DTD | Arts District: Hall Arts Tower (Lone Star site) (~50 ST.)

[Tnekster]

Again? Don't remember her running before.

[honestruerealman]

It will happen. It isn't a matter of whether there is a need for office space or for residences. The Art's district is hot and it will get even hotter in that it is booming right across the freeway also. This is a long term investment and there will probably be many more along this new main street.

[940]

I did my best to count the floors on the model- and actually came up with 47 which is the same number that has already been posted. Perhaps the angle makes it look taller than it really is- but does appear to be 47 stories...


It does appear to be 47 stories even though it looks as tall as Chase Tower, if not taller. Someone mentioned 750 feet earlier..give or take...maybe the condos will be like some of the new luxury buildings in other cities where ceiling heights reach to 15 or 16 feet...in any case, I'm keeping my fingers crossed on this one. Unlike Debbie Downer, I think it has a good chance of being built b/c there will come a time when anyone and everyone will want to live in the Arts District once it gets going.

[txRNGr]

Any updates on this?

[CTroyMathis]

(The Museum Tower (Brook Partners' Arts District Tower site) thread is split off from this thread again.)

[CTroyMathis]

Quick hack job I just did using that photo of the model of the tower and green glass' aerial that had selected projects highlighted and labeled.

Here's a fairly representative look at what the tower could look like in the skyline if. . .

http://img391.imageshack.us/img391/6725/greengrasstroyedit1jpgversion0.jpg

[Tnekster]

Wow, that looks cool.

[DallasStar]

That is cool. Thanks for the pics.

[txRNGr]

The Woodall Rodgers Park in that rendering looks awesome! I really hope they incorporate alot of trees in the park.

[clipper]

I was looking at that Lone Star site today. Craig Hall really ought to be hauled to court and sued because of the way that mess looks. Here we are about to spend more than $350 million on the new performance venues and the arts high school redo and that eye sore mess with spraypainted walls and trash is there on Flora Street. Right next door they've spent millons on the new cathedral spires which look down on his junk yard. If he isn't going to build something there it looks like city code folks would make him completely enclose and maintain that trash. Really a disgrace for the Arts District with our landmark symphony hall right across the street. At the same time he's donating money to fund new arts venues in Collin County. Shame.

[DFW]

Craig Hall better hurry up or there will not be enough condos to go by with a possibility of a Trump Tower on the way as well.
Oh, the tower looks good superimposed with rest of the skyline but I do think it is not tall enough, according to the model it is taller then Chase Tower.

[FoUTASportscaster]

Hall seems to really be dropping the ball on this. Does he have to do condos there? Why not rentable lofts or apartments? Surely something could be done. Just do something...anything. To me it doen't have to 47 stories. Anything 12 and up is fine with me. Just do something here.

[clipper]

Hall paid $10.5 million for that Lone Star property and two other vacant locations along Ross in 1995. Since then he's done absolutely nothing with the Lone Star tract - it just sits there crumbling and getting covered with more spray paint. If I did that with a partially completed structure in my front yard the city would red tag it and take me to court. Yet no one at city hall seems bothered by this mess and the impression it gives of our "booming" arts district. Maybe Angela Hunt will read this and take interest. It's a blight on her district.

[gc]

^ word.

[EscapeToCity]

Each time I drive by the 'Lone Star' site I think about the fact that Hall Financial has poured millions into the office complex and that elaborate 'Sculpture Park' out in Frisco yet they allow this site to further deteriorate.

And Clipper, you are quite correct-- if you had that kind of junk in your yard, the City would be all over you. Different strokes, however...

[boozo]

Hall paid $10.5 million for that Lone Star property and two other vacant locations along Ross in 1995. Since then he's done absolutely nothing with the Lone Star tract - it just sits there crumbling and getting covered with more spray paint. If I did that with a partially completed structure in my front yard the city would red tag it and take me to court. Yet no one at city hall seems bothered by this mess and the impression it gives of our "booming" arts district. Maybe Angela Hunt will read this and take interest. It's a blight on her district.

