Ross Avenue & 75

[urbanite07]

I'm real dissapointed iin what I just saw at the corner of Ross and the access road. Apparently that white shack which used to be a used car lot has been painted caca color brown and they've hoisted a large sign "BAD LOANS - 214 ..." So basically one dump leaves another dump enters.

So much for improving Ross Avenue .. and what's really sad is this dump is the first thing you'll see coming into Ross from the Arts District.

Ohh well.. maybe someday things will improve over here.

:mad:

[UrbanHope]

^ got a pic to post?

[chicago_transplant]

With the area as it is, there is a demand for businesses such as those. You'll see those pushed out in a year or two as the car lots fade, the economy strengthens and building (residential) improves. New construction, of course, is contingent upon the citizens of the neighborhood allowing buildings taller than 34' to go up - otherwise they'll never hit the critical mass that is a requisite for such a massive project that Ross Avenue will be.

[CasperITL]

Historically, that section of town has been full of pawn brokers, loan sharks etc since the Civil War. Back when Central was a railroad track, that was officially the beginning of the wrong side of the tracks.

[urbanite07]

Historically, that section of town has been full of pawn brokers, loan sharks etc since the Civil War. Back when Central was a railroad track, that was officially the beginning of the wrong side of the tracks.

So where is Angela Hunt now? All the talk of improving Ross and the surrounding area is appearing to be just that, talk.

[MDE]

Improving anything takes money and it's been over a year since banks practically quit making commercial loans . The other shoe is about to drop and many regional/community banks will begin failing as the commercial loans they made in the past go bad from lack of refinancing. Not sure what Angela Hunt can do about that.

btw, a gas station at Forest and Central just became a car title/payday loan business.

I hate to see these types of businesses also, but no doubt the timing of the investors backing them is excellent. They ought to do a brisk business given tough, new consumer credit lending standards and the high unemployment rate.

[CasperITL]

So where is Angela Hunt now? All the talk of improving Ross and the surrounding area is appearing to be just that, talk.

Why would anyone ever believe that the city could change Ross Ave? Many of those car lots and payday places are vibrant along Ross.

[chiboi]

I don't think vibrant is the right word - maybe succesful or busy would better describe them.

[urbanite07]

I don't think vibrant is the right word - maybe succesful or busy would better describe them.

When was the so called city mandated dead Line for all those Car lots to be out of Ross avenue? Was it end of 2010 or 2009 ?

[tamtagon]

It's foolish for the city to chase off used car dealers from Ross. It's foolish for the city to specifically cite one type of business for elimination from a specific part of town - as the repurposing of the former car lot shows.

If the city wants to actively manage gentrification - and I think it should - thoughtful management must replace management of tactics.

[vman]

When I moved to Dallas, it amazed me how all of the main eastern arteries into downtown ( Ross, Gaston, and Live Oak) have all been allowed mostly to go to crap. Gaston is the most interesting architecturally, IMO. And it (Gaston) and Live Oak both get much more attractive the more eastward you go as they both end in the lovely Lakewood/Skillman areas. Ross is by far the worst looking of the three and it's a shame that it not only flows into downtown, but the Arts District as well. I'm not sure if getting rid of the car lots were a good idea, but it certainly didn't make the street look any worse. Ross is also the best way to get from downtown to Greenville Ave and it's almost embarrrasingly rundown the entire drive from DTD. I'm all for the city rejuvenating and beautifying Ross, but unlike Gaston and Live Oak that at least has historical structures and wonderful neighborhoods attached to it, Ross just has blocks and blocks of crap. I think it's going to be really difficult to turn it around.

[tamtagon]

The businesses along any street are going to reflect the local community. Municipal attempts to change the local community through a search and destroy of very specific types of retailers will do more harm than good.

[urbanite07]

The businesses along any street are going to reflect the local community. Municipal attempts to change the local community through a search and destroy of very specific types of retailers will do more harm than good.


Can't say I agree with you .. if that were the case, then Uptown would still be a drug infested prostitute hang out as it was in the early 80's. A municipal push along with deep pocket investors are what these areas need to get cleaned up. Right now we have no city push and there is no money to clean out Ross, so I don't expect any significant change for the good for another 5 years.

