 01:04 PM
I think they wanted it underground because it will require more maneuvering to get in at ground level. 6 month delay? I'm sorry, but I want to curse. If you can't wait 6 months for something you are @#$@#$@#$ spoiled rotten.

RobertB
23 November 2004, 01:07 PM
I believe a light rail train station at a busy airport is the type of project which must not be judged by the same cost-effectiveness criteria. The nature and purpose of any intermodal station preclude it from the same scrutiny as a park and ride station. A destructive lack of vision and anemic grasp of the overall benefit to the community infiltrate a decision which fails to realize that some things are worth the extra cost.
On the other hand, I don't want DART to be in jeapordy ten or twenty years down the line, when it's time to start replacing aging first-generation rail cars... but the debt service on the tunnel, combined with uncertain future federal funding, makes it impossible to keep Dallas' LRT system as the jewel of the Southwest.

Looking on the bright side: as long as the Feds were set to pony up for the tunnel project, there wasn't really any reason for the other major players to contribute more than the minimum amount required to meed the Feds' requirements. Now that Uncle Sam has said no, the other affected groups can start getting serious. Will a direct LRT connection to downtown bring more passengers to Southwest Airlines? If so, then Herb & Co. should help build the tunnel. Does the city consider it a "signature" project? A Love Field subway might not be as visible as a 30-story bridge over a wide creek, but it's a lot more functional for the cost.

In my younger days, I used to draw lines on maps and wonder why nobody had built that highway yet. Now, I know that each line on the map represents millions of dollars, hundreds of residents, and scores of years paying for that penstroke. While the Love Field tunnel may have looked nice on the map, there's a real possibility that it's not the right choice for this moment in time. I can accept that... as long as I feel that DART and other forward-looking agencies are truly planning for the future. I still have that feeling, and by continuing to let DART and the region's leaders know we're still behind them (and watching them), we can keep that feeling alive.

tamtagon
23 November 2004, 01:16 PM
Now it appears that the state is going to pay for most of the station, I'm doubtful that the state's contribution would offset the cost per passenger much, but at least there's that.

If a station adjacent to the terminal rather than underneath the terminal will provide the same level of train-to-plane convenience at a lower cost, then that's what should happen. Perhaps this would be better for the airport anyway, that is to essentially have two points of entry into the terminal: one for those leaving a car at the airport (the existing point of entry); and a new point of entry for those being dropped off. The DART station would include an interface to the airport's passenger drop-off/pick-up with all the regular baggage service, boarding pass and security checks - connected to the gate areas by an elevated quick-moving sidewalk/ and/or tram with panaromic views of Dallas.

Hum, in fact, I'm kind liking an indirect DART Love Field station more and more....

texman
23 November 2004, 01:54 PM
They wanna do the whole spur line wih shuttle trains..what a hassle, you would have to connect atleast twice from the blue, red lines. Not a good idea. 30 years from now DART is going to wonder why they didn't do the tunnel option. Like tamtagon said, this shouldnt be about cost effectivness, it should be about the wellfare of the Dallas and the connection of DFW to love field.

texman
23 November 2004, 01:58 PM
The DART station would include an interface to the airport's passenger drop-off/pick-up with all the regular baggage service, boarding pass and security checks - connected to the gate areas by an elevated quick-moving sidewalk/ and/or tram with panaromic views of Dallas.

Hum, in fact, I'm kind liking an indirect DART Love Field station more and more....

Thats a great idea but in order for people to actually ride this it wouldhave to be a walkway, none of this tram buisness (unless you mean like "people mover system," not a bus with tires).

Mballar
23 November 2004, 02:05 PM
Now it appears that the state is going to pay for most of the station, I'm doubtful that the state's contribution would offset the cost per passenger much, but at least there's that.

If a station adjacent to the terminal rather than underneath the terminal will provide the same level of train-to-plane convenience at a lower cost, then that's what should happen. Perhaps this would be better for the airport anyway, that is to essentially have two points of entry into the terminal: one for those leaving a car at the airport (the existing point of entry); and a new point of entry for those being dropped off. The DART station would include an interface to the airport's passenger drop-off/pick-up with all the regular baggage service, boarding pass and security checks - connected to the gate areas by an elevated quick-moving sidewalk/ and/or tram with panaromic views of Dallas.

Hum, in fact, I'm kind liking an indirect DART Love Field station more and more....

I think we should stop saying "adjacent to the terminal." That's only going to confuse people. The current alternative does not provide for a staion with such proximity to the terminal. The station will be away from the terminal, on the otherside of the westside runways on Denton Drive. Please see the following links:

http://www.dart.org/nweis/nwcorridoreis5d.htm
http://www.dart.org/nweis/nwcorridoreis5c.htm

These images clearly show that the station will be nowhere near the terminal (can someone post the images from these links? I don't know how).

As for a connection from the terminal to the Brookhollow Station, I think that it's impractical, and I don't know how it's going to work. Aside from the fact that there will have to be some link between the two, how will it work? It can't be some walkway, as some have suggested, because what are you going to do? . . . tunnel a walkway under the runway? I seriously doubt that. . . It's obvious there is no money for tunneling. Same thing for some connecting tram. The only thing I can think of is a shuttlebus between the two, and that is just plain inconvienient.

Another thing is that the Brookhollow Station is right next to (in front of) Southwest's Headquarters. How is that going to work, with traffic going in and out of Southwest's parking lots and shuttle buses transporting passengers between the terminal and the station. Just seems like its going to be too much clutter.

freewaytincan
23 November 2004, 02:05 PM
Keep in mind: they can get the station very close. After that, all you need is a walkway, an airbridge or something. Not only would that be more cost effective, but honestly, it'd be kind of cool.

drumguy8800
23 November 2004, 02:11 PM
Funding for DART tunnel to airport may be rejected

DART expects thumbs down from agency on Love Field light-rail line

11:50 PM CST on Monday, November 22, 2004
By TONY HARTZEL / The Dallas Morning News

DART officials expect the Federal Transit Administration to notify them today that a plan to build a $160 million light-rail tunnel under Love Field airport will not receive federal funding.