Any citizen can call 311 and make an anonymous complaint. They will get back to you with an answer if you want.

GO for It!

[frankchitown]

After looking at the skyline picture I don't really like the placement of this tower. It looks misplaced, like a huge wall blocking the view of downtown for much of the arts district. I want to see a new skyscraper built more than anyone, but I think that location should have something much less bulky. This tower would look much better beside the Chase tower.

[sogod]

Well, begars cant be choosers.

[clipper]

"Stonehenge on Ross" looked even more dreary this morning. Maybe a few colored balloons or some bright bunting would cheer things up. Or maybe they need to either build something or knock all that mess down and plant some grass.

[gc]

"Stonehenge on Ross" looked even more dreary this morning. Maybe a few colored balloons or some bright bunting would cheer things up. Or maybe they need to either build something or knock all that mess down and plant some grass.


I love it...."Stonehenge on Ross"

[clipper]

Indeed, maybe a few Druids would add to the atmosphere. Throw some ox blood about and light a few fires, too.

[Columbus Civil]

At the very least we would get some trees out of the deal.

[crescentboi]

This is a view that you don't often see....looking towards Ross and Pearl from the NE corner of Lone Star.

[gc]

Cool. Hopefully that view will disappear in the coming years.

[Aeneas515]

Now is the time to capitalize Mr. Hunt. Now is the time ...

[FoUTASportscaster]

I don't trust Mr. Hunt to do anything positive for Dallas, unless it benefits him first.

[Tnekster]

^He and his wife volunteer at the homeless shelter. Isn't that something positive?

[FoUTASportscaster]

Well as long as he is doing something with the money he has been able to swindle from Dallas.

[Rob]

For someone who's relatively new to the area - is there a short version of what it is exactly that he did that constituted swindling?

[FoUTASportscaster]

Back in the 70's, if the city built reunion arena, and gave Mr. Hunt tax breaks for building reunion tower, there was a huge promise of more developments that would make that area a huge entertainment district. The city complide and built reunion arena and gave him a tax break. He built the tower and didn't do everything else he promised.

He also owns lot E, which was basically a parking lot for the arena. It is of no use to him and a huge use to the city, as it is right next to the convention center. He hasn't done much to help the city, and has actually seemed to go out of his way to be a thorn.

The most recent transgression came in late Oct, early Nov when the city gave 7-11 a tax abatement to build their HQ in downtown. Their HQ would be mixed-use with first floor retail and upper level residential. It would really help the 24 hour vibe they are going for. So Hunt was going to build his HQ in downtown anyway, but when 7-11 got an abatement, he sought one too. He gave empty threats, as later documents would show, of a potential move to Las Colinas if he didn't get the abatement. He planned to be in DTD no matter what, but used dirty tactics to get tax breaks.

There's more. A new one has surfaced and I suggest you pick up the latest Dallas Observer for that, as I am not as versed and studied on this one.

[Boredkid]

What about blockbuster who wants tax abatements to keep leasing space, why not attack them too? At least he is building a new building.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

Very good synopsis. Dallas has let him off the hook too many times. It amazes me how quickly people jump to conclusions and think that everything that comes out of Laura Miller's mouth is false. She warned us about Hunt, she tried to get us to remember history, but no, we fell for the sales pitch and excuses once again.

Borekid, maybe you should read this

http://www.dallasobserver.com/Issues/2006-02-16/news/schutze.html

[1999McKinneyAve]

I dont think that link is working

[Rob]

It worked for me - thanks for posting it. It was a good read.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

I dont think that link is working

Looks like their server is dead, get DB Error: connect failed off their DN. 100% loss when 66.235.245.150 was pinged. They will probably reset it Monday.

[Tnekster]

For someone who's relatively new to the area - is there a short version of what it is exactly that he did that constituted swindling?