[Lakewooder]

Historically, that section of town has been full of pawn brokers, loan sharks etc since the Civil War. Back when Central was a railroad track, that was officially the beginning of the wrong side of the tracks.

WRONG.

Ross Avenue was Millionaire's Row and called the "Park Avenue of Dallas". And have you forgotten about Swiss Avenue and Munger Place? Not to mention CC Slaughter's Estate. Look at the Women's Forum Building and you will see what it once was:

http://www.dougnewby.com/Architecture/Architecturally%20Significant/AlexanderMansion.asp

All before Highland Park.

[Lakewooder]

When I moved to Dallas, it amazed me how all of the main eastern arteries into downtown ( Ross, Gaston, and Live Oak) have all been allowed mostly to go to crap. Gaston is the most interesting architecturally, IMO. And it (Gaston) and Live Oak both get much more attractive the more eastward you go as they both end in the lovely Lakewood/Skillman areas. Ross is by far the worst looking of the three and it's a shame that it not only flows into downtown, but the Arts District as well. I'm not sure if getting rid of the car lots were a good idea, but it certainly didn't make the street look any worse. Ross is also the best way to get from downtown to Greenville Ave and it's almost embarrrasingly rundown the entire drive from DTD. I'm all for the city rejuvenating and beautifying Ross, but unlike Gaston and Live Oak that at least has historical structures and wonderful neighborhoods attached to it, Ross just has blocks and blocks of crap. I think it's going to be really difficult to turn it around.

Agreed. Huge mistake with Ross Avenue. Angela Hunt got so much grief when she started to oust the businesses which originally brought it down in the 20s - may have been good business owners especially compared to the rest but when you put it into context they eventually reaped what they sowed.

Ross Ave revitalization will unite Henderson Avenue and Lower Greenville to the Arts District.

[dfwcre8tive]

I think Ross would be a good candidate for serious streetscape improvements. Rebuild the street to include wide sidewalks and a streetcar line connecting downtown and the Arts District to Henderson or Greenville Ave. That would do more for the area than eradicating certain businesses; it would make the avenue more desirable for dense residential/retail developements without the need for huge parking structures.

[Mballar]

I think Ross would be a good candidate for serious streetscape improvements. Rebuild the street to include wide sidewalks and a streetcar line connecting downtown and the Arts District to Henderson or Greenville Ave. That would do more for the area than eradicating certain businesses; it would make the avenue more desirable for dense residential/retail developements without the need for huge parking structures.
Ross would definitely be a GREAT Smart streets project!

[CasperITL]

WRONG.

Ross Avenue was Millionaire's Row and called the "Park Avenue of Dallas". And have you forgotten about Swiss Avenue and Munger Place? Not to mention CC Slaughter's Estate. Look at the Women's Forum Building and you will see what it once was:

http://www.dougnewby.com/Architecture/Architecturally%20Significant/AlexanderMansion.asp

All before Highland Park.

Not between Pearl and Haskell. That had always been a section of town full of pawn shops, money changers etc. Always. When the train ran up HTC that was a virtual slum. Just north of there were a string of freedmans shanty towns and hispanics.

[Mballar]

WRONG.

Ross Avenue was Millionaire's Row and called the "Park Avenue of Dallas". And have you forgotten about Swiss Avenue and Munger Place? Not to mention CC Slaughter's Estate. Look at the Women's Forum Building and you will see what it once was:

http://www.dougnewby.com/Architecture/Architecturally%20Significant/AlexanderMansion.asp

All before Highland Park.
I was hoping you'd pass through and provide a historical perspective on this topic. We've been missing your invaluable insight, here, lately LW. Please keep blessing the DFWUF members with your vast knowledge of Dallas history. We need that history to keep things in perspective.

[carousel]

When I moved to Dallas, it amazed me how all of the main eastern arteries into downtown ( Ross, Gaston, and Live Oak) have all been allowed mostly to go to crap. Gaston is the most interesting architecturally, IMO. And it (Gaston) and Live Oak both get much more attractive the more eastward you go as they both end in the lovely Lakewood/Skillman areas. Ross is by far the worst looking of the three and it's a shame that it not only flows into downtown, but the Arts District as well. I'm not sure if getting rid of the car lots were a good idea, but it certainly didn't make the street look any worse. Ross is also the best way to get from downtown to Greenville Ave and it's almost embarrrasingly rundown the entire drive from DTD. I'm all for the city rejuvenating and beautifying Ross, but unlike Gaston and Live Oak that at least has historical structures and wonderful neighborhoods attached to it, Ross just has blocks and blocks of crap. I think it's going to be really difficult to turn it around.

