DTD: Gulf States Bldg. + 1414 Elm + Third Rail Lofts (1407 Main)(16 ST.)

[tamtagon]

Someone (read: Drummy) merge them.

Ya, Drummy, merge them thread.

[msutton]

that's an awesome rendering.

[shawndb]

The funny thing about the rendering however, is that the top 2 floors of The Davis Building is gone as well as the 2-3 story cupola. I think they did that to make the buildings look similar in height, but I believe The Davis Building will still be taller than the new tower.

[Tnekster]

Can we merge these threads?

[crescentboi]

Here's a view from Elm today. Not too much is happening yet to the part of the building facing Elm.

[crescentboi]

Here's another pic from yesterday this time from the roof of the Davis.

[gc]

Nice pic. Did someone here say that they cleaned the facade and starting installing the windows? It is starting to look a lot better...imo.

[Tnekster]

^It does look better from that shot. I am going down to Iron Cactus in about an hour and will get a better look at it.

[msutton]

Yah it does seem quite a difference, and that's even the side that will be least prominent.

[drumguy8800]

Pictures of a cleaned up Gulf States.. + Davis Lot hole.

<img src='http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav1t.jpg' style='border: 1px solid #000000;'> (http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav1l.jpg) <img src='http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav2t.jpg' style='border: 1px solid #000000;'> (http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav2l.jpg) <img src='http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav3t.jpg' style='border: 1px solid #000000;'> (http://xvisionx.no-ip.info/docs/forum/dav3l.jpg)

[freewaytincan]

Crazy. When were you there? I took pictures of the hole at about 8.00 PM.

[crescentboi]

From today....

[freewaytincan]

That is an odd patter they have blocked off on the side of the building there. How exactly will the buildings connect, because I'm really confused on that end.

I really hope they put a good bookstore on the ground floor there.

[shawndb]

That concrete "pattern" that you see already exsisted from an older building that connected to The Gulf States Building.
I have noticed that they removed all the windows and now have replaced most of them. The new/cleaned windows have a lighter color frame. You can still see the older windows in place towards the bottom of the building. I'm curious if that's not the level up to which the two buildings will be connected. Comparing the rendering and the photos it looks as though they have already replaced all the windows that in the end will be showing. So all the dark colored windows will be covered up or removed completely. (Just a guess)

[freewaytincan]

Probably another obvious question, but is that hideous structure behind Gulf States a parking garage? And if so, what are they doing with it?

[Jack Flack]

Isn't that an old department store that too will be converted to apartments as part of this project?

[shawndb]

You are correct. It is an old department store that will be converted into apartments as well. Of course they will have to add some windos to it.

[Jack Flack]

I have really been curious to see what is done to that building. It could be a cool little building to live in.

[Lakewooder]

"Hideous" I don't think I've heard that word much since I was near and not dear to SMU sorority rush...

Clipper what was that dept. store, E.M. Kahn?

[US75Guy]

So will the new building include a parking garage, or is this entire complex going to use the old Metropolitan Garage? I'm anxious to see what the new building (1407 Main) is going to look like from the Elm Street side. ObviouslI want retail or something interesting at ground level on that side as well. Maybe that is where a new parking garage will be more evident.

[shawndb]

It's my understanding that part of the new structure will be a parking garage. Originally I thought it would be just above the retail on main street. Maybe it will be on the Elm Street side of the new structure, with retail and apartments facing main street.

[jsoto3]

In the rendering the entire base, excluding the ground floor, appears to be parking garage with no residential units facing Main St. It appears to be residential only from the top of the base up (in the tower).

[moopinator]

They have installed most of the windows on the Akard Street. They have covered the windows in plastic again. I have renamed the project The Suran Wrap Building. :D

[D_in_DownTown_D]

I waited on the project architects for both the Gulf States building. I was able to chit chat with them for a couple minutes, but since they were in my restaurant during lunch rush, I wasn't able to get much info. Appearantly, the garage for the gulf states bldg is located to the rear, facing Elm.

[Tnekster]

^Did they say anything about when they would actually begin work on the new tower. Seems like it is moving slow.

[D_in_DownTown_D]

Nah, I was able to talk for a couple minutes. Wish I had more time.

[carousel]

Seems like construction has stopped next door.

[slfunk]

It hasn't. They removed the old foundation of the building that was demolished sometime ago. They have been filling in the site with new fil that will suport the new building. To honest I am little surprised they did not go underground for some of the parking, but sure that was an expense issue.

[slfunk]

^Did they say anything about when they would actually begin work on the new tower. Seems like it is moving slow.

It has been moving slow but refer to my previous post. If you go around now you will see some water tanks and new fill...etc. Foundations take the longest. Second longest part will be the concrete work for the parking garage due to higher performing concrete. The building will come together pretty quickly after that.

[carousel]

I thought the hole would be a little deeper.

[slfunk]

I thought the hole would be a little deeper.

I don't think they are going to be digging a hole. They are filling in the site and compacting the soil to support the foundation for the future building.

[moopinator]

I sit and watch the progress on the building all day everyday. If the progress seems slow its because there is no method to their madness. I'll be so glad when they finish, if ever. Its an eye sore from my vantage point combined with the noise. If they spent less time attempting to "Saran Wrap" the windows (only for the plastic to fall down or for the workers to tear it for air), and more time on the building itself there would be more done.

[Tnekster]

What are they doing in there behind all that plastic. Is it still asbestos?