If you really want to know Mr Hunt I suggest you spend some time getting to know him and talk with people that actually know him instead of those that rely on information from a publication like the observer. There are always two sides to every story so if you believe what you are reading here you are selling yourself short. They have no idea and don't care what Mr Hunt or any other member of the Hunt family has done for Dallas but if you could take every penny this family has given to Dallas away this would be much less of the city it is today.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

I care about the truth Tnek. You explain why he didnt finish Reunion. this thread has officially been hijacked. Their is a big difference between Ray and Lamar.

[Tnekster]

Hunt preaches cooperation, gets a quarrel
Executive's latest plans for downtown development inflame battle with Miller
11:40 AM CDT on Sunday, October 23, 2005
By SUDEEP REDDY / The Dallas Morning News

Over lunch in his office high above Dallas, Ray Hunt is steadfastly refusing to be drawn into a very public spat over downtown redevelopment involving his company and Mayor Laura Miller.

When it comes to Ms. Miller, who last week said Hunt Consolidated Inc. is engaging in a "stickup game with a toy gun," Mr. Hunt won't take a reporter's bait, won't go tit for tat with her.

Ray Hunt is known for wielding his influence effectively and discreetly.


Finally, after deflecting questions about Ms. Miller and her provocative remarks, Mr. Hunt, 62, offers a somewhat oblique discourse on civility in public debate. The lessons he's lived and worked by for decades he learned in kindergarten. And Dallas, he says, would be a better place if others followed them, too:

"Tell the truth. Don't fight in the halls. Do your homework."

An energy executive and leader in Dallas business, Mr. Hunt is a member of multinational corporations' boards and a friend to U.S. presidents, and he's known for wielding his influence effectively and discreetly.

Still, he has been in this territory before. Three decades ago, Mr. Hunt, a legendary oil magnate's son and a man who carefully protects his privacy, found himself in the spotlight over the same downtown venture.

A young Ray Hunt launched a plan for revitalizing a blighted corner of downtown in a joint effort with the city, a controversial project marked by suggestions of preferential treatment.

The result was the Reunion complex, a gleaming hotel accented by a dandelion-like tower with a revolving restaurant, which became a signature of Dallas' skyline.

This month, Ms. Miller attempted to block $6.3 million in tax breaks that Hunt Consolidated sought for its new downtown headquarters. She also renewed her charge that the original Reunion deal shortchanged Dallas residents.

The mayor lost a major round last week when the City Council approved the tax abatement. But a bigger battle over a downtown land swap and the future of Reunion Arena is now set to play out.

Many of Ms. Miller's City Council colleagues see her campaign as part of a long-running feud against Mr. Hunt that began a decade ago in her days as a columnist for the Dallas Observer. At the time, Ms. Miller characterized Mr. Hunt as greedy and egotistical, part of an elite cadre of wealthy "goons" who have taken advantage of the city through tax breaks and public land deals.

Ms. Miller maintains that her latest battle with Mr. Hunt is not personal. "I think he's a very shrewd businessman," she said. "But the taxpayers have a right to know how much money they are asked to give Hunt and what they're going to get for it in return."

She vows to continue challenging the merits of that deal and Mr. Hunt's actions then and now.

In a rare interview last week, Mr. Hunt said his only interest is for Dallas to grow and thrive.

"What I would hope is that Dallas would not lose the characteristics that have made it the great city that it is," he said. "And one of those great characteristics is that there is a close and positive working relationship between the public sector and the private sector."

Mr. Hunt's personal history tracks Dallas' transformation into an international commercial hub over the last half-century: as the son of H.L. Hunt, an oil giant who was once the richest American; as a real estate developer guiding how the modern city took shape; as an oilman who took his family's Texas enterprise into unexplored frontiers across the globe; and as a philanthropist who insists that many of his largest contributions to local institutions remain anonymous.

His net worth is estimated at more than $2 billion, a fortune so vast that he hardly needs to go to work every day.

Still, he said, he tries to carry out a larger purpose. Picking at a turkey sandwich on white bread, he said his position in life and role in the world are the result of little more than a "cosmic accident."