The decision probably crushes the city of Dallas' and DART's hopes of building a single rail line that connects the central business district, Dallas Love Field and Dallas/Fort Worth International Airport.

"All we know right now is that the staff at FTA has said it is not going to be recommended. From what we understand, it's a matter of getting a letter from the agency," said DART board member Linda Koop of Dallas, who led the board's effort to bring a rail station under the Love Field terminal. "We are committed to serving Love Field. How that manifests itself is anyone's guess."

Once the tunnel plan is formally rejected, DART is likely to revert to its second option for Love Field service. A main light-rail line to northwest Dallas, Irving and Carrollton would run beside the airport, and a $70 million rail spur and shuttle train would drop off airport passengers at the nearest main line station.

The bad news for Love Field could be good news for communities along the rail line that want their projects open as soon as possible. The Love Field tunnel would have delayed the construction of other lines by about six months. Without it, schedules improve.

For example, the rail line to Fair Park would open by mid-2009, and rail lines should reach Carrollton and Farmers Branch by late 2010.

Dallas City Council member Sandy Greyson, who leads the council's transportation committee, said the primary reason for the Love Field tunnel rejection is the project's cost-effectiveness compared with other projects nationwide.

The Love Field option, part of DART's quest for $700 million in federal financing, would cause the total funding request to exceed the federal subsidy cutoff point of $25 per passenger.

Without the tunnel, the cost-effectiveness has been estimated at $19 to $22 per passenger.

"To have it boil down to one number is disappointing," Ms. Greyson said. "It's very disappointing to have this missed opportunity. We're going to look back on this in 20 years and regret it."

FTA officials declined to comment on the project review. DART officials expect to receive formal notice today that the project will not receive a recommended rating.

E-mail thartzel@dallasnews.com

drumguy8800
23 November 2004, 02:12 PM
There ya have it. I'd say if they're making this public, they are 99% sure it's cutting around the airport.

freewaytincan
23 November 2004, 02:16 PM
"To have it boil down to one number is disappointing," Ms. Greyson said. "It's very disappointing to have this missed opportunity. We're going to look back on this in 20 years and regret it."

I, too, am disappointed, and I believe it shows that they're simply not looking to the future, but has anyone considered the fact that it will be possible to build this station in the future? It's not as if they're going to build something else underneath Love.

drumguy8800
23 November 2004, 02:20 PM
I actually wouldn't mind it - and it might make for a cooler commute. Get off the train, and.. next platform over is another set of trains. But then again, emerging into the terminal building or following the "To Trains - Below Surface" signs would be a lot cooler, I think.

texman
23 November 2004, 02:21 PM
I think we should stop saying "adjacent to the terminal." That's only going to confuse people. The current alternative does not provide for a staion with such proximity to the terminal. The station will be away from the terminal, on the otherside of the westside runways on Denton Drive. Please see the following links:

http://www.dart.org/nweis/nwcorridoreis5d.htm
http://www.dart.org/nweis/nwcorridoreis5c.htm

These images clearly show that the station will be nowhere near the terminal (can someone post the images from these links? I don't know how).

As for a connection from the terminal to the Brookhollow Station, I think that it's impractical, and I don't know how it's going to work. Aside from the fact that there will have to be some link between the two, how will it work? It can't be some walkway, as some have suggested, because what are you going to do? . . . tunnel a walkway under the runway? I seriously doubt that. . . It's obvious there is no money for tunneling. Same thing for some connecting tram. The only thing I can think of is a shuttlebus between the two, and that is just plain inconvienient.

Another thing is that the Brookhollow Station is right next to (in front of) Southwest's Headquarters. How is that going to work, with traffic going in and out of Southwest's parking lots and shuttle buses transporting passengers between the terminal and the station. Just seems like its going to be too much clutter.


Im sure if they cant get the tunnel, their going to be changing some station locations in the next couple days and expect them to go all out on them. I say screw Inwood Station and have a Mockingboird Station right next to the Airport so they can have a skybridge or whatever.

Mballar
23 November 2004, 02:23 PM
Keep in mind: they can get the station very close. After that, all you need is a walkway, an airbridge or something. Not only would that be more cost effective, but honestly, it'd be kind of cool.

Yeah. . .there is a smart idea. . . an "airbridge" over a runway. . . . NOT!

will someone (drumguy maybe) please post the graphics from the link in post 141 so everyone can see what I'm talking about.

RobertB
23 November 2004, 02:28 PM
Just for consideration... did you realize that even without the tunnel, DART plans to run the line 40 feet below Mockingbird Lane? It looks like this is designed in part to accomodate a freight spur (one of several highly complex maneuvers the LRT makes to accomodate freight), but it does seem to keep open the possibility of a future tunnel connection using the originally planned route.

I've attached screen scrapes of the engineering drawings (FEIS Appendix C (http://www.dart.org/nweis/nwfeistoc.htm), if you want the originals), along with the pix R. Mbala referenced.

Mballar
23 November 2004, 02:35 PM
Im sure if they cant get the tunnel, their going to be changing some station locations in the next couple days and expect them to go all out on them. I say screw Inwood Station and have a Mockingboird Station right next to the Airport so they can have a skybridge or whatever.


Sorry kid. . . these designs have already been submitted to the feds for approval. The process is very strict, and at this point it is too late to submit another design. That's why DART submitted both designs at the same time. They realized that they wouldn't get a second bite at the apple, so to speak.