[US75Guy]

Not sure what's happening behind the plastic (the mind reels at the possibilities), but they have been busy on the outside of the building. For the past month they have been methodically washing the exterior brick; replacing mortar and grout; rewashing with highpwered water jets. They worked on the west side of the building first, then over to the east side, and are currently working on the north side.

It used to be very obvious where the addtion to the building started (the upper seven floors were added later) by the change in brick material. But with the cleansed walls, that demarcation line has been washed away.....at least for awhile.

[moopinator]

The power washing has been amusing to witness. The workers like to power wash themselves and play with the lifts on the side of the building. They also like to wash the cars below on Akard. Also, if you look at the photos, the plastic wrap is only on the Akard Street side of the building.

[shawndb]

I don't think anyone as posted a picture of the original building. I didn't realize that they had added more floors to this building until US75Guy had mentioned it. See the comparison for yourself.

[moopinator]

Here's a pic of the Ugly Building facing Elm Street. Also, since I whined on here the other day about the mess on top of this building, its been cleaned up. YA!!!! :angel:

[barrycb]

Well they are under way! Here's a pic from today. A friend of mine in the Davis has set up a video camera in his window to film everything time lapse, so that'll be good to check out later.

Is this still in use? Not much to see so far, but the next 6 months should be pretty cool.

[BigD5349]

Here's a pic of the Ugly Building facing Elm Street. Also, since I whined on here the other day about the mess on top of this building, its been cleaned up. YA!!!! :angel:

The "ugly building" facing Elm was a department store called The Mayfair, in case anyone was wondering...

[TexasStar]

I don't think anyone as posted a picture of the original building. I didn't realize that they had added more floors to this building until US75Guy had mentioned it. See the comparison for yourself.

What was the large building to the left in the old pic?
Doesn't appear to be The Davis.

[BigD5349]

What was the large building to the left in the old pic?
Doesn't appear to be The Davis.

If you mean the building that used to be between the Gulf States Bldg and The Davis, it was The First National Bank. See the attached photo.

[moopinator]

The "ugly building" facing Elm was a department store called The Mayfair, in case anyone was wondering...

Danka! I wondered what it was or used to be!

I haven't seen what they have been doing of late but whatever it is involves what sounds like a jack hammer. It sounds like its coming from directly below on Akard but there is no work being done on the ground. Its hard to tell sometimes because noise echos off the buildings.

[rantanamo]

Inside's opinion on this project?

[clipper]

The old First National Bank Building - later Metropolitan Savings - was a beautiful building that was an important part of the Main Street historical area. Greedy developers knocked it down in the 80s hoping to sell the dirt for big bucks but of course that never happened. A shame.

[Columbus Civil]

Inside's opinion on this project?

Why do you want that jackass's opinion?

[texman]

Why do you want that jackass's opinion?
Because you cant trust those urban hipster's opinions anymore.

[rantanamo]

Why do you want that jackass's opinion?

Just curious. We always get comments about what isn't gonna work downtown, or how people won't move downtown, or how they are stupid to move downtown. Just interesting that we never see Inside on the Urban Development threads.

[moopinator]

New pictures of Gulf State taken today around 5 PM. I snapped these from the Kirby roof. I got a pretty good shot of the "hole' between the Davis and Gulf State Buildings.

[John T Roberts]

I told this to Ninjatune when we toured downtown a couple of weeks ago. You can almost always tell when more floors have been added to a building, even though the facade appears as one design. By the way, to have a significant amount of floors added, the building was designed originally to have them completed at a certain date. The foundations and columns have to be designed to support the extra weight of the added floors of the building. I've seen many examples of where this was a waste of money and the additional floors were never added.

Back to the issue at hand. More often than not, when an older masonry building has floors added on top some 20 years or so later, the brick will not exactly match. Look at the main facades of Gulf States and you can see where there is a slight difference in the brick on the east and south sides. Go around to the west and north (where not much was ever planned to be exposed) and you can even see more marked differences in the brick used. Another clue to vertical expansions are the window patterns don't line up with the old in the new addition. Something in the design of the interior forced a change in the windows where they don't align with the floors below. This is usually a real clear indication floors were added.

One of the better examples of this in downtown is the old Texaco building within the Dallas Power and Light complex. The base is stone and the tower section is a compatible brick with matching stone accents. The base reads as one element and the tower reads as another, but integrated design. In reality, the tower was added later.

The original, Art Deco Southwestern Bell Telephone Building was added both on top of and adjacent to over the years. If you look at old photos of downtown, the original building located at Wood and Akard, was "U" shaped and the top of the wings were located just above the two story space that reads on the easternmost wing. The east/west section of the building set back to a taller elevator overrun in the center. When the building was expanded, about 10 more floors were added on top and the building was expanded northward to Jackson Street. The new section of the building was only about 2/3 as wide as the original, but the design had additional setbacks and was done in the Moderne style. Therefore, the building does not appear to have additions. If you look carefully, you can see where the brick on the upper floors does not match the brick on the lower levels.

One more quick comment, here. The 5 story Mercantile Securities Annex on the southwest corner of Main and St. Paul was designed to have more floors added to it at some point in time. I don't know that number, but if someone wanted to find out, I'm betting some news articles in the downtown library would reveal that information.

By the way, I remember the old First National Bank Building and I also remember the implosion of it. It was pretty tricky because only about 25 feet separated it from the Gulf States Building and another 25 feet separated it from the Davis Building by the old Four Way Street.

[moopinator]

very interesting info. thanks, john! :)