"Any one of us could have ended up being born in some disease-infested, war-torn territory of the world," he said in his soft voice.

"But I'm here. So being here, what do you do? You can be biblical about it and go bury your talents in the back yard. Or you can try to take the cosmic accident and help make the world in our own little way a better place. As corny as that sounds, that's what I believe."



The family business


The story of the Hunts, one of America's most scrutinized extended families, is inextricably linked with the narrative of entrepreneurship in the 20th-century oil business.

After years of failures, a nearly bankrupt Haroldson Lafayette Hunt Jr. learned of wildcatter Columbus M. "Dad" Joiner drilling the Daisy Bradford No. 3 in East Texas. It struck oil, and H.L. Hunt quickly realized its value. He bought that and other leases to capitalize on what was then the world's biggest oil discovery, one that transformed Texas and the industry.

The elder Hunt had three overlapping families with 15 children. Ray Hunt was the youngest son, the one who became executor of his father's will in 1974 and the head of Hunt Oil Co.

Some family members pursued the oil business, while others made their mark elsewhere. Two of Mr. Hunt's half-brothers, Bunker and Herbert, made big oil discoveries and then garnered widespread notoriety – and government action – trying to corner the silver and soybean markets in the 1970s and early '80s. Half-brother Lamar founded the Kansas City Chiefs football team and pursued other sports interests. Half-sister Caroline Rose Hunt founded Rosewood Hotels and Resorts, developer of The Mansion on Turtle Creek, Hotel Crescent Court and other luxury hotels. Sister Swanee served as ambassador to Austria during the Clinton administration.

H.L.'s oldest son and Ray's half-brother, H.L. "Hassie" Hunt III, was a successful oilman who was plagued by mental instability that worsened as he grew older. On the advice of doctors, the elder H.L. Hunt authorized what was then a popular procedure: a prefrontal lobotomy. Hassie Hunt died this year.

Ray Hunt, H.L.'s youngest son, wasted no time in learning the family business, working in Hunt Oil's fields in the summer of 1958. And by the time he graduated from Southern Methodist University seven years later, he had bought tracts of land in Dallas, the beginnings of his real estate business.

Some of his earliest lessons about civic involvement came from Erik Jonsson, the Texas Instruments Inc. executive who was mayor of Dallas from 1964 to 1971.

On Saturdays, the mayor met with a group of young people, including Mr. Hunt, to discuss civic affairs.

Mr. Jonsson and other TI leaders, Mr. Hunt said, carried forth a message of a social contract: If the city had helped them, "you should pay back, and you should do something good for the city."

Other small groups would later form, giving Mr. Hunt an opportunity to learn from an economics professor and leading business people, and to participate in discussions on Saturday evenings.

Interest in the civic debate ultimately led Mr. Hunt to become lead investor in D magazine in the early 1970s. Dallas was changing, and Mr. Hunt gathered backers for a publication to cover an increasingly sophisticated city, founder Wick Allison said.

The magazine faced intense pressure for its coverage of what was then Dallas' business establishment. One day, Mr. Hunt and Mr. Allison were summoned by the head of First National Bank and told how the magazine should conduct itself.

Mr. Hunt was unfazed.

"We walked out of that lecture, and Ray said, 'See you later,' " Mr. Allison said. "We went off and kept doing the magazine the same way we had been doing it. ... Ray didn't pay any attention to it. Ray's his own man."

After H.L. Hunt's death, pieces of the empire were distributed among members of the family. Ray Hunt took control of Hunt Oil, expanding its focus from Texas to prospects overseas. The first big international discovery came in 1976 in the North Sea's Beatrice field, a site that had been written off by others. The find would define how Hunt Oil operated, prospecting in places most explorers had passed over. A huge discovery in North Yemen in 1984 cemented the company's role as a leading independent oil producer.