The residential/townhome development on the wester section of Ross is a step in the right direction. I can only imagine that when the Arts District gets into the full swing of things developers will be jumping at the opportunity to do something on Ross.

[dfwcre8tive]

Dallas neighbors with improvement plans receive grants
06:50 AM CST on Monday, November 2, 2009
By NANCY VISSER / The Dallas Morning News
nvisser@dallasnews.com
http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/dn/latestnews/stories/110209dnmetcommunitygrant.4113b0c.html

The East Dallas gateway to the city's sparkling Arts District is a dark, grungy underpass on Ross Avenue, where 12 lanes of highway interchange cover a bleak stretch of dirt, weeds, concrete and trash.

It's ugly but easy to ignore if you're driving through the intersection. It's downright scary if you're walking through it. And it's nerve-racking on a bike.

Now the little neighborhood of Bryan Place plans to take on that gateway as a beautification project with the help of a $10,000 "Loving My Community" grant from the city. The grant was one of 12 awarded last month in a new city program that encourages neighborhood groups to target specific needs in their communities.

While the Ross Avenue project could never rival the $105 million park under construction to link Uptown to the Arts District, other groups are jumping on board to make it happen. At a minimum, it would involve cleaning up and landscaping the underpass and could include adding public art and lighting.

David Allen, a board member for the Bryan Place Homeowners Association, proposed the project when he learned that the city was implementing a new grant program.

"I knew that the Performing Arts Center was getting ready to open, and I just thought that this would just be great for everyone in East Dallas to be able to walk there," he said. "I walk my dog over there all the time and have to walk through debris. It didn't feel safe even with my dog."

He and other members of the Bryan Place association pulled the grant application together. Allen said the nearby Fellowship and St. Paul United Methodist churches have offered volunteer labor from their youth groups. Several condominium associations and Bryan Place residents have donated money.

The Downtown Dallas association also is looking into what it can do. "We work with people to make the gateways into downtown more appealing," said Jim Wood, the planning, transportation and development director for Downtown Dallas.

He said the association will look at what kind of landscaping, lighting and artwork could be added. The sidewalks are in good shape, he said. "We're working together on doing some planning. We'll probably put in $10,000 to match that grant," he said.

Organizers are also researching whether the city has $250,000 in bond money for public art at the underpass. Wood said he believes the money was available a few years ago, but the project was dropped because of concerns that vibrations from traffic would cause problems.

Allen said the city recently added count-down crosswalk signs and will re-stripe the streets once the rain lets up.

In the meantime, he has to submit a project schedule to the city this week, and he hopes to hold the kickoff cleanup sometime this month.

...

[hamiltonpl]

WRONG.

Ross Avenue was Millionaire's Row and called the "Park Avenue of Dallas". And have you forgotten about Swiss Avenue and Munger Place? Not to mention CC Slaughter's Estate. Look at the Women's Forum Building and you will see what it once was:

http://www.dougnewby.com/Architecture/Architecturally%20Significant/AlexanderMansion.asp

All before Highland Park.

As I understand it, the homes on Ross Ave. were once as grand as the Belo Mansion. It's a terrible thing that Dallas allowed those homes to go down only to be replaced by car lots. Do you know what city planners were thinking at the time? There had to be a good reason. (I hope).

[TexasStar]

As I understand it, the homes on Ross Ave. were once as grand as the Belo Mansion. It's a terrible thing that Dallas allowed those homes to go down only to be replaced by car lots. Do you know what city planners were thinking at the time? There had to be a good reason. (I hope).

Were they the same city planners who thought it was a good idea to eliminate street cars in favor of gas-powered buses? Nope, no good reason necessary.

[GennadyB]

I'm sorry, but $10,000 is a joke. Even with another $10,000 match and free labor you will not have enough funds to do anything significant.