Over the next two decades, Hunt Oil expanded to every continent but Antarctica. Without a single Ph.D. on staff, Mr. Hunt said, the company has employees doing things they never envisioned. From Peru to the Ukraine, their projects offer an opportunity to advance struggling nations and transform societies. The result for Mr. Hunt: "enormous psychological warmth."

"If this company was the Hunt Shrimp Co., with the same balance sheet, same financial circumstance ... I would have a lot less interest in doing what I do day to day," Mr. Hunt said. But in the oil and gas industry, "you can have a positive impact on an entire society, on literally millions of people, and they may never know that you had that effect."

Not everyone agrees with Mr. Hunt's positive assessment of the company's business. Amazon Watch, an environmental and human rights group, calls the Peruvian Camisea Gas Project, in which Hunt Oil is a major investor, "the most damaging project in the Amazon Basin." The group charges that the massive natural gas extraction and pipeline project (which also involves Halliburton Co., on whose board Mr. Hunt sits) threatens both the Peruvian rain forest and the indigenous people who live there.

A Hunt spokeswoman says the most controversial elements of the Camisea project are operated by another company, while the work directed by Hunt Oil has "an excellent health and safety record."



An atypical tycoon


Mr. Hunt is also a member of the boards of Electronic Data Systems and PepsiCo and chairman of the Federal Reserve Bank of Dallas. He is close with the Bush family, serving as a campaign volunteer and major contributor to both presidents and as an advisory board member in both administrations. One of Mr. Hunt's chief associates, James Oberwetter, is ambassador to Saudi Arabia.

In spite of his influence, Mr. Hunt is known for maintaining a low profile.

"The way you think of a tycoon is just the opposite of Ray," said Dallas philanthropist Ruth Altshuler. "He's strong but just soft-spoken."

Mr. Hunt's friends say he is the most unassuming person they know, a man who seeks to live a normal life, visiting with his five adult children and eight grandchildren.

Last weekend, he and his wife, Nancy, walked into the Angelika Film Center in Plano to watch Good Night, and Good Luck, the movie about broadcaster Edward R. Murrow and the McCarthy era.

He likes to sit down for dinner unrecognized and enjoys going out for "a good old greasy hamburger," said his friend Pat Summerall, the sports broadcaster. "We're still looking for the best hamburger in Dallas," Mr. Summerall said.

Often, they'll discuss politics and world affairs, especially events in the Middle East. They'll recount their reactions to the Sept. 11 terrorist attacks and how Mr. Summerall was seven blocks from the World Trade Center while Mr. Hunt's plane was grounded in Canada. Sometimes, Mr. Hunt just asks the sports expert about the Dallas Cowboys and the NFL, about the U.S. Open and other tennis events.

Whether at dinner or in meetings, friends say, Mr. Hunt exhibits an analytical and philosophical nature.

Through the Dallas Medical Resource, a nonprofit group, Mr. Hunt has spent years pursuing greater health care funding for North Texas' poor.

He has lobbied the lieutenant governor and other state officials personally for health care funds. When one of Mr. Hunt's recent efforts succeeded, Dallas was set to get special treatment over other Texas cities. So Mr. Hunt went back to the state, insisting that there would be no agreement until every city got the same deal, said Margaret Jordan, the group's president.

Former Dallas Mayor Ron Kirk said Mr. Hunt would fall on anyone's list of the five most important business leaders in the city. Mr. Hunt was among a select group of business people whom Mr. Kirk said he could trust and consult for honest advice.

That reputation was built as Mr. Hunt developed into a civic impresario over two decades, leading the Dallas Citizens Council, the North Texas Commission and numerous boards and committees. He also became a strong backer of mayoral candidates such as Steve Bartlett and Mr. Kirk.

Hunt contributions have flowed into the Austin Street Centre for three decades, and Mr. and Mrs. Hunt make regular trips to spend time with the homeless people inside the Dallas shelter.

"They don't make a big deal about their faith, but they put their faith in action, and that's something that a lot of people just don't do," said the Rev. Bubba Dailey, executive director.