[lakewoodhobo]

Were they the same city planners who thought it was a good idea to eliminate street cars in favor of gas-powered buses? Nope, no good reason necessary.

Most people understand that cars and buses made sense at that time. Nobody cared about the implications to the environment or that we were becoming addicted to oil and enriching our enemies. Very few cities had the foresight to keep streetcars online (even San Francisco, to my knowledge, almost got rid of its famous cable cars).

Streetcars were not always reliable either. Here is an interesting article about how expensive and dangerous it was to run streetcars in Austin before they were replaced by buses (if nothing else, read the last sentence):

http://www.austinchronicle.com/gyrobase/Issue/story?oid=oid:77996

[Lakewooder]

From what I understand, a lot of the destruction of homes and 'planning' was in response to Victorian styles going out..clean lines of Prairie and Craftsman styles were coming in..so in that respect it was very "Dallas" to tear them down.
Later the Tudors were starting to be replaced by the Ranch styles, then we all know about the amorphous McMansions...

However, it was really not limited to Dallas - there's a line in "Mildred Pierce" (1945) where she wants to renovate an old Pasadena mansion by "taking down some of that Gingerbread".

How many Victorian homes are left in Dallas?

[gshelton91]

even if they just power wash it and paint it it will be a huge improvement. with lighting and the right paint this could be a much better experience. --- but i agree that would require more then $10K

[citizen]

even if they just power wash it and paint it it will be a huge improvement. with lighting and the right paint this could be a much better experience. --- but i agree that would require more then $10K

I think that they will end up with closer to 30K after they get some additional contributions - added to a lot of volunteer effort and elbow grease and then some follow-up to keep the trash away it could become much better; and then hopefully someone will come up with a plan to spend some more and then some more and then some more - and one day we may even forget about the road above - dreaming - but it can only go uphill from where it is and I applaud the efforts of those in the neighborhood.

[CasperITL]

How many Victorian homes are left in Dallas?

Like actual Victorian(pre-1901) period homes? I have not checked recently but I think there are only a handful of Victorian-Victorian era homes left in Dallas. Most were clustered north of the present day Cedars Station. I think there are really just a few left. Maybe 4-5. Roughly east of old City Park and west of South Blvd. Once you get to South Blvd you run into homes built 1910-1925. Kind of like peeling back rings of a tree, closer you get to downtown, the potential to find an older house still standing exists.

[MDE]

Kind of like peeling back rings of a tree, closer you get to downtown, the potential to find an older house still standing exists.
Dang. Just a half hour ago while on the phone with my mother I made the same reference to the ages of houses and the rings of a tree.

[SDORN]

Ross Ave need massive cleanup.

[gshelton91]

Not that anyone cares --- but my idea for the underpass would be this

1. powerwash everything -- Paint everything white
2. fill the space between the beams with foam insulation (reduce noise and bird roosting)
3. run LED lights along the beams that cross Ross Ave. Let people on the Internet create cool sequences for the lights
4 Fix the pedestrian connections apply plenty of light & Landscaping where possible
5. paint the columns some cool color like that green that the Nasher uses...

but all that probably cost more then $30K

[GennadyB]

How about just paving the whole thing into parking and lighting it up? Similar to several spots under the Woodall Rodgers. I know this parking would be used for Sunset Lounge on the weekends, and in the future might get more use if the area develops more.

[kozzy]

I was passing under 75 on Ross today and noticed alot of what appears to be metallic rusted beams which seem to be supporting the pillars holding up the old portion of the freeway. Are those there for reinforcement to the original bridge? If so, I think that's a bit scary.

[AeroD]

http://eastdallasblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2010/10/new-murals-adorn-ross-avenue-u.html

[dfwcre8tive]

^ I think the mural looks a bit out of place leading to the Arts District. It's more in line with the work going on in Deep Ellum. Despite that, improved lighting is definitely needed everywhere under the elevated freeway. I wish they could find a way to restore/re-light all the fixtures on the underside of the elevated structure. Or, at least install standard pedestrian lights along the sidewalks.

[vman]

[QUOTE=DFWCRE8TIVE]^ I think the mural looks a bit out of place leading to the Arts District. [QUOTE]

Totally agree. I don't dislike it, just don't like it here. And are there more inventive ways to dress up the underpasses than with just murals?