After a football cheating scandal in the 1980s marred his alma mater, SMU, Mr. Hunt took charge in restructuring the board and recruiting a new president to restore its reputation.

Mr. Hunt has consistently participated in the university's most important projects, from capital campaigns to the recent effort to attract George W. Bush's presidential library, said SMU President Gerald Turner.

Despite the many millions of dollars in contributions, not a single building at the school – not even a bench – bears his name.

"He will do what he can behind the scenes and really only come out front when necessary," Mr. Turner said.



The Reunion deal


By 1972, the scion of the Hunt oil family had compiled a portfolio of real estate investments and decided he'd become a developer.

Mr. Hunt received a call – someone had looked him up in the phone book – to gauge his interest in a weed-infested, run-down piece of property in the southwest corner of downtown Dallas.

"The price was a low price for very understandable reasons," Mr. Hunt said. "That property had every problem known to man."

Newspaper headlines were warning of the death of downtown Dallas, of a continued loss of development to suburbs that would only worsen.

But Mr. Hunt picked up the land. Months later, he called City Manager George Schrader for the first time.

Mr. Hunt had a simple proposal: He wanted the city's help cleaning up the unwanted land. The discussions morphed into broader planning discussions for the area.

Mr. Schrader presented big-picture marching orders: Ignore the property lines and come up with a land plan for the area. If everyone liked it, they'd work out the financial details later.

"He was up to his eyeballs in this," said John Scovell, president and chief executive of Woodbine Development Corp., whom Mr. Hunt hired to lead the project. "It was an important project with a lot of profile for Ray Hunt."

A Hunt-funded and city-approved planning project led to a complex land swap and joint development effort. The agreement was approved by the City Council in February 1974, drawing national attention as a unique public-private partnership. Reunion Tower and the Hyatt Regency Hotel opened four years later. Reunion Arena was completed in 1980.

"People thought we were crazy when they first heard of this," Mr. Hunt said. "But the things that really worked for us were things that nobody else was interested in at the time."

The lesson from one of his earliest business deals would later define his oil company's strategy. Rather than be pitted against each other, public and private entities should cooperate.

"Dallas is the only major American city that has no reason to exist where it exists," Mr. Hunt said, reciting a lesson he learned from Mr. Jonsson, the former mayor. "It's because it did things at different times that you wouldn't find in any other city. And those things caused the city to grow."

But if the Reunion project exemplifies the best of public-private partnerships to Mr. Hunt, to Ms. Miller it was just another "sweetheart deal."

The Hunt deal with the city envisioned – but did not require – additional land uses, including a shopping center and office buildings. The 1980s real estate crash halted new development in the city. Mr. Hunt also owns air rights in the area and a 100-year lease on part of Union Station at $100 a year.

As an Observer columnist, Ms. Miller accused "dimwitted" city staff members of giving away the store and accused Mr. Hunt of "shortsightedness and self-absorption." Asked last week about one reference – "Earth to Hunt: Be like a Bass (as in Fort Worth) and donate your sorry-ass parking lot, pal" – she said: "I don't talk like that anymore. At least not publicly."

Ms. Miller said she simply wants a "thoughtful review" of Mr. Hunt's original deal and what it has meant for the city.

"If I were him, I'd be doing exactly what he's doing – being a sharp business person," Ms. Miller said. "Too bad City Hall can't have sharp business people, too."

One complex deal under discussion today involves a swap of a Hunt-owned parking lot – Lot E – for city-owned Reunion Arena. The proposal envisions a new entertainment complex by another developer and Hunt tearing down Reunion Arena in three years.

In 1998, when discussions were under way for a similar swap over a new downtown sports arena, Mr. Kirk, then the mayor, received a proposal like one Mr. Hunt had been given a quarter-century earlier: "I will help you in any way that I can to do what's best for the city," Mr. Kirk recalls Mr. Hunt telling him. "You go make a decision on what that is first. Then we will negotiate with you in good faith."

That same year, Mr. Hunt was drawn into the public eye when his company received a $2.9 million abatement to expand the Hyatt hotel. He attended a City Council meeting to publicly address the facts surrounding that first effort.

Mr. Hunt said the original Reunion deal was based on a close, trusting relationship between the public and private sectors, one that created a ripple effect with new development and new convention business. "To create that opportunity didn't cost the city one dollar," he said.

Today, what might appear as a billionaire's pursuit of a few million dollars in tax breaks on a $120 million building is, to Mr. Hunt, a battle for larger principles of fairness.

His aides and friends put it this way: A long-standing, respected corporation shouldn't get a worse deal than everybody else.

The city offered $9.3 million in incentives to retain the headquarters of 7-Eleven Inc., a company that also shaped Dallas over the century, in a deal that Ms. Miller backed.

"Most businessmen believe a deal, to be a good deal, has to be a win-win on both sides," said David Biegler, an energy executive and Dallas civic leader. "Ray Hunt is one who believes that strongly."

Mr. Hunt is interested in his own company doing high-quality projects, but beyond that, he says, it's not his place to determine the future of downtown Dallas.

"What made Dallas great were things that typically were not predictable," he said. "Why is it that Dallas exists? It's because at certain critical points in time, we had leaders – elected leaders – who had vision."

E-mail sreddy@dallasnews.com

[Mephis Gooseberry]

Please tell me something I didnt already know. Nice spin control in that very heartwarming article. Do you know the story of the Reunion Viaduct Parking Garage and how it relates to this picture?

[clipper]

Yes, the Hunt's promised to build a shopping center and all kinds of stuff at Reunion if only the city would help fund the deal. Of course, none of that came to pass. That's why there were so many skeptics about Victory. But the Perots have made good on their promise.

[Tnekster]

The garage was supposed to have a hotel or office tower on top of it that never got built. However, this was the 80's and millions of square feet of space downtown was never completed. If this had been built out it would have added to an already glutted situation downtown.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

Who built the garage? Who paid for it? The city of Dallas taxpayer paid for it. That garage was built because Woodbine needed more parking so that they could build the towers in the picture I posted. The taxpayer mitigated the expense of developing the Reunion land by building a garage that was not needed. Dallasites got stuck with the bill. This is the part everyone leaves out of the positive spin articles. Woodbine (Ray Hunt) has done nothing with the land for the last 26 years.

[Tnekster]

I don't know, you need someone with a historical perspective that goes back that far. Insidetheloop would probably know.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

Yes, historical perspective is my rant. Yes, I agree with you, there are two sides to every story, I prefer the middle version myself. Hunt has a history here, it isn't the rosy wonderman version your article suggests and its not the bloodsucking scum version the Observer implies. The truth lies somewhere in the middle, but based on the history I know from following Hunt, Crow and Perot over the last 30 years, I know which ones I trust and which one I don't.

[Tnekster]

Yes, historical perspective is my rant. Yes, I agree with you, there are two sides to every story, I prefer the middle version myself.

I agree with that completely.

[Mephis Gooseberry]

Very interesting debate, thanks for the dialogue.

[FoUTASportscaster]

What about blockbuster who wants tax abatements to keep leasing space, why not attack them too? At least he is building a new building.


He was going to anyway, regardless of a tax abatement, as later documnets would show. He used dirty tactics of stating that he would go to Las Colinas and that was proven false. He threatened to leave, when he wasn't, to flease the city of of its deserved tax money.

Did Blockbuster get their abatement, not to my knowledge. Do they deserve it, no.

[FoUTASportscaster]

My problem with both articles is simple. Do you really expect Hunt to come out and say I screwed the city? No. However in that same article, our mayor stated she understands why he is doing that, it makes smart buisness sense. Yet you don't hear Mr. Hunt saying anything along the lines of he sees why the mayor is against it. He says, well they gave 7-11 one, I deserve it too. That's horse crap.

[msutton]

anyway we can move all this hunt talk into another thread?

[FoUTASportscaster]

I was thinking about a suggestion to the admistators about moving this to issues.