[chicago_transplant]

Did anyone notice the sign go up in the lot next to Walgreen's on Ross? It's for a CAR WASH. Says something like "See our other locations in Allen & Plano!" LOL Like that's the type of business you want in an urban, walkable area. I guess there is no real change on Ross.

[Anthony]

There's a car wash across the street from Walgreen's!

[MDE]

Did anyone notice the sign go up in the lot next to Walgreen's on Ross? It's for a CAR WASH. Says something like "See our other locations in Allen & Plano!" LOL Like that's the type of business you want in an urban, walkable area. I guess there is no real change on Ross.

You wanted a shoe store?

[urbanite07]

The sign has been up for several months now .. I doubt they will build anything there, especially a car wash.

[Anthony]

I don't think this requires an entirely new thread, but down over at Haskell Ave. and Delano (two blocks north of Ross) there has been a lot of trees uprooted. Supposedly a Goodwill store according to a worker. That doesn't make sense to me, there's already one at Ross and Greenville.

[allenapple]

I noticed they fenced off the entire block at Ross and Hall street and put up signs that say 1707 North Hall. Anyone know what is going on?

[MDE]

Ask these people:


JLB Partners, LP, is a national developer, builder and manager of Class A multi-family assets in select markets of the United States. With a history of successful developments and a depth of industry specific experience, the principals of JLB have worked together for over 15 years and continue to create properties with well thought out designs in core markets.

http://www.jlbpartners.com/corporate/about

Looks like a 10-unit building:
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071058 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2000000 44432 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071053 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2100000 41850 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071056 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 1950000 43828 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071059 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 1700000 39253 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071060 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2750000 61136 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071061 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 4200000 209290 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071052 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2735000 63092 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071055 09/10/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2500000 55440 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071054 09/11/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2500000 56956 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING
Building Multi Family (A) New Construction 0807071057 09/11/08 1707 N HALL ST 45-H JLB BUILDERS LLC /214/276-6845 /909 LAKE CAROLSN PKWY #960, IRVING, TX 75039 2360000 52124 1113-NEW CONSTRUCTION MULTI-FAMILY DWELLING

http://www.dallascityhall.com/building_inspection/co_permits/PermitsSep2008.html

[chicago_transplant]

From a story about the new complex in the West VIllage, next to the Marquis:

"JLB of Irving is a nationwide developer of apartment homes.

Just east of downtown Dallas on Ross Avenue at Hall Street, JLB has already broken ground on another apartment community with 372 units in four-story buildings."

http://www.dallasnews.com/sharedcontent/dws/classifieds/news/homecenter/realestate/stories/DN-cityplace_28bus.ART.State.Edition1.7d87ac.html

[jrd1964]

http://eastdallasblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/03/finalists-named-for-ross-avenu.html

(for some strange reason, I get errors when trying to post the story text....3 out-of-Dallas artists are the finalists for an almost-$113,000 outlay for artwork and lighting at US 75/Ross)

[skys the limit]

http://eastdallasblog.dallasnews.com/archives/2011/03/finalists-named-for-ross-avenu.html

(for some strange reason, I get errors when trying to post the story text....3 out-of-Dallas artists are the finalists for an almost-$113,000 outlay for artwork and lighting at US 75/Ross)


This is really wonderful news to help beautify that very important link into the Downtown Dallas Arts Distrct.

Great find!

[Ersatz]

There's $113,000.00 that needs to be cut from the budget big time! Let them extract the money from wealthy patrons of art rather than steal it from taxpayers. Not a single artist is local on top of it. What an extravagant scam use of taxpayers money. That could pay for a policeman to patrol the area for a couple of years. That would stop the graffiti! And I thought all the artsy types thought graffiti was really expressionist urban art anyway. This needs to be stopped.

[mjblazin]

I'd guess the money was in the 2010 budget and is already "spent." We won't get it back if they did not award it.

[urbanite07]

I'd guess the money was in the 2010 budget and is already "spent." We won't get it back if they did not award it.

That's correct, the money was already appropriated in the budget, so yes, it's a "spend it or loose it" thing .. can't transfer it to another cause, no matter how worthy.